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As leaders, we should automatically respect our subordinates at all times. There is a stark difference between leadership and dictatorship. As soon as the leaders in the military figure this out, they will notice a peak in the retention rate of their Soldiers.
I have communicated with over 300 Soldiers who are eligible to extend their enlistment contract within the past few months and was shocked to hear the responses from some of them. One Soldier mentioned, “I would remain in the military but cannot understand why I’m getting cursed out when asked to do something. I am a grown man!” I asked this same Soldier if he’d discuss with his leaders the disrespect he feels and he said that he had spoken with them about it. My final question to him was, “So what did they say?” He replied, “They said that I am a Soldier and if I can’t handle it, get out!”
As a leader myself, I apologized to this Soldier and informed him that some leaders are called leaders because of their position or title, not because of their leadership. I then annotated in the retention book that he was not going to extend his contract but instead, leave the military because of the disrespect from his leadership.
Must a Soldier be a Chaplain to get respected? Can a Soldier who informs his or her chain of command that the speaking of profanity is against their religion be provided the same respect that a chaplain receives? Should fellow Soldiers respect these Soldiers? To me, the answer is quite simple. We should.
I am one of these Soldiers. I am a non-paid minister at a local church. The Soldiers who are aware of this duty respect the fact I am a Soldier and a minister. I've expressed to others that I would like for them to be themselves while in my presence, as I would perceive unrealism if they would change their talk, speech, or attitude just because I was standing around in the vicinity. Some disagreed but others said okay and would use profanity as if I’m not around. It didn’t then and doesn’t bother me a bit. However, there might be Soldiers that are affected by vulgar and demeaning language and I believe this should be respected.
If smoking a cigarette around a non-smoker is a sign of disrespect, I believe using profanity around a non-profanity speaker falls within the same guidelines if the Soldier speaks up. Leaders must understand that profanity can be damning to a lot of people. The “F” word has been known to cause havoc, begin fights, and unfortunately result in someone being killed. To tell a Soldier to deal with the disrespect because you're a Soldier is unacceptable.
This is not a new Army. Respect began when the Army began.
I have communicated with over 300 Soldiers who are eligible to extend their enlistment contract within the past few months and was shocked to hear the responses from some of them. One Soldier mentioned, “I would remain in the military but cannot understand why I’m getting cursed out when asked to do something. I am a grown man!” I asked this same Soldier if he’d discuss with his leaders the disrespect he feels and he said that he had spoken with them about it. My final question to him was, “So what did they say?” He replied, “They said that I am a Soldier and if I can’t handle it, get out!”
As a leader myself, I apologized to this Soldier and informed him that some leaders are called leaders because of their position or title, not because of their leadership. I then annotated in the retention book that he was not going to extend his contract but instead, leave the military because of the disrespect from his leadership.
Must a Soldier be a Chaplain to get respected? Can a Soldier who informs his or her chain of command that the speaking of profanity is against their religion be provided the same respect that a chaplain receives? Should fellow Soldiers respect these Soldiers? To me, the answer is quite simple. We should.
I am one of these Soldiers. I am a non-paid minister at a local church. The Soldiers who are aware of this duty respect the fact I am a Soldier and a minister. I've expressed to others that I would like for them to be themselves while in my presence, as I would perceive unrealism if they would change their talk, speech, or attitude just because I was standing around in the vicinity. Some disagreed but others said okay and would use profanity as if I’m not around. It didn’t then and doesn’t bother me a bit. However, there might be Soldiers that are affected by vulgar and demeaning language and I believe this should be respected.
If smoking a cigarette around a non-smoker is a sign of disrespect, I believe using profanity around a non-profanity speaker falls within the same guidelines if the Soldier speaks up. Leaders must understand that profanity can be damning to a lot of people. The “F” word has been known to cause havoc, begin fights, and unfortunately result in someone being killed. To tell a Soldier to deal with the disrespect because you're a Soldier is unacceptable.
This is not a new Army. Respect began when the Army began.
Religion
Respect
Values
Command Post
Edited 10 y ago
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 97
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All I know, is that if someone can't handle some profanity in the military, then Lord help them when it comes time to fix bayonets. Do I curse, No (nowadays). Will I quit a job because I get cursed out? No. Do I know how to wear my big boy pants and exercise my right to be heard and solve such miniscule problems as profanity, albeit toxic leadership involved? Yes. Aren't we also problem solvers in the military? Can a simple message be passed along to the C of C or the Chaplain to determine if this leader needs a psych eval for abusing his authority? Is it natural to curse your hard working troops up and down, or is this poor soldier in need of a serious reality check? I find it INCREDIBLY unprofessional to curse. I'm sharpening my admin bayonet (Skilcraft) and getting busy counseling before I'd let some troop have power over me by getting me pissed to the point of profanity.
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CPT (Join to see)
Language for proper impact and in moderation.
Profanity, when properly placed, is an excellent way of communicating or amplifying a point. That being said, in the hands of the ignorant, it can actually weaken a point. It's all about understand who is on the receiving end of the profanity. An Soldier should be able to understand his audience and what is proper communication to that audience. I would never tell my mom to "fuck off". That is something I would probably say jokingly to friends of mine whom I know I can joke with like that. I have friends that are Christian and whom I know are sensitive about profanity. I make it a point to change my language for them. I do it out of respect. The elephant in the room is what is right and acceptable in the professional setting. To me, it starts with the Soldier's leadership. If my BC says that are professionals, just like a bank or law firm and our workplace will be free from profanity, then that is what it is. Again, language for proper impact and in moderation. My question is where do you think profanity fits in the "Profession of Arms".
Profanity, when properly placed, is an excellent way of communicating or amplifying a point. That being said, in the hands of the ignorant, it can actually weaken a point. It's all about understand who is on the receiving end of the profanity. An Soldier should be able to understand his audience and what is proper communication to that audience. I would never tell my mom to "fuck off". That is something I would probably say jokingly to friends of mine whom I know I can joke with like that. I have friends that are Christian and whom I know are sensitive about profanity. I make it a point to change my language for them. I do it out of respect. The elephant in the room is what is right and acceptable in the professional setting. To me, it starts with the Soldier's leadership. If my BC says that are professionals, just like a bank or law firm and our workplace will be free from profanity, then that is what it is. Again, language for proper impact and in moderation. My question is where do you think profanity fits in the "Profession of Arms".
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MSgt Jim Wolverton
I can safely say that in my 24 years I was never cursed at, outside of BMT. Did I swear, yes, but not at my guys, more at the situation. Honestly, if you have to curse at your guys because they are either stupid or ignorant, those people probably don't belong in the military. At least they don't below in the Air Force, I'm not sure how you Army guys roll ;)
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SFC Brian Ewing
What I tell people who use profanity is this:
Imagine you are at a table eating with your Grandparents, Mother and Father or the Pastor of your Church, would you want your kids yelling across the table saying "Hey dad, can you please pass the F*CKING Potatoes??
If not, then you shouldn't curse, besides there is always a better way and a better word to use when addressing someone.
Cursing doesn't make you look hard, tough and definitely doesn't make you look intelligent.
Imagine you are at a table eating with your Grandparents, Mother and Father or the Pastor of your Church, would you want your kids yelling across the table saying "Hey dad, can you please pass the F*CKING Potatoes??
If not, then you shouldn't curse, besides there is always a better way and a better word to use when addressing someone.
Cursing doesn't make you look hard, tough and definitely doesn't make you look intelligent.
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LTC Lee Bouchard
To SFC Mark Merino: I agree. Using foul language has it's place and there are places where it needs to be checked at the door. The user needs to be very aware of his surroundings and what effect or purpose does it serve. There are heated and confusing times when no other words fit the situation than a series of foul words expressly spoken at about 300 disable's and at 400 words per minute. You know, "Gosh and Gee Wizz"
just doesn't cut it anymore. Not in todays world anyway. But saying to the clerk at the check out stand who gave back the wrong change, "Lady, you just Foxtrot Uniformed"
gets close. LOL!!!!
just doesn't cut it anymore. Not in todays world anyway. But saying to the clerk at the check out stand who gave back the wrong change, "Lady, you just Foxtrot Uniformed"
gets close. LOL!!!!
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BLUF: Being offended is a personal choice anyone can make. If I'm your First Sergeant and I'm on your ass because you did something you knew better, made that dumbass decision or what ever and you choose to be offended rather than listen to what I'm telling you. You've missed the intent and the reason behind me chewing your ass! Get over it, move out smartly, don't make the same mistake again....and we'll never have this conversation again. GUESS WHAT: 2 minutes after you're outta my sight...I've moved on to the next issue! I don't hold it against you, I won't belittle you in front of others about it later on, it's over. NOW if you do that same stupid crap again...I'M the one Offended, because your dumbass chose not to listen to me and didn't hear a word of advise I gave you the 1st time. Now I know this isn't politcally correct, but guess what, being politically correct and sensitive to your feelings may not be what you need to hear. My advise may save your life one day or the life of another Soldier. Get over it! If you feel this had anything to do with your religion. Go and pray it don't happen again because I'll be praying for you that it better NOT.
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1SG (Join to see)
SGT Curtis Earl If you're getting your ass chewed with f bombs etc for dropping a tool or mishandling something, then you have a toxic leader on your hand. Sorry but I had laugh at your comparision of imagining talking to a wife or POTUS in the context of your dropping a wrench or mishandling somethig, really took me out to left field. However fully agree with the next sentence! Stupidity and ignorance is not offensive, though it is a fact of life. As for the being offended being a personal choice...guess we'll agree to disagree! If you or any of your Soldiers are/were being mistreated in any fashion related to what you've said above, it should have been reported up the chain of command know it. That should not be tolerated. I Hope it's not happening.
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1SG (Join to see)
MCPO Hans Brakob No issue or "offense" with the down vote, however, am interested in your thoughts since you apparently strongly disagree!
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MSG (Join to see)
we as senior leaders are training the next generation to save our asses if these punk ass bitches cant take our crap then they sure as hell wont make it on the battlefield and well white flag ???
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SFC Brian Ewing
What I tell people who use profanity is this:
Imagine you are at a table eating with your Grandparents, Mother and Father or the Pastor of your Church, would you want your kids yelling across the table saying "Hey dad, can you please pass the F*CKING Potatoes??
If not, then you shouldn't curse, besides there is always a better way and a better word to use when addressing someone.
Cursing doesn't make you look hard, tough and definitely doesn't make you look intelligent.
Imagine you are at a table eating with your Grandparents, Mother and Father or the Pastor of your Church, would you want your kids yelling across the table saying "Hey dad, can you please pass the F*CKING Potatoes??
If not, then you shouldn't curse, besides there is always a better way and a better word to use when addressing someone.
Cursing doesn't make you look hard, tough and definitely doesn't make you look intelligent.
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I joined the Army in Oct 82. My first duty station was Ft Hood with the 1st Cav. I was an E-1 when I joined and a CPL 18 months latter (I was real good in the field!) and a squad leader. One afternoon in the motor pool, another platoon SGT (SFC) cornered one of my squad members and commenced to go nuts on him, for something I can't remember, but it was something I instructed him to do. I quickly intervened and the cussing shifted from my troop to the both of us. I told my guy to leave which inflamed the SFC, who up until then, I thought was a pretty good guy/leader. At that point I turned on the Squad Leader mantra and the discussion got lively. He became fully aware of the fact that I was not going to let anyone belittle or disrespect my troops. Then the unthinkable happened, he grabbed the front of my BDU blouse, I cold cocked him. Yep, my fledgling career was over! He stood back up and smiled, "You got balls, boy! I hope you continue to stand up for your Soldiers." Then he walked away. That was the first and only time I ever witnessed him go nuts on someone, and never received an explanation for it either. A month after the incident, he requested that I work for him as a Squad/team Leader on a mission we were assigned. I asked why and his response, "I want guys that give a shit about their team." that was all he would say.
I ABSOLUTELY do not advocate cold cocking a Senior NCO, or anyone for that matter, it was a different army with Vietnam veterans(him included) and we were not that touchy feely. But the key was taking up for and caring for your soldiers and giving respect. You may not agree with their lifestyle or what they do or do not believe, but by the short hairs, as a leader, you better protect and respect them, they joined the same as you.
I ABSOLUTELY do not advocate cold cocking a Senior NCO, or anyone for that matter, it was a different army with Vietnam veterans(him included) and we were not that touchy feely. But the key was taking up for and caring for your soldiers and giving respect. You may not agree with their lifestyle or what they do or do not believe, but by the short hairs, as a leader, you better protect and respect them, they joined the same as you.
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SGT Michael Glenn
My 1st art 15 was much like the way your situation went down, I was Unit armorer (a cpl) and had a spc as my assistant, back then it was a against policy for the Armorer or his asst to pull any guard duties for any reason. A discussion came up one day with the infantry plt's and how headquarters plt always got over, the 1sg had told an E-5 to pick his cq runner for the night and since he didnt like my asst and they had bad blood when he was not an E-5 he cornered my spc and was lecturing him on how he should be honored to be his runner, I approached both at that time to which the E-5 attempted to turn on me and lock me up, I told the spc to leave and not to worry about the runner position as it was against regulation and the E-5 had not the authority to snag him. getting in my face ( like drill) he began pushing me with his finger on my chest, which prompted me to respond with a knee to the groin , putting him where he belonged, where I messed up after that was another NCO who saw the tail end of the whole thing rushed in and I took a swing at him thinking he was gonna defend the E-5, I didnt contact thankfully cause he would have cleaned my clock but I got nailed for swinging at him just the same, nothing happened for kneeing the E-5 and the spc didnt have to pull runner duty.
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SFC William "Bill" Moore
That was all I thought about, getting an AR 15 then having to leave the Army. I've been pretty lucky in my career. I will let anyone walk all over me, but, when it comes to troops, family and friends, I have a very explosive temper. I had a very good LT nickname me BFFI (Biffy) Brute force and F@#king Ignorance for some of the things I would do.
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SGT Nia Chiaraluce
I wish the same respect was given to female soldier's that exude the same tenacity, the fact is senior males don't. They think we are snarky and emotional.
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