Posted on Jan 15, 2022
Leaders, What is Your Opinion on the Portrayal of CPT Sobel in Band of Brothers?
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In the WW2 mini-series, CPT Herbert Sobel (1912-1987) was depicted as a selfish a-hole who earned nothing more than hatred from his trainees. But in his defense, couldn't we say that his harshness is what hardened the men of Easy Company so that they would endure the trenches of Europe? I can't help but feel that this TV show has tarnished a man's legacy.
Toxic Leadership
Officers
Leadership Development
Posted 3 y ago
Responses: 43
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He tried to court martial one of the finest leaders in the army because he was jealous of him. He also couldn't read a map and, in one field exercise he got his entire company slaughtered by leading them into an ambush. But, yeah, other than that...
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A more interesting question is which would you rather get stuck with:
Sobel or Dike?
I suspect there is degree of dramatic latitude given when writing the scrip. How many here know that Sobel made it to LTC after the war, and ended up committing suicide. Which is as sad as any other.
The whole Sobel and Winters (when a MAJ) salute drama also never happened per Winter's words.
Sobel or Dike?
I suspect there is degree of dramatic latitude given when writing the scrip. How many here know that Sobel made it to LTC after the war, and ended up committing suicide. Which is as sad as any other.
The whole Sobel and Winters (when a MAJ) salute drama also never happened per Winter's words.
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SPC (Join to see)
Sobel's fate is not one I would wish on most, as for Dike... He can be worked around, planned around, schemed around. An inept leader can be managed by good supporting officers and NCO's, a vindictive leader can not.
Sobel was confident enough in himself that he would give competent enough orders and lead in formations and small operations even if he did make the wrong call and didn't listen to his staff.
Dike, if portrayed correctly, couldn't lead whatsoever. Sobel might have been... Well, a prick quite frankly, but he at least had the confidence to keep pushing forward whether right or wrong.
Sobel was confident enough in himself that he would give competent enough orders and lead in formations and small operations even if he did make the wrong call and didn't listen to his staff.
Dike, if portrayed correctly, couldn't lead whatsoever. Sobel might have been... Well, a prick quite frankly, but he at least had the confidence to keep pushing forward whether right or wrong.
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SFC Kelly Fuerhoff
He actually attempted suicide - and making LTC doesn't mean he was an effective leader.
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SFC Barbara Layman
Doesn't appear that LTC Sobel committed suicide -
"Sobel returned to the United States in 1945,[7] and was honorably discharged from the Army on 18 March 1946. He worked as an accountant before being recalled to active duty during the Korean War.[8] He remained in the Army National Guard, eventually retiring at the rank of lieutenant colonel.[citation needed] He later married and had three children.[9]
In 1970, Sobel shot himself in the head with a small-caliber pistol in an attempted suicide.[10] The bullet entered his left temple, passed behind his eyes, and exited the other side of his head. Both of his optic nerves were severed by the shot, leaving him blind.[10] Soon afterward, he began living at a VA assisted-living facility in Waukegan, Illinois. He died there of malnutrition on 30 September 1987.[10][11] No memorial services were held for him.[10]"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herbert_Sobel
"Sobel returned to the United States in 1945,[7] and was honorably discharged from the Army on 18 March 1946. He worked as an accountant before being recalled to active duty during the Korean War.[8] He remained in the Army National Guard, eventually retiring at the rank of lieutenant colonel.[citation needed] He later married and had three children.[9]
In 1970, Sobel shot himself in the head with a small-caliber pistol in an attempted suicide.[10] The bullet entered his left temple, passed behind his eyes, and exited the other side of his head. Both of his optic nerves were severed by the shot, leaving him blind.[10] Soon afterward, he began living at a VA assisted-living facility in Waukegan, Illinois. He died there of malnutrition on 30 September 1987.[10][11] No memorial services were held for him.[10]"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herbert_Sobel
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He was insecure and tried to comepensate withdemonstrations of unnecessarily harhness and trie to substitute domination for leadership. You can be tough and hardcore with the people you lead, but your success will be product of the respect you earn through your own integrity and, yes, humanit, towards those you lead. He had zero empahy or rapport with the men under his command.
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Toxic leadership is not uncommon in any profession. I think that Hollywood may have overstepped the role of Captain Sobel.
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There is a significant difference between an effective garrison soldier and a good combat soldier. The same is at a minimum equally true of a leader, particularly in the company grades and environment. Captain Soebel's methods of instilling discipline, both mental and physical, served Easy well, but he was not a combat leader.
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Sobel's almost OCD driven reg's sticking to is what taught his men to know the difference between an Officer, and a Commanding Officer, something that we all have seen, and had to go thru. Sobel was a Technical Officer, not a Commander, and his subsequent actions proved that.
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He DESERVES to be tarnished.
Training should be hard with the goal in mind: toughest paratroopers on the planet that WILL succeed in their mission. The 'sobels' of the world are simply cruel and do NOT train with the goal in mind. They simply are on a power trip.
Maybe they got their lunch money taken in school and now is the chance to get back (get even) at the world.
I've had a few so-called "leaders" over the years that made sobel look like a sweetheart and guess what.... If I ever run into them out here in the civilian world, I'm gonna levy some payback on 'em.
Training should be hard with the goal in mind: toughest paratroopers on the planet that WILL succeed in their mission. The 'sobels' of the world are simply cruel and do NOT train with the goal in mind. They simply are on a power trip.
Maybe they got their lunch money taken in school and now is the chance to get back (get even) at the world.
I've had a few so-called "leaders" over the years that made sobel look like a sweetheart and guess what.... If I ever run into them out here in the civilian world, I'm gonna levy some payback on 'em.
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