Posted on Apr 13, 2016
Should the saying "every Marine a rifleman" be changed?
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A commonly thrown around term is "Every Marine is a rifleman" I strongly disagree with this statement as I am an 0311 Rifleman. I do agree that every Marine is expected to know how to shoot and qual annually with a rifle. Doesn't mean they're a rifleman. What does everyone else think?
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Marines
Political Correctness
Marines Political Correctness
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 201
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The term was true when it was founded and it's true today.
Non-infantry Marines are still called on regularly to serve as riflemen during combat operations. I know the Marines assigned to the 3rd MAW Band were a bit surprised when they arrived in Iraq and were immediately assigned to perimeter defense and convoy security operations.
They didn’t complain, they did their job, and they did it well. Not as well as you or your compatriots would have, but they did it anyway. By serving as riflemen in ‘rear area’ positions (as if there was a rear area in Al Anbar) they freed up enough infantry Marines to take Fallujah.
Every Marine is a rifleman. Not all riflemen are equal.
Non-infantry Marines are still called on regularly to serve as riflemen during combat operations. I know the Marines assigned to the 3rd MAW Band were a bit surprised when they arrived in Iraq and were immediately assigned to perimeter defense and convoy security operations.
They didn’t complain, they did their job, and they did it well. Not as well as you or your compatriots would have, but they did it anyway. By serving as riflemen in ‘rear area’ positions (as if there was a rear area in Al Anbar) they freed up enough infantry Marines to take Fallujah.
Every Marine is a rifleman. Not all riflemen are equal.
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CSM Clifford Fargason
GySgt Dawson Webb - Maybe you are a bit jealous that the largest amphibious landing was performed primarily by the Army (there were a few Marines involved in the ETO). And while the Army is usually the occupation force, they are also involved in the business of destroying the enemy. Along with all the Army divisions in Europe, there were also 26 Army Divisions serving in the Pacific alongside the six Marine Divisions.
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LCDR (Join to see)
LTC George Morgan - I seem to recall something called the Geneva Convention to which the U.S. is a cosigner, makes it illegal for medics to use weapons (other than a side arm perhaps for personal protection and protection of the wounded). Medical personnel all had RED CROSSES imprinted on the identification cards they carried, at least in my tenure. That red cross identified them as medics. To carry out military combat related duties would violate the Geneva Convention.
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LTC George Morgan
Thank you Lt. Cdr., Hardy for your observations. However, you should know that during WWII an RAMC Fld. Amb. were an-niellated by the Japanese. Since that time the Convention permitted Medical personnel the use of arms for the protection of self, patients and stores came about, and a side arm was initiated. As to the use of the side arm, it soon became obvious that this level of weapon was inadequate and the use of 9mm Arms was permitted. It must be obvious to all that a pistol is no defense against 303 attack 7.62 during my time with medics packing the 9mm SMG. Sadly, during the N. Ireland troubles. it became obvious that an even greater degree of fire power was defensively necessary. Never-the-less, the mantra of 'protection of self, patients and stores,' prevails.
PS: The name "Hardy' is notably honourable ever since The Battle of Trafalgar." I see that the Naval association prevails!.
PS: The name "Hardy' is notably honourable ever since The Battle of Trafalgar." I see that the Naval association prevails!.
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Brother, though I understand your pride as an 0311, we as Marines are are set apart from other service branches because all Marines attend the School of Infantry for 28 days of "basic" infantry training at either Marine Combat Training Battalion (MCT) or Infantry Training Battalion (ITB).
As a former 8513/0913 Marine Combat Instructor at School of Infanty (West) who served at all levels of training, I can 100% confirm that every Marine is taught and then practically applies the skills of an 03xx during the initial 28 day period. As a 0311, or 0321, 0331, 0341, 0351, you receive advanced MOS specific infantry training that earns the MOS you choose, just as non-infantry Marines go to MOS specific training to earn their MOS. But the foundational infantry training received all Marines after recruit training allows for better communication and understanding on the battlefields our Marine Corps has and will fight on yesterday, today, and tomorrow. That said, "every Marine a (basic) Rifleman" takes nothing away from you as a "advanced" Rifleman (0311), because in the end you are at the tip of the spear, and every Marines' effort on the battlefield is there to support your outcomes. Semper Fi, Brother!!
As a former 8513/0913 Marine Combat Instructor at School of Infanty (West) who served at all levels of training, I can 100% confirm that every Marine is taught and then practically applies the skills of an 03xx during the initial 28 day period. As a 0311, or 0321, 0331, 0341, 0351, you receive advanced MOS specific infantry training that earns the MOS you choose, just as non-infantry Marines go to MOS specific training to earn their MOS. But the foundational infantry training received all Marines after recruit training allows for better communication and understanding on the battlefields our Marine Corps has and will fight on yesterday, today, and tomorrow. That said, "every Marine a (basic) Rifleman" takes nothing away from you as a "advanced" Rifleman (0311), because in the end you are at the tip of the spear, and every Marines' effort on the battlefield is there to support your outcomes. Semper Fi, Brother!!
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A1C George Montford
I went on active duty USAF wite three years Army ROTC, 1 year Army NG, and was
surprised at the complete lack of almost no infantry training, A week or so basic field training, fired a wore out 30 cal. carbine on a 1000 inch range under inept supervision. This was supposedly a military unit. I think all military personell should be trained to some sort of defensive level with basic weapons. I suppose security people were. I was the only person in my imediate unit familaure with any weapon above the 30 cal. m1 carbine.
This was in the mid 50's. ( my darn spell checker failed).
G C Montford former a/2c
surprised at the complete lack of almost no infantry training, A week or so basic field training, fired a wore out 30 cal. carbine on a 1000 inch range under inept supervision. This was supposedly a military unit. I think all military personell should be trained to some sort of defensive level with basic weapons. I suppose security people were. I was the only person in my imediate unit familaure with any weapon above the 30 cal. m1 carbine.
This was in the mid 50's. ( my darn spell checker failed).
G C Montford former a/2c
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SGT Randall Smith
CPL Joseph Elinger - : I was a Leg. Big deal. I was at Ft. Bragg in 1966 and in week two of airborne training I left. I could not jump off the tower. My brother on the other hand loved it. He even went Special Forces.
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Sgt Jmeans M
SGT Gabriel Brown - They are first trained as a Rifleman, First this is embedded from day one, now some POGS are just that but when the Shit hits itthey drop the stapler and go on patrol or where needed.
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Sgt Russ Brayton
Read about Wake Island where a bunch of office POGs with pilot officers leading them held off the Japanese Imperial Navy for 21 days. If memory serves me correct, they sunk a destroyer and damaged at least two more ships. Not only is every Marine a rifleman, but knows how to fight when the time comes.
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No. I was an 03 and I understand your frustration and am very familiar with this line of thought, but the truth is that the Marine Corps is different from the other branches. I remember a story that illustrates my point perfectly about a VMF deployed in Afghanistan that had Taliban break through the wire and literally walk into the TOC and start shooting. The pilots and air wingers grabbed their gear, rallied together and pushed them back and out of the compound before holding security until the QRF arrived.
The point is that the Marine Corps is a very small branch, and is designed to operated independently as an expeditionary fighting force. This philosophy means that Marines are going to be out in the bush, often alone, and still expected to accomplish the mission. And if it comes down to it, the cook is just another gun in the fight. A less refined one albeit, but still at the very least 4 degrees of a 360.
Good question though. Keep asking questions and learning bro. There's a wealth of knowledge on here and it isn't often you get to have private conversations about stuff like this with Colonels and Majors. Semper yut kill.
The point is that the Marine Corps is a very small branch, and is designed to operated independently as an expeditionary fighting force. This philosophy means that Marines are going to be out in the bush, often alone, and still expected to accomplish the mission. And if it comes down to it, the cook is just another gun in the fight. A less refined one albeit, but still at the very least 4 degrees of a 360.
Good question though. Keep asking questions and learning bro. There's a wealth of knowledge on here and it isn't often you get to have private conversations about stuff like this with Colonels and Majors. Semper yut kill.
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LtCol Daniel Daly
Great comment Cpl Westbrook, could an "Expeditionary" A-10 Squadron do that? Highly unlikely given the fact that the Air Force conducts 0 infantry training across all occupation fields in their induction pipeline.
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SFC (Join to see)
LtCol Daniel Daly - Not quite Colonel, Air Force Security Police, Air Base Ground Defence units train continually in infantry tactics. Security Police Units are divided into Police and Air Base ground defense. I was in the 445 military airlift wing from 1982 to 1994. Before that, I was a Marine from 65 to 69 including A Vietnam tour. Because the Air Force has so much money, and we were motivated, we had some great training. I finished my military career with 9 more years in the Army National Guard in an infantry company. Knowing we were going to get activated and deployed we trained our asses off, but of course did not have the money the USAF had.
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Richard Alty
The aircraft maintainers of 211 MAS would disagree with you. When Camp Bastion was attacked in 2012 they fought (and fought well) as infantry until the RAF Regiment rapid response team was able to arrive from the far side of the base.
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