Dual Military
Dual Military
Posted on Oct 19, 2021
Can a dual military couple be Rater and Senior Rater to an NCO?
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I.E. can SFC Husband be senior Rater and SSG Wife be the rater for SGT Jones?
I know what I would do t'were I the 1SG... but....
I'm in a unit with 3 dual military couples. Two are SFC, the rest are SGTs and SSGs. I can imagine the mess it is to draft a rating scheme. An issue was recently brought to me as an EOL asking if this would be an inappropriate relationship or conflict of interest of some sort. I looked in AR 635-5, AR 600-20, and DA PAM 600-35 and I couldn't find anything specific. AR 635-5 just says that a lack of objectivity can be found during a commander's inquiry. There are 50 Soldiers in my company, most are NCOs only three SFCs.
Anyone have any thoughts on this? Thank you, in advance.
I know what I would do t'were I the 1SG... but....
I'm in a unit with 3 dual military couples. Two are SFC, the rest are SGTs and SSGs. I can imagine the mess it is to draft a rating scheme. An issue was recently brought to me as an EOL asking if this would be an inappropriate relationship or conflict of interest of some sort. I looked in AR 635-5, AR 600-20, and DA PAM 600-35 and I couldn't find anything specific. AR 635-5 just says that a lack of objectivity can be found during a commander's inquiry. There are 50 Soldiers in my company, most are NCOs only three SFCs.
Anyone have any thoughts on this? Thank you, in advance.
NCOER
Equal Opportunity (EO)
Dual Military
Posted 3 y ago
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Generally speaking if SSG Jones is the rater and SFC Jones is the senior rater, that means that SFC Jones is SSG Jones' rater. Which is a big no go. Not because SFC and SSG Jones are senior rater and rater, but because spouse is rating spouse.
That is a MAJOR no go in fraternization rules, and should never be allowed to happen .
That is a MAJOR no go in fraternization rules, and should never be allowed to happen .
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SFC Casey O'Mally
(Also, most SFCs rate very few, if any NCOs. SSG squad /section leader rates, LT PL senior rates. PSGs are not in the Chain of Command.)
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SSG Keith Evans
SFC, That's exactly how it's supposed to be IAW 623-3. Thankfully, that's not the case in this circumstance. In units I've been assigned, the rating scheme winds up with some raters and senior raters not in the same section, NCO Support Channel, or CoC. Why? I never really got a good answer for that.
Thank you for your response, at least I know I'm not the only one who is think along these lines.
Thank you for your response, at least I know I'm not the only one who is think along these lines.
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I will assume you are in an Army Band at a MACOM. It is unavoidable to have dual military assigned, while not optimal, it is a fact. There is wrangling to be sone with rating schemes which is generally overseen by the Commander and SGM. The Commander for the band is almost always rated by the COS and Reviewed by the Deputy Commander. There is a lot of oversight. The likelihood that things are not tracked and approved is slim to none. Anyway, don’t put the cart before the horse. See how it plays out.
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SSG Keith Evans
CSM, spot on assessment. I gathering intel because I was asked an interesting question, which may be brought up at the next meeting. There are actually one or to folks asking "well, is it specifically prohibited by regulation?" Specifically because they're probably wrangling to make things work, as you said. I just think it's a real bad idea and was looking for something concrete.
Thank you for taking the time to respond, I appreciate it.
Thank you for taking the time to respond, I appreciate it.
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LTC Jason Mackay
SSG Keith Evans - this is a great time for the G1 SGM to shine and keep the command out of trouble. Every fiber of body tells me this is not kosher, but I was unable to find a regulatory support for that position in AR 623-3, DA PAM 623-3 nor AR 600-20
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MAJ Ronnie Reams
The one thing that I notice about the Army Band is that there are a heap of SGMs. They wear 19th Century rank, so notice how many 3 stripes with 3 arcs there are.
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CSM Darieus ZaGara
I get it. Having been a CSM and observing the Band, it is more common than you might think. There are only so many Soldiers and Bands. They get promoted rather quickly and if married there is nowhere to send one or the other. Bands members are. It authorized to work in other MOS. They usually supplement Tactical security during training or deployments. Generally manning the entrance to the TOC checking IDs etc. anyway, it can be precarious, they get a lot of oversight. LTC Jason Mackay
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It would be best if spouses were not in each other's chain of command--potential negative impact on good order and discipline. That may be difficult in a small unit. Despite all attempts to avoid the situation your describe, it may be necessary to allow this rating scheme. If all the players are able to keep their objectivity, then it should work out. However, the first time a rated soldier believes he or she has been unfairly rated by either the rater or senior rater, then a whole can of administrative worms will be opened. I wouldn't want to be the commander of this unit.
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