Posted on Jul 3, 2014
What would you replace M9 with? The Army is looking at .357, .40, and .45ACP
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Which of the rounds that the Army is looking at replacing the M9 with would you pick? .357 Sig, .40 S&W and .45 ACP Or would you pick something else? Why?
http://www.foxnews.com/tech/2014/07/03/army-wants-harder-hitting-pistol/
http://www.foxnews.com/tech/2014/07/03/army-wants-harder-hitting-pistol/
Equipment
Army
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 65
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H&K .45 would be my choice. I like the look and feel, but not sure how it works for all services.
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LTC (Join to see)
SMSgt (Join to see) some argue more bullets is better than more power as some cannot shoot anyway.
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SMSgt (Join to see)
As a weapons instructor, I can absofuckinglutley tell you that more ammo is better! We do not train the average Warrior (Army, Navy, Marine or Airmen) to shoot effectively. I've never seen an enemy stand there and let me pop shots at them. We need to upgrade the way we train and shoot at moving targets. Sure there are some units that are privlaged enough to go to shoot houses, but we need to be training the average Warrior the same. Just my opinion.
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Notwithstanding the money and so forth, that was not your question. Do I think we need to change the sidearm, no. But, if we were I would hands down say go back to the .45! Yes the sidearm is a "secondary" weapon, and the user obviously needs to be a good shot, if not it does not matter what caliber you are using. I have been on law enforcement ranges that are firing, 9MM, 10MM, .40 and .45 and even with double ear protection you can tell when someone was firing a .45.
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SN Jeff Phillips
.40 - even over .45 Having seen firsthand hit from .38Super, 9mm parabellum, .45acp and .40 - the .40 seemed far, far more effective.
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PO2 Larry Eslinger
45 without a doubt. Enough mass to put someone with Body armor on the ground from the impact. Plus you can dump a mag into a target in rapid fashion and keep a good grouping. 9 MM to small for Body armor, the others to much kick for sustained fire.
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If you're asking what could replace the M9 Baretta? The answer is just about anything, a sling shot would probably work better.
A better pistol would be the M&P 9 With a modified trigger. That thing is awesome.
As for caliber, I had a recent conversation with the leader of our local swat team and they are dialing back to 9mm. The found that a heavy grain hollow point 9mm+P round packs the punch of a 357MAG and they can carry 17 of them in a single mag.
food for thought.
A better pistol would be the M&P 9 With a modified trigger. That thing is awesome.
As for caliber, I had a recent conversation with the leader of our local swat team and they are dialing back to 9mm. The found that a heavy grain hollow point 9mm+P round packs the punch of a 357MAG and they can carry 17 of them in a single mag.
food for thought.
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CSM Laurence Williams
Have both a Glock 21 (.45) and Glock 23 (.40) and used both as side arms as a police officer. I like the Glock .23 for it's suitability as a concealed fire arm but believe nothing is as effective as the .45ACP for stopping power. When firing trials were conducted by the Savannah Police Department in the 90s, the department chose the Glock 21. The department restricted the trials to shooters with SMALL HANDS and limited military experience. I was totally surprised when they decided on the large frame Glock 21.
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A lot of law enforcement agencies have been running .40 cal for awhile and have switched back to 9mm because the difference in power is not enough to outweigh the need for higher capacity magazines. Personally I say don't fix what isn't broken- but for personal use I always go for 1911 .45 acp. One size does not fit all
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I'm kind of a fan of a .40 if the Army really thinks it needs to change. It's a nice compromise between 9mm and .45, in that it hits harder than 9mm, but is compact enough for a higher round count magazine than a .45 can get without the grip getting massive.
Simply adopting something besides plain old ball ammo may be a much cheaper compromise.
Simply adopting something besides plain old ball ammo may be a much cheaper compromise.
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CMSgt James Nolan
Rumor has it that the FBI ballistic folks are working on a 9mm configuration that will have the spread pattern of a .40cal, but ease of use/accuracy/speed of the 9mm which has historically been an "easier" caliber for the masses to shoot. If that is the case, then I would be voting for that 9mm. If it is not, then I would go .40 or .45 because size matters.
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SGT Richard H.
CMSgt James Nolan there are alot of those that already exist. The real trick is finding that balance between something that won't bounce off of standard body armor and something that won't pass through an unarmored target with minimal damage.
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MSG John Wirts
I always said "if it ain't broke don't fix it!" The reasons for switching from the 45 ACP to the 9mm were that many of our Allies had the 9mm, and it was easier for female troops to learn. We went to the 45 acp during the Philippine campaign against hopped up Philippine natives. After finding officers chopped up by natives who were hit six times but still killed the officer, the 45 acp was adopted. I still prefer 7 deadly rounds to 13 wounding rounds.
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.38......then .45 cal....then 9mm.....I say keep the M9 and ammo and put the money towards saving the Kiowa!
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SFC Mark Merino
CPL Jesse Still You and your loved ones shall be safe when the zombie apocalypse happens. Put me down for 1,000 shirts. You would sell them in a day with just from my friends!
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SGT (Join to see)
I want .45 ACP, but I never see it happening. Between the money to switch everything over, and the fact that most soldiers can not even shoot a M9 I never see it happening.
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SSgt (Join to see)
45 would be great and normally when you would need it, its gonna be hard to miss your target.
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SIG Sauer P226
The P226 cost less per pistol than the Beretta 92F(M9), but SIG's package price with magazines and spare parts was higher than Beretta's. The Navy SEALs, however, chose to adopt the P226 later. Only the Beretta 92F and the SIG P226 satisfactorily completed the XM9 Service Pistol Trials. Chambered for the .40 with 15 round mag for a little more punch. The XM9 Service Pistol Trials (see also Joint Service Small Arms Program) were held by the US Army in 1984 on behalf of the US armed forces.
The P226 cost less per pistol than the Beretta 92F(M9), but SIG's package price with magazines and spare parts was higher than Beretta's. The Navy SEALs, however, chose to adopt the P226 later. Only the Beretta 92F and the SIG P226 satisfactorily completed the XM9 Service Pistol Trials. Chambered for the .40 with 15 round mag for a little more punch. The XM9 Service Pistol Trials (see also Joint Service Small Arms Program) were held by the US Army in 1984 on behalf of the US armed forces.
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