Posted on Nov 11, 2015
What are your thoughts on the "Fight for $15?"
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Fast food and other service workers are uniting to demand the minimum wage be set at $15 an hour. They also want a union. What are your thoughts? The personal feelings I have are mixed. Fast food is supposed to be a starter job for most. Of course I don't live in a large city. But then again, most fast food workers I have encountered aren't the sharpest spork in the plastic wrap. What say you?
Posted 9 y ago
Responses: 130
Insanity - this isn't professional sports (which is out of control anyways)! The current market value for jobs that usually pay minimum wage - are not worth $15/hr. If this were to occur, you would see several low end/minimum wage jobs replaced by automation. Seriously, $15 to be the fry cook at a fast food restaurant? Laughable.
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LTC (Join to see)
In professional sports the BEST players get paid because the quality "labor" they provide will make the team more money. The same is true in any field, the more productive you are for the employer the more your labor is worth.
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Sure we can afford it. That is if we want inflation to match. Because these salaries, wages will be mirror such inflation.
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SSgt (Join to see)
OH and it is an expensive political trick meant to get votes. What about the people who already now make the new minimum wage? Does their pay go up relatively to the new wage scale? If not and I were them, I would be aside myself. Talk about unfair.
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As a business owner, I believe a minimum wage is for those who choose to work at a minimum standard. I have seen people with MBA's working at minimum wage jobs and in some cases, they were being over paid. I like my industry; real estate and construction. In real estate, you can elect to work hard with a plan and it will relate on how large your income will be. In construction, I bid on projects and I have a base line I will work for and if I win a bid, I have to watch the cost to insure I can meet my ROI. Many non-business owners do not realize what how small most profit margins companies work on; 5%-10% is average. So if I hire someone and pay them $15 per hour, (reality is my cost is $19.20 per hour), will they promise me that their work efforts will return a profit to me .96 per hour? If my employee can not assist me in making a profit, then there is no need to hire that person or keep them in my employ. So the question is; if I pay you $768 gross per week, will you promise me a profit of $38.40.
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CH (MAJ) (Join to see)
You're making way too much sense for those who want handouts. You're also speaking of common-sense Capitalism, which has been greatly successful when Big Government hasn't meddled too much. You and I, and many Americans not willing to trade what is right for PC's sake, need to stay on point - DON'T give up your beliefs. DON'T lose heart.
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Working poor is ultimately what the problem is. I don't want to be paying taxes to subsidize people with welfare. When you work 35+ hours per week and can still collect food stamps (this includes a junior enlisted family of 4) there is a problem. Somebody is paying. I'd rather it be the employer, who passes the cost on to me, rather than my taxes. At least that way I know what my money is being spent on.
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Take the fact that it is a fast food place out of it. FDR commented on the minimum wage as a standard for businesses to pay thier workers a living wage. $15 an hour doesn't cover rent in most urban centers, my wife is an Early Childhood Education teacher and is making $13 an hour while the VA is paying me to go baxk to school. We barely make ends meet. Unions are great for workers rights, I've not been in a fast food joint in a while but last time I was there seemed to be a lot of immigrant workers who barely spoke english, which is great since they were just starting out...but there are a ton of other people, not in fast food who aren't making that amount who should be.
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SrA Edward Vong
This is a good explanation as fast food workers are not the only ones making minimum wage, but they are only often used as an example.
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Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS
I mentioned a concept below of Self-Sufficient vs. Shared-Sufficient in a post to SrA Edward Vong. Personally I don't think "Unskilled" Labor (as opposed to your wife's situation) should necessarily fall under the Self-Sufficient category. It's really hard to justify a total compensation package at that level. Skilled Labor can EASILY justify that. It's not about the $ figure. When we talk "Living Wage" we are talking about Dependency upon others and the ability to support others ourselves.
Minimum Wage employment is just not designed for that. That said, there is absolutely a breakdown in the Market, but raising the Minimum wage is likely to exacerbate this issue as opposed to correct it.
Minimum Wage employment is just not designed for that. That said, there is absolutely a breakdown in the Market, but raising the Minimum wage is likely to exacerbate this issue as opposed to correct it.
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Raising the minimum wage would create strong incentives to automate many jobs that are low wage. We've seen it in warehouse operations (Zappos), but now it is appearing in the services industry. An article by Michael Saltsman called "The Employee of the Month Has a Battery" was published yesterday, online in the Wall Street Journal. One cannot ignore the effect this will have on workers who could be replaced by technology. I think it has more negative effects on those it is supposed to be helping than positive effects.
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SSgt George Brown
Another problem with increasing the minimum wage is it will necessarily increase the costs of doing business. Those increased costs does not equal an ability to increase the cost of the goods and services that are produced. This will have the unintended consequence of killing jobs.
The minimum wage is a talking point issue anyway. It makes some feel good about wanting to help those who are making it, but, in fact it is an entry level pay and gives some companies an incentive to justify that low pay. I believe that pay is a contractual agreement between two parties, and the government should not be telling those parties how to conduct their business.
The minimum wage is a talking point issue anyway. It makes some feel good about wanting to help those who are making it, but, in fact it is an entry level pay and gives some companies an incentive to justify that low pay. I believe that pay is a contractual agreement between two parties, and the government should not be telling those parties how to conduct their business.
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So I hear a lot of people referring to the big companies like McDonalds, Burger King and so forth on this subject. I think what a lot of people fail to realize is how it will affect the small business owners; The "Ma and Pop" restaurants, independent small town gas stations, corner stores and such. I think that the "Big companies" can afford it, that's just my opinion. They have the profit margin to cover the swing. The small business owners, however, may just be keeping their heads above water with the current minimum wage requirements. Let's say Bill has a small restaurant and employs six people. The government says, "Hey Bill, you need to start paying your employees 15 dollars an hour now" Bill says "OK, but in order to do that, I have to let three people go because I can only afford x for employee wages." Bill fires those three employees and now, those three become dependent on government support while the other three have to work longer hours to cover the loss of man power. This increase in hours means Bill has to pay more and ends up going under and loses his business. Now there are seven people depending on the government. I know, this is pretty extreem, but its not impossible. If the minimum wage must increase do it in smaller amounts over time so it doesn't become a burden on the small business owners. Or better yet, if employees think they "deserve" more, maybe they should put on their grown up pants and take it up with their boss and not depend on the government to do it for them.
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SSgt George Brown
What they also do not understand is most of McDonald's are owned by franchisee's which ARE small business owners. You cannot compare their earnings to that of the corporation. Their margins are much smaller than the corporation's earnings. They have to purchase their product at a premium, they have to purchase campaign materials when the corporation tells them to. They have to pay into the corporate advertising.
The corporation makes them purchase the land and building. The building is theirs, but they have to give the property under it to McDonalds Corp. What the corporation makes off the franchisees and what the franchisees make are two very different things.
The corporation makes them purchase the land and building. The building is theirs, but they have to give the property under it to McDonalds Corp. What the corporation makes off the franchisees and what the franchisees make are two very different things.
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Economically it will be bad for the US. The simple things will double in cost. Unions will push for double digit changes in all other areas. Even my current job would have to double. Entry level technician in this industry is 13.00 per hour. Do the math it will not work.
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A minimum wage is just that, a minimum wage. It is not meant to be a job that will provide enough resources to raise a family. It is for the person that is just starting out in the workforce. It is there to teach them responsibility, "showing up on time in a clean presentable manner". The end result if an increase in the minimum wage will be a reduction in jobs, because of automation. The minimum wage job is a stepping stone to greater opportunities. That's it.
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Experience speaks:
My wife and I owned a residential and commercial cleaning business. We started the business with $295 cash. We worked our first year (eight month, seasonal) in the residential portion, and made a whopping $4,000. Year two saw the commercial aspect begin. We hired as needed. Still a sole-proprietorship, we kept the profits (in a business account). Our rate of pay for those we hired was above the Federal and state minimum wage. At first, we hired our cleaning technicians at $12.50/hr. That left no room for raises, no room for bonuses, and very little room for profit. We scaled back to an $8.50 starting wage, and then could offer cash bonus incentives and raises. By the time we sold the business (at the beginning of year three), the business was set to profit (with no income changes) $250,000. We paid out roughly $108,000 per year in salaries, with payroll taxes almost matching dollar for dollar. We also paid worker's compensation insurance (in two states), liability insurance ($1m worth) (in two states), bonding (in two states), Christmas parties (including travel expenses and boarding for our out of state employees AND their families), birthday parties for our employees, supply costs, gas, uniforms, advertising costs, et cetera.
We sold the business with tens of thousands of dollars in the business account, our own office, a television commercial, radio ads, newspaper ads, equipment and supplies fully stocked, and no outstanding debt (credit, loans, et cetera) against the business, along with the full complement of residential and commercial clients.
Had we been forced to pay a $15 minimum wage, our business would not have survived, let alone excelled. Our employees would have had no raises to look forward to, no bonuses to earn. We probably would have had to drop our commercial accounts and more than three-quarters of our employees (making them jobless), and run a select residential-only service.
As for payroll, my wife, the sole owner of the business, made about 30% more than I did, and she was the second-highest paid employee (yes, she was an employee, as we became a corporation) in the company.
Minimum wage laws give the government control and authority over private-sector companies, and destroy the ability to produce at full capacity. We paid a fair wage, and did not expect our employees to live their lives working as house and business cleaners. We anticipated a high turn-over rate, as scrubbing toilets is not meant to last one in to retirement.
Doubling today's minimum wage by law or mandate is going to kill small businesses, and seriously damage larger ones. Do we really want to see unemployment skyrocket like that?
My wife and I owned a residential and commercial cleaning business. We started the business with $295 cash. We worked our first year (eight month, seasonal) in the residential portion, and made a whopping $4,000. Year two saw the commercial aspect begin. We hired as needed. Still a sole-proprietorship, we kept the profits (in a business account). Our rate of pay for those we hired was above the Federal and state minimum wage. At first, we hired our cleaning technicians at $12.50/hr. That left no room for raises, no room for bonuses, and very little room for profit. We scaled back to an $8.50 starting wage, and then could offer cash bonus incentives and raises. By the time we sold the business (at the beginning of year three), the business was set to profit (with no income changes) $250,000. We paid out roughly $108,000 per year in salaries, with payroll taxes almost matching dollar for dollar. We also paid worker's compensation insurance (in two states), liability insurance ($1m worth) (in two states), bonding (in two states), Christmas parties (including travel expenses and boarding for our out of state employees AND their families), birthday parties for our employees, supply costs, gas, uniforms, advertising costs, et cetera.
We sold the business with tens of thousands of dollars in the business account, our own office, a television commercial, radio ads, newspaper ads, equipment and supplies fully stocked, and no outstanding debt (credit, loans, et cetera) against the business, along with the full complement of residential and commercial clients.
Had we been forced to pay a $15 minimum wage, our business would not have survived, let alone excelled. Our employees would have had no raises to look forward to, no bonuses to earn. We probably would have had to drop our commercial accounts and more than three-quarters of our employees (making them jobless), and run a select residential-only service.
As for payroll, my wife, the sole owner of the business, made about 30% more than I did, and she was the second-highest paid employee (yes, she was an employee, as we became a corporation) in the company.
Minimum wage laws give the government control and authority over private-sector companies, and destroy the ability to produce at full capacity. We paid a fair wage, and did not expect our employees to live their lives working as house and business cleaners. We anticipated a high turn-over rate, as scrubbing toilets is not meant to last one in to retirement.
Doubling today's minimum wage by law or mandate is going to kill small businesses, and seriously damage larger ones. Do we really want to see unemployment skyrocket like that?
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