Posted on Jun 18, 2020
Can a Soldier be ordered to shave their mustache?
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I'm currently deployed and we are getting a visit from our Brigade Commander. We were told if we have mustaches, we must shave them. AR670-1 states (b) Facial hair. Males will keep their face clean-shaven when in uniform, or in civilian clothes on duty. Mustaches are permitted. If worn, males will keep mustaches neatly trimmed, tapered, and tidy. Mustaches will not present a chopped off or bushy appearance, and no portion of the mustache will cover the upper lip line, extend sideways beyond a vertical line drawn upward from the corners of the mouth (see lines C and D of fig 3–1), or extend above a parallel line at the lowest portion of the nose (see line B of fig 3–1). Handlebar mustaches, goatees, and beards are not authorized. If appropriate medical authority allows beard growth, the maximum length authorized for medical treatment must be specific. For example, “The length of the beard cannot exceed 1/4 inch” (see TB Med 287). Soldiers will keep the growth trimmed to the level specified by the appropriate medical authority, but are not authorized to shape the hair growth (examples include, but are not limited to, goatees, “Fu Manchu,” or handlebar mustaches). My understanding is mustaches are authorized so I don't understand them ordering them shaved. This is strictly for my knowledge. SFC Joe S. Davis Jr., MSM, DSL SFC James J. Palmer IV aka "JP4" LTC Stephen F. CPL Dave Hoover SGT David A. 'Cowboy' Groth SSG (Join to see) Capt Dwayne Conyers CPT Jack Durish
Facial Hair
Army Regulations
Orders
Knowledge
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 34
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Not the hill I would want to die on, they grow back. Pissing off the CO can last forever, in your service record.
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CPO Nate S.
SSG(P) (Join to see) as many have said pick your battles.
I'd say if YOU want piss off the CO, then piss him off. Its your career. Go ahead and argue you case using Army Regulations. When the CO decides to charge you with "disobedience of a written lawful order" then tell how you will fell.
A little facial hair is nothing compared to marring your record. You tell me if MCPO Roger Collins, LTC (Join to see) and others are wrong.
I once gave a CO this advice about an issue:
"Sir, it is your Courts'Martial. I am happy to witness for the defense or for the prosecution. I am suggesting a course of action that I can defend that others will also see you as being able to defend. My log book "aka medical deck log" will reflect my advice."
Low and behold, telling the CO the truth and being able to make my case was solid for the course of action I was recommending he take. But, you have to be wound real tight to do such. If you are trying to push limits, this is "...not a hill...", as Master Chief stated "...I'd be willing to die on...." There are much better causes to hang your carrier on than "facial hair".
Of course, I find spc-joshua-blotzer's and LTC (Join to see)'s commentaries able "..saluting in a known sniper zone..." and "...reflective belts..." just the tip of the iceberg of some of the same dumb things I experiences during my career. Their is a difference in Garrison stateside and areas where people do't give a damn if they cap you because you are stupid or following a stupid order out of context!
It is OK to question orders but in the proper manner. I would consider this:
- Get clean shaven for the CO.
- Then then the CO has in all likelihood a group meeting to address issues the troops may have start out by saying - "Sir, while I am clean shaven for you visit today, I have some concerns regarding how the regulation is written about grooming. Here are my concerns as an NCO and I'd like to you share your exceptions when I as an NCO am trying to do the right thing. Thank you!" Then shut up and listen.
Unless the CO is a complete idiot they will see you as respectful and will, if they are worth their salt, take a few moments to acknowledge your respect and address the issue. In this way you set many levels of example.
If you try this approach and it fails tell us, BUT, if it is successful, tell us what happened and what you learned as a result!
Anyway, just an old Navy Chief saying.................
I'd say if YOU want piss off the CO, then piss him off. Its your career. Go ahead and argue you case using Army Regulations. When the CO decides to charge you with "disobedience of a written lawful order" then tell how you will fell.
A little facial hair is nothing compared to marring your record. You tell me if MCPO Roger Collins, LTC (Join to see) and others are wrong.
I once gave a CO this advice about an issue:
"Sir, it is your Courts'Martial. I am happy to witness for the defense or for the prosecution. I am suggesting a course of action that I can defend that others will also see you as being able to defend. My log book "aka medical deck log" will reflect my advice."
Low and behold, telling the CO the truth and being able to make my case was solid for the course of action I was recommending he take. But, you have to be wound real tight to do such. If you are trying to push limits, this is "...not a hill...", as Master Chief stated "...I'd be willing to die on...." There are much better causes to hang your carrier on than "facial hair".
Of course, I find spc-joshua-blotzer's and LTC (Join to see)'s commentaries able "..saluting in a known sniper zone..." and "...reflective belts..." just the tip of the iceberg of some of the same dumb things I experiences during my career. Their is a difference in Garrison stateside and areas where people do't give a damn if they cap you because you are stupid or following a stupid order out of context!
It is OK to question orders but in the proper manner. I would consider this:
- Get clean shaven for the CO.
- Then then the CO has in all likelihood a group meeting to address issues the troops may have start out by saying - "Sir, while I am clean shaven for you visit today, I have some concerns regarding how the regulation is written about grooming. Here are my concerns as an NCO and I'd like to you share your exceptions when I as an NCO am trying to do the right thing. Thank you!" Then shut up and listen.
Unless the CO is a complete idiot they will see you as respectful and will, if they are worth their salt, take a few moments to acknowledge your respect and address the issue. In this way you set many levels of example.
If you try this approach and it fails tell us, BUT, if it is successful, tell us what happened and what you learned as a result!
Anyway, just an old Navy Chief saying.................
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pick your battles.... they can't force you to shave it but they can make your life miserable if you don't.
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SPC Miles Blackman
I would show the 1SGT or the CSM the Reg and ask them to tell the CDR to respectfully go to hell. When I went to Basic I was told that if we had a mustache we could keep it, but if not we were not allowed to grow one until after we completed our training.
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MSgt Michael Lane
Exactly, picking your battles is one of the most important skill sets one can obtain in the military. Before you start making waves you better be damn sure it's something you can't get over, if you pick a fight because you got your feelings hurt with the wrong guy it can be career ending.
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