Posted on Jan 30, 2020
Why is my Command going to kick me out under a Chapter 13, instead of a Chapter 18 which falls under ABCP?
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*NOT LOOKING FOR PITY JUST WANT ANSWERS AND CONSTRUCTIVE CRITICISM*
So been on ABCP longer than I should have been.
Got it.
tracking.
all my fault.
ABCP and flag started in April of 2019 and at first was making progress and was on track to get off but then started to show decrease in performance.
So a little back story is that my TIS is 2yrs 7mo i've been in Korea for 1yr and 7mo now and was a motivated PFC with a 270+ PT score at the time but have never been a problem child yada yada yada.
Have a wife i've been with for 9yrs with 2 of those years married and 2 daughters along for the ride.
9 months into Korea I get offered training and go TDY to Fort Rucker, AL for 6 weeks and this is the FEB-APR of 2019 time frame. So my incompetent self says screw PT on my own and eat all the southern comfort food you can before you gotta go back to Korea.
HUGE MISTAKE
Now on my way back from Alabama to Korea I decided to extend and bring my family with me. The reason for this is because my wife and I had problems within our relationship and she was living with my parents which was stressful on her. I decided instead of PCSing in June of 2019 I had this "wonderful" idea of... maybe if I get her away from all of our family and she is just with me and away from everyone else we can get our relationship back on track blah blah blah. Again
HUGE MISTAKE
Trying to get my wife to adjust to military life half way across the world with 2 little's in an unfamiliar area whilst trying to amend a relationship. Is a terrible idea and wouldn't recommend it if you ask me and wish I would have just PCSd in June of 19 when I had the chance. What I am getting to though is that she came out here in April with the kids and at same time at work I get hit with ABCP after busting tape on a PT test (but passed the other 3 events). Which to note the ABCP packet since April of last year is currently missing 5500s and 4856s. It is not consistent at all. Let me also mention I have always passed the other 3 events of a PT test just fine until April of 2019 and my last PT test in October 2019 I passed the 3 events but still busted tape. Then when I take look at my ERB recently I see it says I "Passed" for my October 2019 PT test but correct me if i'm wrong it should say "Fail" because I busted tape right?
Anyways back to the beginning of April 2019 with the problems that arose at work and at home. I turned into a different person cause I went from a motivated soldier to sort of a shitbag and not caring about anything else when it came to myself. I still did my job and still got to work/formations we had on time and still not a problem child for the most part. The arguments with my wife and I gradually got to the point where she was asking for plane tickets back to the states and a divorce on top of it. That brought my performance as a Soldier, Father, and Husband to an all time low. Being new to the military and not having the greatest leadership from April 2019 to the beginning of December 2019. I did not have the knowledge of programs/services we could have used to help our relationship. I am the type to keep my personal life separated from work so I never really talked about it but. When I did nobody wanted to really help so I zipped my mouth and just did my job. The biggest problem with being stationed in Korea in my opinion is the turn around time (1 year unaccompanied, 2 years accompanied). So people come and go. As a result of that most people just try to stay under the radar and worry about themselves and when they are leaving Korea. Not to mention from OCT-DEC of 2019 our NCO was gone for ALC and didn't have an NCO for those months. It was just myself and another junior enlisted running a Battalion ALSE shop by ourselves. Now they did appoint an NCO for the time being but they barely checked on us and pretty much left us alone because we acted like adults not children even when nobody was around.
Had a huge mountain to get over since April and wish I had the knowledge I have now. Then once I did find out about a family/marriage counselor in December and decided to get help. It was exactly what my wife and I needed and has helped us tremendously. I also just learned about strong bonds and family retreats and other options at my disposal that I had no idea that was even out there at our disposal. I feel my prior leadership failed me and didn't provide me with this information when I needed it the most. I'm not blaming them for getting on the ABCP because that is my fault. Between the stress of my relationship at home and the stress of work really tore me down. Just thinking about how this cookie crumbled the way it did bothers the hell out of me. It has never been my intentions of getting kicked out of the military. The meaning of "knowledge is power" means a lot more to me now than it ever has but got to me too late.
Big question is though why are they going to kick me out under a Chapter 13 instead of a Chapter 18 which falls under ABCP? Because to me it just seems like they know a Chapter 18 wont pass legal because of all the documents they are missing within the ABCP packet. Thats if they were to follow through with a Chapter 18 instead of a Chapter 13. So to me what it looks like is they are just trying a different way to get around a Chapter 18. Can they Chapter me under a Chapter 13 instead of a 18?
please let me know and help me understand why
Thank you
So been on ABCP longer than I should have been.
Got it.
tracking.
all my fault.
ABCP and flag started in April of 2019 and at first was making progress and was on track to get off but then started to show decrease in performance.
So a little back story is that my TIS is 2yrs 7mo i've been in Korea for 1yr and 7mo now and was a motivated PFC with a 270+ PT score at the time but have never been a problem child yada yada yada.
Have a wife i've been with for 9yrs with 2 of those years married and 2 daughters along for the ride.
9 months into Korea I get offered training and go TDY to Fort Rucker, AL for 6 weeks and this is the FEB-APR of 2019 time frame. So my incompetent self says screw PT on my own and eat all the southern comfort food you can before you gotta go back to Korea.
HUGE MISTAKE
Now on my way back from Alabama to Korea I decided to extend and bring my family with me. The reason for this is because my wife and I had problems within our relationship and she was living with my parents which was stressful on her. I decided instead of PCSing in June of 2019 I had this "wonderful" idea of... maybe if I get her away from all of our family and she is just with me and away from everyone else we can get our relationship back on track blah blah blah. Again
HUGE MISTAKE
Trying to get my wife to adjust to military life half way across the world with 2 little's in an unfamiliar area whilst trying to amend a relationship. Is a terrible idea and wouldn't recommend it if you ask me and wish I would have just PCSd in June of 19 when I had the chance. What I am getting to though is that she came out here in April with the kids and at same time at work I get hit with ABCP after busting tape on a PT test (but passed the other 3 events). Which to note the ABCP packet since April of last year is currently missing 5500s and 4856s. It is not consistent at all. Let me also mention I have always passed the other 3 events of a PT test just fine until April of 2019 and my last PT test in October 2019 I passed the 3 events but still busted tape. Then when I take look at my ERB recently I see it says I "Passed" for my October 2019 PT test but correct me if i'm wrong it should say "Fail" because I busted tape right?
Anyways back to the beginning of April 2019 with the problems that arose at work and at home. I turned into a different person cause I went from a motivated soldier to sort of a shitbag and not caring about anything else when it came to myself. I still did my job and still got to work/formations we had on time and still not a problem child for the most part. The arguments with my wife and I gradually got to the point where she was asking for plane tickets back to the states and a divorce on top of it. That brought my performance as a Soldier, Father, and Husband to an all time low. Being new to the military and not having the greatest leadership from April 2019 to the beginning of December 2019. I did not have the knowledge of programs/services we could have used to help our relationship. I am the type to keep my personal life separated from work so I never really talked about it but. When I did nobody wanted to really help so I zipped my mouth and just did my job. The biggest problem with being stationed in Korea in my opinion is the turn around time (1 year unaccompanied, 2 years accompanied). So people come and go. As a result of that most people just try to stay under the radar and worry about themselves and when they are leaving Korea. Not to mention from OCT-DEC of 2019 our NCO was gone for ALC and didn't have an NCO for those months. It was just myself and another junior enlisted running a Battalion ALSE shop by ourselves. Now they did appoint an NCO for the time being but they barely checked on us and pretty much left us alone because we acted like adults not children even when nobody was around.
Had a huge mountain to get over since April and wish I had the knowledge I have now. Then once I did find out about a family/marriage counselor in December and decided to get help. It was exactly what my wife and I needed and has helped us tremendously. I also just learned about strong bonds and family retreats and other options at my disposal that I had no idea that was even out there at our disposal. I feel my prior leadership failed me and didn't provide me with this information when I needed it the most. I'm not blaming them for getting on the ABCP because that is my fault. Between the stress of my relationship at home and the stress of work really tore me down. Just thinking about how this cookie crumbled the way it did bothers the hell out of me. It has never been my intentions of getting kicked out of the military. The meaning of "knowledge is power" means a lot more to me now than it ever has but got to me too late.
Big question is though why are they going to kick me out under a Chapter 13 instead of a Chapter 18 which falls under ABCP? Because to me it just seems like they know a Chapter 18 wont pass legal because of all the documents they are missing within the ABCP packet. Thats if they were to follow through with a Chapter 18 instead of a Chapter 13. So to me what it looks like is they are just trying a different way to get around a Chapter 18. Can they Chapter me under a Chapter 13 instead of a 18?
please let me know and help me understand why
Thank you
Legal Services
ABCP
Edited 5 y ago
Posted 5 y ago
Responses: 6
5
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Well if I'm understanding you correctly no matter which chapter they decide to go, it should work in your favor since you said counseling statements are missing and body fat worksheets are missing. For chapter 13, without those supporting documents, there is really no valid grounds for separation. They will have to show the counselings, enrollment in weight control, etc to legal.....Now with this being said, now is your opportunity to get in compliance ASAP to continue your military career. Here is some advice to you, since you said counselings are missing: Do not sign any back dated counselings. If they failed to counsel when the incident happened or misplaced the counseling, too bad. It never happened. Be on the look out for counselings with your forged signature if no digital signatures are present. It's easy to type up counselings, slap on a past date, and forge a signature.......... Now the ball is in your court, it's up to you to decide your future..............
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PFC (Join to see)
Thank you for the response. I currently have one on one PT in the morning and afternoon. Also the NCO over me now is tracking the 5500s and 4856s missing.
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SSG (Join to see)
PFC (Join to see) No problem...... I didn't understand what you mean by you currently have one on one PT in the morning and afternoon. Great to hear he's tracking. But for the time being continue to get yourself into compliance.
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Look dude. It all sucks. 13, 18 whatever number. How you are separated isn't nearly as important as the fact that you are still going to get an honorable discharge or a general discharge under honorable conditions. So you are going to receive all of your VA benefits. You are still going to get all the perks Vets get. So focus on your future. Where do you go from here. People get separated for failing physical standards all the time, and says nothing about how good of people they are. You got a bright future. You got a family.
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Ok,
APFT is not the same as Weight/BodyComposition. Two separate animals performed simultaneously for simplicity. No, if you want to appeal the separation process them get with Trial Defense and see if your case is strong enough for it. Keep in mind that your separation packet must go thru JAG for legal review as well. But remember, you had plenty of time to get within standards.
APFT is not the same as Weight/BodyComposition. Two separate animals performed simultaneously for simplicity. No, if you want to appeal the separation process them get with Trial Defense and see if your case is strong enough for it. Keep in mind that your separation packet must go thru JAG for legal review as well. But remember, you had plenty of time to get within standards.
(5)
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