No indictment for NY Cop choke hold death. Right call? More riots?

SFC (Join to see) , this isn't a black vs white issue. This is a criminal vs law enforcement issue. It may be convenient and popular to point to Eric Gardener's race as a scapegoat, but reality is he is violation of the law. NO ONE is disputing that. The police did their job to stop and arrest him for his crime regardless of what it is. He pinned down the way he was resisting detention and big dude. Considerably larger than the officer. I heard the media say the chokehold was illegal, and for that I believed the officer was responsible for his death. However, MAJ (Join to see) provided a detailed and reasonable explanation as to how/why the media was wrong about the hold being illegal. I disagree that most police would innocent people to enforce the law; I believe most and can prove with statistics that do their jobs and never kill innocent people. While I acknowledge a few innocent get killed, collateral damage is just reality when criminals and terrorists. Some innocent people get killed by our military, that doesn't make willful/ intentional vigilantes. Whether Black, White, Yellow, or Red, people just need to stop breaking the law and blaming their color. Comply with the police and you'll likely live thru the process

FINAL NOTE: "So until the Police stop acting as JUDGE, JURY AND EXECUTIONERS when it comes to Black people, go preach to somebody else. "
I understand your passion for the issue, and I applaud you speaking your mind. That being said, this quote can be conceived as a disrespectful. As a service member, an NCO telling a field grade officer to preach else to somebody is unprofessional. Let's not travel down this rabbit hole.

SFC Michael Jackson , I was going to leave this topic alone but you used "collateral damage " to refer to people killed by policemen. I find that troubling . First and foremost , I am not here to disrespect anyone , be they Officers or Senior NCOs, but I take exception to people trying to justify police brutality . The streets of American cities are not war zones . Also not all people who were bullied in school and became serial murderers did so in one random mass shooting , some do so over years protected by a uniform and a badge . With that said , there are good cops out and I applaud them. My former OIC is one of them .

SFC (Join to see) , just because it troubling doesn't mean it isn't true. What I find troubling is putting the police on the defense instead of the criminals. Noone disputes the criminals was breaking the law or that they resisted arrest. yet, we blame the law enforcement when they get killed. no doubt, police brutality in some cases, is a problem. That doesn't mean these cases areexamples of said police brutality. one could argue that would all be alive if they cooperated w/ the cops. im not here justifying brutality, but debating whether it is brutality. i think its a ridicious and insulting position to insist that officers and senior NCOs are okay or encourage police brutality. furthermore, suggesting these people need to quit running from the police. common sense tells us when you run, bad things happen including the possibility of being killed. In the military community, we hold individuals accountable for the actions instead of blaming society, the system, upbringing, the dog, anyone/anything else like the civilian populist.
on a side note, some of the streets in places like southside Chicago, East St Louis, south Dallas, and Miami are just as bad if not worse than some war zones. However, its off topic and no point to it.

All excellent points, SFC Michael Jackson. It astonishes me that someone CHOOSES to risk HIS OWN LIFE by failing to obey the lawful orders of the police, looses his life due to the avoidable risk, and there are people who think that's the fault of the police.

No it doesn't mean the police are always right. But you only have ONE life. If you are stupid enough to risk it, maybe it's for the best if you lose it, hopefully before you breed and pass on your faulty genes.

The problem is that we only get a snippet of the information. Please remember this: Many times, very violent encounters occur from a insignificant police encounter.

Examples (just 3 of very, very many tragedies)

On June 17, 2004, three Birmingham police officers were shot and killed. Officers Carlos Owen, Harvey Chisolm and Robert Bennett were attempting to serve a misdemeanor warrant. They had stopped him on the street, and interviewed and released him. They discovered he had a misdemeanor warrant and went to the residence that he walked to. They were shot in the entry of the house by Kerry Spencer and Nathaniel Woods. A MISDEMEANOR. Oh, a fourth officer was also shot, but survived.

On Oct 23, 2006, Fairfield, Alabama, Officer Mary Smith was shot and killed while checking on a suspicious vehicle on Avenue H. Officer Smith had detained one subject and had placed him against the hood of her patrol car when another subject approached and opened fire on her.
One round struck her in the chest, just above her vest, fatally wounding her. A second officer who arrived on the scene moments later was shot in the leg.

On September 30, 2006, Montgomery Police Officer Keith Houts succumbed to a gunshot wound inflicted two days earlier while making a traffic stop on North Decatur Street, just a few blocks from police headquarters, at 12:45 pm. After shooting Officer Houts in the head, the killer shot him several times in the chest as he laid on the ground, but the shots were all stopped by his vest. Officer Houts was transported to Jackson Hospital where he remained in critical condition until succumbing to his wounds. The killer fled the area and was captured in McDonough, Georgia, by members of the United States Marshals Service. He was immediately extradited back to Montgomery and charged with capital murder. He was subsequently sentenced to death.

These are just 3 quick examples of "routine" contacts with people that wound up fatal for the officers.

So far in 2014, 58 officers have been murdered on the streets. This is by gunfire, assault and vehicular assault. There are more, but it would take in depth reading to determine if the deaths were felonious.

Also, remember, that someone's non-compliance with the law usually begins well before police contact. Officers cannot simply say "Oh, Mr Jones, I see that you do not want to be arrested, therefore you are free to go". They/we do have to be held accountable, but, the actions are to be judged by the "reasonable person standard". What would a reasonable person do.

not place a cholkhold on someone to deprive them of breathing

why do you think they use that technique,maybe in the hopes that you stop struggling perhaps hehehehehe roflmao yes i think that is the answer...

SFC Drake,

Don't resist and the cops and a the police will not have to restrain you. The people who actually SAW the evidence did not file charges.

Hold or no hold, had the individual been compliant with the LEOs, he'd still be alive.

To address the chokehold issue:

choke·hold

a tight grip around a person's neck, used to restrain him or her by restricting breathing. -google definition

a method of holding someone by putting your arm around the person's neck with enough pressure to make breathing difficult or impossible -Merriam Webster's Dictionary

a restraining hold, as when one person encircles the neck of another from behind in a viselike grip with the arm. -Dictionary.com

NYPD Patrol Guide States: "Members of the New York City Police Department will NOT use chokeholds. A chokehold shall include, but is not limited to, any pressure to the throat or windpipe, which may prevent or hinder breathing or reduce intake of air."

The officer used a technique specifically banned by the department. By definition, it is a chokehold.

In any case, he should be dismissed from the NYPD because he will not be prosecuted for it.

The reason he will go unpunished is because of legal loopholes police fall into, given that they have no "duty of care". Because the police officers are not bound under "duty of care" they will never be indicted for situations like this, because the "duty of care" is essential in establishing a case for manslaughter. Criminally negligent manslaughter occurs where there is an omission to act when there is a duty to do so, or a failure to perform a duty owed, which leads to a death. The existence of the duty is essential because the law does not impose criminal liability for a failure to act unless a specific duty is owed to the victim. Police don't have a duty to the victim, thus, they are not criminaly liable. So if a cop shoots a suspect, they can watch the suspect bleed out and die with no fear of recourse. They can chase down a suspect and watch them die from whatever the problem may be.

I don't think it is the right call, because its garbage that cops can kill without recourse, simply by not rendering aid when their actions have caused a condition leading to death. However, legally speaking, it was the right call not to indict the officer.

SFC Jerry Crouch that is your opinion.

The officer was not indicted for the very reason i specified. Police officers do not have duty of care, thus, they cannot be held criminally liable for deaths resulting from their actions. This is not my opinion, it is the law.

However, I think he will be heavily disciplined or dismissed from the force. I also think that the NYPD will settle out of court for a large sum of money, or lose in court for an even larger sum of money when a civil suit is brought against them.
That, is my opinion.