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Posted on Aug 20, 2015
What is your opinion about Posthumous Promotions? Should they be routinely done?
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Seeking a point of clarification...when it comes to the survey answers; does the deceased service member really take up a slot if promoted after he/she dies? For example, if I was to given the rank of SSG following my death, would I have taken a slot not allowing someone still serving within my MOS a chance to be promoted?
As far as the actual thread, I echo what SSgt Alex Robinson stated, it depends on the situation.
As far as the actual thread, I echo what SSgt Alex Robinson stated, it depends on the situation.
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CMSgt James Nolan
SGT Ben Keen I am 100% on the answer being no (but I have absolutely been known to assert something and then take it as fact). There is no detriment to "big military" in a posthumous promotion. And I am in agreement with most, it should be situationally weighed. My guess is that in cases where it is done, the troop was exceptional, or the command would not have initiated the process. More of a familial benefit-a way to honor the family.
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SGT Ben Keen
CMSgt James Nolan - Thanks for taking the time to comment back. I didn't think it would take up a slot but again, since I'm not a complete expert in such matters I figured I would ask.
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SGM Steve Wettstein
SGT Ben Keen - In order for someone to be posthumously promoted they would already have to be on a promotion list or be promotable (SPC-SGT).
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SGM Bill Frazer
1. Not a whole lot of choice in the survey. 2. It should be case by case. 3. Was he promotable and or on the promotion list?, That normally is the reason for the posthumous promotion. 4. It does not COUNT on the numbers list, because the minute you promote him, he's dead and gone off the number count.
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SGM (Join to see) - I think that posthumous promotions should be limited only to those who were on an official promotion list prior to their deaths.
As an aside that is similar to the topic, the military does try to do what is right with deceased service members and their families. The first example of this that I saw was back in 1976 or so, when I responded to a situation where a young soldier had attempted suicide. Although he was "brain dead" when he arrived at the hospital the Army worked overtime to get him medically retired before he died for the sole purpose of trying to ensure his dependents (he had a wife and small child) got better military benefits than they would have otherwise received. Watching that happen greatly impressed me with the Army and I was told that was "routine". If they can medically retire a soldier before declared dead, they do it (or, at least, they used to do it).
As an aside that is similar to the topic, the military does try to do what is right with deceased service members and their families. The first example of this that I saw was back in 1976 or so, when I responded to a situation where a young soldier had attempted suicide. Although he was "brain dead" when he arrived at the hospital the Army worked overtime to get him medically retired before he died for the sole purpose of trying to ensure his dependents (he had a wife and small child) got better military benefits than they would have otherwise received. Watching that happen greatly impressed me with the Army and I was told that was "routine". If they can medically retire a soldier before declared dead, they do it (or, at least, they used to do it).
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SGM (Join to see) For me this is an unqualified yes. I would add, that there should be an opportunity for Service Members who medically retire to be promoted as well, without regard to NCOES, placement in list, etc. Promoting a Service Member who is retired or made the ultimate sacrifice does not count against end strength and occupies no paragraph and line number. Just the right thing to do.
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- Short answer. A posthumous promotion should only be done if it meets certain criteria that are already delineated.
- Long answer: I believe the posthumous promotion criteria include: Soldier is already promotable but not yet promoted (on a promotion list), the chain of command recommends posthumous promotion, and the Soldier was killed in the line of duty. A Soldier should not (and I believe will not) be posthumously promoted unless he/she meets the above criteria.
- Long answer: I believe the posthumous promotion criteria include: Soldier is already promotable but not yet promoted (on a promotion list), the chain of command recommends posthumous promotion, and the Soldier was killed in the line of duty. A Soldier should not (and I believe will not) be posthumously promoted unless he/she meets the above criteria.
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SGM (Join to see)
With respect, exceptions include POW, MIA, Officially Missing in Action in status at the time of death.
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Promotions should be given when the member meets the criteria and deserves it. Not because it's "routine".
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I think it is completely situational.
Also, for the 58% who think it helps with survivor benefits, maybe on AD but not traditional Res/NG.
I had a soldier that died shortly after we returned from deployment that was an amazing E4 and had a bright future in the military ahead of himself. I will not get into the details of his death other than saying that it was indirectly linked to his deployment and no it was not a suicide.
I took to the regs and had him promoted to E5. Not because of any benefits other than when his 1yo son grew up, he could say his dad was a SGT in the Army.
There is much much more to it than that but in his case, there was no question that he deserved the posthumous promotion.
The way I found out about everything was his mother brought his uniform to me and asked if we could check to make sure everything was correct and that her son always wanted to be buried in his uniform. He was buried in his uniform as an NCO. That is probably the one moment that I cherish most about my time in command.
Also, for the 58% who think it helps with survivor benefits, maybe on AD but not traditional Res/NG.
I had a soldier that died shortly after we returned from deployment that was an amazing E4 and had a bright future in the military ahead of himself. I will not get into the details of his death other than saying that it was indirectly linked to his deployment and no it was not a suicide.
I took to the regs and had him promoted to E5. Not because of any benefits other than when his 1yo son grew up, he could say his dad was a SGT in the Army.
There is much much more to it than that but in his case, there was no question that he deserved the posthumous promotion.
The way I found out about everything was his mother brought his uniform to me and asked if we could check to make sure everything was correct and that her son always wanted to be buried in his uniform. He was buried in his uniform as an NCO. That is probably the one moment that I cherish most about my time in command.
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I believe that each situation should be weighted and that it should not be a routine action.
I had the unfortunate opportunity to recommend one of my soldiers for a posthumous promotion to SGT E-5 after his untimely passing. I would have much rather had the soldier as he was a true leader. We served in Iraq together and shortly after our return to home station he passed due to an unfortunate accident. I found out about his passing when his mom called me and asked if I knew who/where she could get his uniform checked out to make sure everything was correct as he wanted to be buried in his uniform. I told her I would handle it and picked up his uniform from her. Long story short, I was able to push his promotion as well as a service award through in short order and he was buried as an NCO with his stripes on. There was no question in my, nor anyone in leaderships mind that he was a leader and deserved it. He was survived by his wife and newborn and I wanted his child to be able to talk about how his dad was a SGT in the Army.
That was 12 years ago and it still pains me when I think about the loss. What is ridiculous about it is the fact that I had a CSM ask me why I was doing it because the soldier had passed. I told him why not!? It is for his family and his legacy if for nothing else.
I had the unfortunate opportunity to recommend one of my soldiers for a posthumous promotion to SGT E-5 after his untimely passing. I would have much rather had the soldier as he was a true leader. We served in Iraq together and shortly after our return to home station he passed due to an unfortunate accident. I found out about his passing when his mom called me and asked if I knew who/where she could get his uniform checked out to make sure everything was correct as he wanted to be buried in his uniform. I told her I would handle it and picked up his uniform from her. Long story short, I was able to push his promotion as well as a service award through in short order and he was buried as an NCO with his stripes on. There was no question in my, nor anyone in leaderships mind that he was a leader and deserved it. He was survived by his wife and newborn and I wanted his child to be able to talk about how his dad was a SGT in the Army.
That was 12 years ago and it still pains me when I think about the loss. What is ridiculous about it is the fact that I had a CSM ask me why I was doing it because the soldier had passed. I told him why not!? It is for his family and his legacy if for nothing else.
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Does it really affect quotas? I have to admit I never heard of quotas until I spent time with an active component unit. Two things: 1. it shouldn't affect the quota so fix the system if it does 2. if the Soldier was going to be promoted anyway why not do it, not like it costs you anything personally.
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