Posted on Jul 10, 2016
Do you personally know a police officer who arrested someone because of race? If so, what happened?
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Curious if anyone has witnessed race being the primary reason someone was unjustly detained or arrested. I have witnessed people getting arrested in many situations, but typically it involves the person breaking the law and then doubling down by being disrespectful and in general a jerk.
Police
Politics
Government
Ethnicity
Racism
Edited >1 y ago
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 67
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I never arrested anyone because of their race and I never saw anyone else do it. However at least 90% of the minority offenders that I arrested or saw arrested claimed that was the reason.
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SPC (Join to see)
I posted that because it shows how these men were targeted and placed in jail unjustly. The stats of these arrest go towards the ones that have a negative affect on African Americans. It shows that police systems can be corrupt. 1000 innocent men should raise alarm but I bet you never heard about this story.
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SPC Randy Torgerson
SPC (Join to see) - My only question about your article is, that this seems like a pretty big story... when I did a google search no main stream media lists this information or has investigated it. In fact only a dozen media outlets I've never heard of just re-wrote the story. Which means only one no-named media source has brought this to light.... I'm not disbelieving of the story exactly, because it happened in LA back in the 90's. But it was a big international story then.
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SPC Randy Torgerson
SPC (Join to see) - Your right, which on face value is strange. You would think this kind of story would fall right in line with the media outlets.....
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I was a Trooper during the 70s,80s and the beginning of the 1990s and I can tell you that I never stopped, ticketed or arrested anyone because of their race. Hell, I wasn't prejudice at all. Everyone was fair game and everyone was treated the same. Now there were a few exceptions and those were the people that did not know enough to keep their freaking mouth shut. You know what I mean! lol To those people I had a saying and it had nothing to do with race. FEA!
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PFC Jeffrey Hochman
MSG (Join to see) -
What you may not understand and many cops don't always articulate it well is Behavioral Pattern Recognition or BPR. Many people be they minorities or not get stopped because of signals and triggers they unwittingly give out. The cop may say "well he was acting suspicious". As a supervisor in a large urban department "New orleans police" I used to make my officers tell me what they meant? Eventually they would articulate the subject appears to be scanning the area in an irregular manner as if conducting countersurveillance Or they would describe the subject was favoring a leg or a side or grabbing a pocket. Possibly hiding a gun or drugs. So there is very rarely racism involved in a stop. It's god police work and just needs articulation as to the what's and whys.
What you may not understand and many cops don't always articulate it well is Behavioral Pattern Recognition or BPR. Many people be they minorities or not get stopped because of signals and triggers they unwittingly give out. The cop may say "well he was acting suspicious". As a supervisor in a large urban department "New orleans police" I used to make my officers tell me what they meant? Eventually they would articulate the subject appears to be scanning the area in an irregular manner as if conducting countersurveillance Or they would describe the subject was favoring a leg or a side or grabbing a pocket. Possibly hiding a gun or drugs. So there is very rarely racism involved in a stop. It's god police work and just needs articulation as to the what's and whys.
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MSG (Join to see)
PFC Jeffrey Hochman - No one is perfect and don't get me wrong my Sister-in law and my cousin are both police officers in Philadelphia and I probably would have gone into law enforcement if I didn't decide to go active duty. I have the utmost respect for officers and what they do. I realize that there are a lot of "instinct" stops that result in good police work. For every 100 good police officers there's that one who ruins it for everyone.
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PFC Kevin Adrian
I have never personally known an officer who did this. To the opposite I have seen the opposite happen. I have seen officers disrespected, spat on and two of them who were like family to my wife and I were gunned down. It absolutely makes me sick to see these groups trying to say they are being singled out fron the crowd. This black lives matter crap irritates me to no end. My great grand mother died in Dachau and they have never seen the oppression and violence like the Jewish people have for thousands of years You've do not hear us whining or saying we are owed something for nothing. I have been shot, stabbed and beaten half to death for being a Jew so I do have a dog in this fight. I support the brothers and sisters in blue . May G-d bless and protect them all.
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Unless an officer tells you it's because of race or he's using racial slurs towards you, you're only guessing. However, I have been stopped (only once) and perceived it was because of race in White Settlement Texas where the Armory (duty station) was located. Driving home around 2130hrs in my truck that has 22 inch rims on it, a cop made a u-turn and drove behind me for about 30 seconds then I was pulled over. The officer asked for my license and where was I coming from. I asked him why was I pulled over and he replied, "Your license plate light is dim." I then tell him that I have a CHL and my 45 is on the right side of my hip and my license is in my back right pocket. He removes his weapon and tells me not to touch my weapon but to slowly grab my wallet and hand him both licenses. I do so very slowly. He checks for warrants and returns with my licenses and said everything was clear have a nice night. I wait for him to depart and get out to check my license plate light of course and was shocked to see nothing wrong with my license plate. Was the stop because of a suspicious vehicle? As an Active Duty Soldier, I drove the same route every day and some nights for eight years and have not been stopped again and have not changed the light bulb.
Race? Just my perception. However, I thank God for law enforcement officers across the country. Heck, my dad was a cop. You're going to have some cops who shouldn't be cops just as we have Soldiers who shouldn't be Soldiers. Cops who fail to follow the rules, regulations, guidelines, policies, etc., should be charged just as Soldiers who violate the UCMJ are charged. -Just my two pennies
Race? Just my perception. However, I thank God for law enforcement officers across the country. Heck, my dad was a cop. You're going to have some cops who shouldn't be cops just as we have Soldiers who shouldn't be Soldiers. Cops who fail to follow the rules, regulations, guidelines, policies, etc., should be charged just as Soldiers who violate the UCMJ are charged. -Just my two pennies
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CPT (Join to see)
Sounds like you reacted properly. Must have been tense.
I actually had a dark tinted Lexus with wheels and was followed on many occasions. I always look at it as the police are active and suspect this helps the general public. I could not be a police officer with life, late shifts, cameras in my face, disrespectful people and stressfull encounters. Nevermore the situations when a person assults them.
I actually had a dark tinted Lexus with wheels and was followed on many occasions. I always look at it as the police are active and suspect this helps the general public. I could not be a police officer with life, late shifts, cameras in my face, disrespectful people and stressfull encounters. Nevermore the situations when a person assults them.
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PO1 David Swift
My son at one time had long hair and a beard while in college he got stopped all the time by police because they said he looked out of place. The one thing I have always told him was to answer all questions and say yes and no sir
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SPC Randy Torgerson
Thats not a bad story at all..... but I'm not sure he could have known what your race was late at night. When I was on the job and it was dark out side, I could almost never tell who I was pulling over even if it was a man or a woman. But still sounds like he did everything correct. And thank you for your service.
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Sgt Ramon Nacanaynay
Misunderstandings are easy. Understanding is difficult, frustrating, requires feed-back, . . .
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To be honest, this question doesn't make much sense because there is no cop in America (regardless of their color)that is going to tell you or admit that they arrested someone based on their "color". Its just not going to happen....
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SSG Robert Webster
SSG Michael LeGrand Good point about an LEO not admitting that they have done something wrong or contrary to the spirit of the law. But the question does make sense.
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CPL Darren Davis
In a lot of ways you are correct its when they dont realize a lot of us Half Breeds (to be blunt) are not white or the race of the local authorities they make stupid comments I.E. well what reservation did you get that car from
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SPC Randy Torgerson
CPL Darren Davis - Do we really want to take this conversation to who makes jokes about race? Because I've never met anyone who hasn't told a race joke....
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SPC Randy Torgerson
The question is not asking for police officers if they have arrested anyone due to race. Its do you personally know someone who has done so. Which to me the word "Personally" is very important. It doesn't mean have you seen someone being arrested and you "think" the officer is arresting only because of race. It means do you know someone that you have spoken to personally who has admitted or it is inferred that he did so.... Idk, its just my interpretation of the question. According to this list serve every cop is a raciest, I just don't like it and its not true.
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Unjustly detained yes, arrested NO; personally know or knew the officer - NO. The incidents were isolated, however I have personally seen it more than once. And complaining about it does not work, unless you are one of the politically correct and connected individuals. i.e. Got Money.
Actually some of you may have actually seen these actions and cheered them on when it is called profiling, when it is done for the right reasons and in a more or less legal manner, it is not as insidious as it can be when placed into action by poorly trained LEOs. In its worst form it is called stereotyping.
But what bothers me the most is when the LEO lies to your face about the reason for the stop/detention, and there is very little that most people can do about the situation. This is another reason that dash cams and body cams are more and more being demanded that police forces are outfitted with them.
Actually some of you may have actually seen these actions and cheered them on when it is called profiling, when it is done for the right reasons and in a more or less legal manner, it is not as insidious as it can be when placed into action by poorly trained LEOs. In its worst form it is called stereotyping.
But what bothers me the most is when the LEO lies to your face about the reason for the stop/detention, and there is very little that most people can do about the situation. This is another reason that dash cams and body cams are more and more being demanded that police forces are outfitted with them.
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SSG Robert Webster
SPC Randy Torgerson - My home is located in a low crime neighborhood, where burglaries are almost non existent. The transit area (Interstate corridor) happens to be approximately 15 miles from my neighborhood. On top of that there had been at the time a number of profiling incidents in the city as a whole, specifically Hispanics. The city actually stated that they were not profiling Hispanics, but by friends at ICE told me otherwise. Another item is that most of the burglary related crime is committed by whites in this general area. On top of that, if it was because of burglaries or theft in the area, when I went to the police sub-station, and they told me that, I probably would not have been so pissed off. It is a communication problem and not from my side either.
There is such a thing as probably cause. And did you read my entire statement, about the same time that this occurred that an annual class about Racial Profiling became mandatory in my state for Law Enforcement Officers?
There is such a thing as probably cause. And did you read my entire statement, about the same time that this occurred that an annual class about Racial Profiling became mandatory in my state for Law Enforcement Officers?
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SPC Randy Torgerson
SSG Robert Webster - I did read everything you said. I also gave you an example of what it could be, not what it was. There maybe other reasons unknown to either you or I at this time. But with out answers why do you, me or anyone else just assume its a race thing? Maybe the cop didn't like the car she was driving... We don't know and starting rumors and making claims can detract from real issues.
I mean this is how bad it is..... In every news story about race, everyone came to the conclusion that the shooting or services turned away or whatever the reason for something bad happening, it must be racism. Yet the Dallas police killing has multiple statements and evidence that this killer was raciest, targeted white people, no body is talking about racism except that some people have sympathy for the killer...!!! the world is upside down and we're on "bizarro" world....
I mean this is how bad it is..... In every news story about race, everyone came to the conclusion that the shooting or services turned away or whatever the reason for something bad happening, it must be racism. Yet the Dallas police killing has multiple statements and evidence that this killer was raciest, targeted white people, no body is talking about racism except that some people have sympathy for the killer...!!! the world is upside down and we're on "bizarro" world....
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SPC Randy Torgerson
SPC Dawud Makonnen, I'm commenting here because SPC Dawud Makonnen has blocked me on his post. He is telling me to find something else to do instead of poking holes in his story. Well ladies and gentlemen, what does that tell you? Instead of everyone just believing these raciest stories, start asking a few questions and you just might find out who the real raciest are.. And this is extra sad because many of the stories are probably real. This is a sad day :(
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SPC Randy Torgerson
MSG Alberto Rodriguez, Please don't anyone else post on SPC Dawud Makonnen thread. He has denied me the right to respond to his comments. Now, MSG Rodriguez, what you say about me is back at you. You think I'm not paying attention or that I don't believe there are raciest cops making stops based on race. Yet you say and the statistics say, less than 1/10th of 1% of the police are bad. Does it happen? sure it does. But its not the epidemic that you claim. Thats a fact, period.
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I've had a few minor incidents in NY & Oakland, CA where my brother and I were stopped by police because we're black. I've also had good experiences as well. However there are times as a black man pulled over by white cops and they walk to the car with hand on gun, and in some cases they're already irritated and cooperating doesn't defuse the situation. It's very very tense.
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SPC Dawud Makonnen
SPC Randy Torgerson - Here's a question for you what white officer pulls you over and says "I'm pulling you over and harassing you cuz you're a nigger! Grow up man. Find something else to do with your life besides trying to find holes in my story.
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MSG Alberto Rodriguez
SPC Randy Torgerson - Look, I firmly believe that 99% of police officers are honest, honorable, and perform their duties by the letter of the law. However, you cannot sit here and dispute the fact that there have been traffic stops all over the country because of race. I'm not pulling that statement out of my six; go and research the many investigations at the state and federal level that have shown that many police jurisdictions have used institutionalized racial profiling during traffic stops, fact! The reason this problem is not going to go away any time soon is folks like yourself, who want to deny that a problem exist, instead of looking at it without pre disposed biases. I always tell my Soldiers, I don't give a crap where you're from or what color you are under that uniform if you come to me with a grievance, I will do everything within my authority to find out the facts, and if substantiated, I will make every possible effort to find a solution.
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SGM Steve Wettstein
SPC Dawud Makonnen - He has his hand on his weapon not to check to see if it was on safe but for officer safety. Meaning he/she is able to draw their weapon quicker if their hand is on the butt quicker than if it was not. Pretty much all LEOs do this especially if there is more than one occupant in the vehicle.
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Sgt Dee Watts
I've been pulled over more times than I care to admit. I can't remember any where the cop didn't have his hand on top of his gun. I'm not black, so maybe he was doing it because I'm 6'5" or maybe because of my short haircut. I mean, it clearly can't be that this is pretty much procedure. There has to be some kind of oppressive reason, right?
SMH
SMH
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I know a lot of Police and they have two classifications for people and color has nothing to do with it.
People are either assholes or they are not.
If you are not an asshole, when a police officer is arresting you, you cooperate.
If you are an asshole, when a police officer is arresting you, you fight.
If you fight a police officer when you are being arrested, you are telling that officer that you intend to kill the officer. Seriously. Do you think the officer is going to quit arresting you and apologize?
The only way you don't get arrested is to beat the officer which means you kicked their ass to the point they couldn't fight any more or you killed them. The thing to understand about that is, the police training is "escalation of force" and the police officer will kill you if they need to so that they don't lose. At that point it isn't about being a police officer, they just want to live, they just want to go home at the end of the day.
If you try to kill me, I will surely try to kill you back. It is only fair.
Easy solution, don't be an asshole.
People are either assholes or they are not.
If you are not an asshole, when a police officer is arresting you, you cooperate.
If you are an asshole, when a police officer is arresting you, you fight.
If you fight a police officer when you are being arrested, you are telling that officer that you intend to kill the officer. Seriously. Do you think the officer is going to quit arresting you and apologize?
The only way you don't get arrested is to beat the officer which means you kicked their ass to the point they couldn't fight any more or you killed them. The thing to understand about that is, the police training is "escalation of force" and the police officer will kill you if they need to so that they don't lose. At that point it isn't about being a police officer, they just want to live, they just want to go home at the end of the day.
If you try to kill me, I will surely try to kill you back. It is only fair.
Easy solution, don't be an asshole.
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SPC Donald Moore
SP5 Christine Conley - I don't know what you are doing wrong, but I would say that if you are running into police, you are in the wrong place at the wrong time doing the wrong thing.
I am only 47, so not that much experience, but I can count on one hand (with fingers left over) the number of "encounters" I have had with police that were more than a speeding ticket.
I am only 47, so not that much experience, but I can count on one hand (with fingers left over) the number of "encounters" I have had with police that were more than a speeding ticket.
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SPC Randy Torgerson
SP5 Christine Conley - I think you should be more clear in your post, what are all the wrong things? What does buying coffee mean? Lots of people go 10, 20, 30 years then get a few tickets.... its a common thing. Are you suggesting your getting tickets because your married to someone black?
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SPC Randy Torgerson
SP5 Christine Conley - I would yes, I totally agree. George Zimmerman had the worst case of that happening.
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I have been a victim and also witness folks being stopped for no apparent reason. Most of the situations turned out ok, but the reason we were stopped was never made known to us. It bothers me that folks don't believe that these things happen, much more frequently than reported. SO in my mind that is part of the problem is folks think we are lying when we tell these stories and most times I don't not relay these types of stories to Non-African Americans. Also I believe just like with Sexual Assault if ALL of US spoke out more we could stop or at least limit some of the cases. If we all stand up together and speak up against injustice, then we could stop the madness. In any of these cases we don't even seem to get all the facts, so I can only speak from my own experiences. I have been stopped More times than I can count, and in most of the cases for unknown reasons. So please Folks, LISTEN and have some empathy and if you see something that is wrong SAY something, so we can fix this. There are plenty of GREAT/GOOD cops out there, weed at the bad ones. I want my sons and grandsons to ARRIVE back home ALive....
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SPC Randy Torgerson
MSgt Walter Thomason - Yes I can think of a reason. I was a cop staring in the mid 1980's. When I first started we were taught that we can shoot a fleeing felon, armed or not. It was just a few years later that the laws were changed so that only under extreme circumstances such as the fleeing felon had just murdered someone or the fleeing felon was believed that he intends to kill someone. But we better be able to articulate that thought. It doesn't have to be a race issue to shoot a suspect, it can be extremely poor judgment / training. As you can see that doesn't really happen anymore. Actually it did happen just this past year (I can't remember where) and I believe the officer was indicted.
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MSgt Walter Thomason
It is true that a felony was committed, however, most REASONABLE people, as I said before, wouldn't yell racial slurs before shooting someone. Especially when the other person is unarmed, at no time threatened the officer or any other nor the public. So you have to look at the cause as poor judgement? Was it a bad day? Was the officer involved in the foot chase and had no other options? Was there lack of support from other officers? No on all counts. A bad day should never come into play when using deadly force. Also, something racist wouldn't come out unless the feelings were already there and no for the rest of the questions. All you've stated was justification for shooting a fleeing felon, you didn't address the full issue. Had the officer shot without the racial slurs then I would have no cause to conclude it was racist in nature. Believe my conclusion would be the same if the vicitm was White and the Officer Black.
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SMSgt Lawrence McCarter
i would agree most Officers don't display and express racial slurs but One that does within a neighboring Police Department did. (He is now retired) I've seen members of the public actually use great restraint not to respond to this i had no respect for that Officer Myself nor did any of our Officers. If i had been present where any incident arose its not Him I would support. There are people that shouldn't be Police Officers and this man was one of them. Officers like Him do exist but I'm thankful to say very few of them. I've always found most people respond like human being if the are treated as human beings. There are exceptions of course, some that You will have a problem with no matter what You do. One of those We were arresting was calling both of us Prejudice F--- ing honkeys. ".Neither of us called Him any names. I've been called everything You can think of, Pig, oinker, cracker, been assaulted, spit on, etc. still kept control and they were arrested, just added charges on and let the Court deal with it. Thats their job not mine, I just make the report. the arrest in each case with the majority of us was for cause, there is nothing to gain by picking out some that isn't doing anything.
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Yes, myself riding through a town one day during a late evening the streets lights were on, I hadn't turn on my headlights yet, because I could still see very well. A Patrol car stopped me, the officer wouldn't get out of his patrol car, just parked behind me with blue lights on, and we sit and sit, finally I walked back to the patrol car and ask the officer what did he stop me for, the officer stated "boy" I can't let you drive that car like that. I gave him my driver's license and registration and ask him again and he stated again "boy" I can let you drive that car like that. The next thing he called back up, four officers surrounded me. These officer had no charges to charge me with so, his back up officers started talking real hateful towards me, to engage me into a fight. I stopped talking and were handcuffed and placed into the back of a patrol car, when I got to the jail the jailers on staff still tried to aggravate me into fighting them I refused. The magistrate came in about (90) minutes later the officers talked with him, so they came up with a bogus charge of improper equipment, in which every thing on the car were working perfectly. Now, no court date were given, it were only that I had to plead guilty to a bogus charge to have my freedom back, Are spend the next (20) days in jail with no bond. And to pay for my car being stored. There are to many incidents of racism so I will stop here, it bothers me each time I think of them.
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Almost impossible to answer unless the officer says so. Just because a officer is white and acts rude some may think the officer was being racist; when in fact that is just their personality across the board.
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CPT (Join to see)
You are spot on, never mind the fact that they might have just left a brawl or had an issue with his second homicide of the day. Tough job with political pressure and constant cameras in the face.
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MSgt Hal Weeden, MBA
SP5 Christine Conley - It would be nice to have de-escalation time between calls. Unfortunately, manning levels and call volume usually do not permit such luxuries. For instance, just yesterday I had to notify a lady that her husband had been killed in a helicopter crash in another state. Although not nearly as traumatic for me as it was for that poor widow, it was still a pretty stressful event for me. I would have liked a few minutes to collect myself afterwards; however, as soon as I got back in my cruiser, I found myself headed towards a fatal motorcycle crash.
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MSgt Hal Weeden, MBA
SP5 Christine Conley - That is a very insightful observation on your part. It's only in the past 10 years or so that I've realized the effect it's had on me. I have been an EMT, firefighter, and/or law enforcement officer for 36 years. Most of that has been part-time volunteer work, but since I retired from the Air Force it has been full-time. I certainly have a more spiritual outlook. I haw seen WAY too many things happen and miracles occur to NOT be more spiritual.
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SMSgt Lawrence McCarter
MSgt Weeden, I've had to make some of those Death notifications Myself, one of the hardest things I've ever had to do. its pretty hard no to feel their yourself when You see the reactions and I'm always thinking of My own family when I've done that and How I'd feel. I think often of one where the family had just arrived home from visiting their son and future daughter in law when after they saw them both were killed by a drunk driver who struck their vehicle.
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