Posted on May 17, 2016
What are your thoughts on "stolen valor hunters" and their drive to find cases?
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I was reading another thread regarding potential case of "stolen valor", and noticed many comments that seem to push back against the tide of people hunting for stolen valor. So what are your thoughts on "stolen valor", and perhaps more SPECIFICALLY "stolen valor hunters" and their drive to find such cases?
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I said this some time ago in one of these threads: I'd rather let 10 fake asshats have their fake valor, than to wrongly accuse an actual vet of stolen valor (which we've seen growing incidents of).
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CPO (Join to see)
You are so locked on they have been getting closer and closer to call out real VETS. The Problem is a lot of these guys on the big SV sites are older service members meaning they have been out for some time and times have changed. The problem now is as they get away from NAM vets and get the OIF/OEF types they don't have all the correct info and understand that you did not have to be a grunt to leave the wire and take contact they don't under stand the new type of warfare.
The past 15 years and conflicts and COIN operations the services have had to form all kind of Special Joint task forces and they would get troops from all branches and back grounds that would not normally be in a combat environment. Example I am a Navy Ground Combat support guy so you would expect some combat awards or statements coming from me. I was on JTF in 2010-11 in Iraq and we had all kind of military officers and NCO's from all back grounds and MOS's. The one I am keying on is we had a AirForce 1st LT that was a rocketeer or missileer. We were out in a meeting in one of the towns heading back to VBC (victory Base Complex Baghdad Iraq) and we took and IED to our VIC and the VIC Behind us and then RPG's and small arms fire we got off X real quick but took bad damage and he took some blows to the head and some other stuff. My point being he has every right to call him self a combat VET but when he tells people his MOS they question why he was in Iraq and left the wire.
I believe they are going to get it wrong more often because of the example above people have done jobs in harms way that never would have done this before. My IA Individual Augmentee Warrior Combat skills school) school had two Sub guys in it and they were going to AFG to work with a JTF. If someone was to here one of them claim they were Submariners, but was on ground in Iraq they would call them out. They need to be careful. One more some of them tried to call that female Army Gen out for having a SF combat patch on and they were wrong she was ok to wear it. That was a media source and one of the Stolen Valor blogs.
The past 15 years and conflicts and COIN operations the services have had to form all kind of Special Joint task forces and they would get troops from all branches and back grounds that would not normally be in a combat environment. Example I am a Navy Ground Combat support guy so you would expect some combat awards or statements coming from me. I was on JTF in 2010-11 in Iraq and we had all kind of military officers and NCO's from all back grounds and MOS's. The one I am keying on is we had a AirForce 1st LT that was a rocketeer or missileer. We were out in a meeting in one of the towns heading back to VBC (victory Base Complex Baghdad Iraq) and we took and IED to our VIC and the VIC Behind us and then RPG's and small arms fire we got off X real quick but took bad damage and he took some blows to the head and some other stuff. My point being he has every right to call him self a combat VET but when he tells people his MOS they question why he was in Iraq and left the wire.
I believe they are going to get it wrong more often because of the example above people have done jobs in harms way that never would have done this before. My IA Individual Augmentee Warrior Combat skills school) school had two Sub guys in it and they were going to AFG to work with a JTF. If someone was to here one of them claim they were Submariners, but was on ground in Iraq they would call them out. They need to be careful. One more some of them tried to call that female Army Gen out for having a SF combat patch on and they were wrong she was ok to wear it. That was a media source and one of the Stolen Valor blogs.
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Adam Cervantes
I can't claim to know what is going through these SV hunters' minds when they engage in these confrontations, as I've never served in any military branch. And I really respect those who have signed that blank check to protect my freedom. But, it seems to me (as a civilian) that they are mainly unstable individuals that are probably overcompensating for lack-luster performance while they actually served. It doesn't take valor to get in the face of a homeless person who is trying to get more out of panhandling and demand them to take off his uniform. It doesn't take valor to slap a skinny teen across the face. (I've seen both these things happen on YouTube videos).
These over-aggressive "hunters" often break the law by assaulting the individuals they are accusing of breaking the SV law. I think almost all service men and women would probably just give folks the benefit of the doubt and respectfully go on with their day when they suspect someone is falsley claiming to have served. Unfortunately, these hunters are staining the expectation civilians have of solders and sailors to behave in a disciplined and controlled manner.
These over-aggressive "hunters" often break the law by assaulting the individuals they are accusing of breaking the SV law. I think almost all service men and women would probably just give folks the benefit of the doubt and respectfully go on with their day when they suspect someone is falsley claiming to have served. Unfortunately, these hunters are staining the expectation civilians have of solders and sailors to behave in a disciplined and controlled manner.
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Adam Cervantes
Adam Cervantes - I just saw that a place I want to visit gives a 25% discount to active and retired military "WITH PROPER MILITARY IDs!" There's the solution to prevent people from breaking the law. No ID - No discount!
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what is really getting on my nerves is how pissed off people are getting - to the point that they are using "stolen valor" as a justification to lose any sense of deceny, decorum, professionalism, etc.
I am starting to think that some of these supposed valor-defending rangers are really looking for a few minutes of fame, as indicated by the need to put it on youtube.
how you react to stolen valor says a lot about your maturity...and if it involves "whooping his ass" that says a lot about your judgement.
I am starting to think that some of these supposed valor-defending rangers are really looking for a few minutes of fame, as indicated by the need to put it on youtube.
how you react to stolen valor says a lot about your maturity...and if it involves "whooping his ass" that says a lot about your judgement.
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We who served know what we earned. No need to expend the energy to hunt down those that didn't earn theirs. They have to live with being a paper soldier!
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While I find the practice of Stolen Valor absolutely despicable, it seems to me like there are those who are getting way, way out of hand, to the point of being almost rabid, when it comes to try and discredit anybody who appears in uniform or relates a story from their time in service. And in some ways, that can be even worse than some mentally ill idiot throwing on a thrift store-bought uniform and outfitting it with a ridiculous collection of insignia and Ebay awards.
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I think it's a witch hunt honestly. For every person they legitimately out, how many bona fide veterans are they accusing and ruining their lives? None of us should EVER have to justify what we did in the service to anyone. A big part of why I hide being a veteran is because of the idiots trying to out people and cause a scene. If I go out, I want to do what I need to do and go home. I don't need to waste my time trying defend myself from people who feel a need to stoke their egos in this manner. Even look at the term itself. Nothing is stolen. Valor is an act not something tangible. It cannot be stolen or degraded by anything anyone else says or does. I am not defending the liars mind you. I am only stating that the hunt to out them is causing way more problems than it solves.
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SGT Dave Tracy
"I am only stating that the hunt to out them is causing way more problems than it solves."
Yes! Precisely the thing I'm starting to see. The constant drum beat about finding stolen valor is starting to wear thin with many folks.
Yes! Precisely the thing I'm starting to see. The constant drum beat about finding stolen valor is starting to wear thin with many folks.
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SGT David T.
SGT Dave Tracy - It also has a second order effect of making the veteran community look like arrogant, self absorbed, bullies.
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I hate stolen valor. Outted a fake CMSgt last year myself. Had some support and also some critics but after people started digging it was pretty clear.
Search for "Colleen A. Jeffries" and you'll find it.
Search for "Colleen A. Jeffries" and you'll find it.
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I don't like it when untrained or unseasoned people "Hunt" and seek out Stolen Valor Folks. Let the people at Guardian's of Valor do their thing. They know what they are doing and how to do it.
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The only thing they get from me is pity. How awful it must be to feel the need to fabricate a military career to feel better about themselves. You're talking about lifetime underachievers and some folks with incredible insecurity coupled with a complete lack of integrity. What an abysmal existence they must have. I don't see the need to kick them in the face about it.
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Stolen Valor, to me, cheapens the awards and why they are given. However, I do not see the point of actively hunting people down and exposing them. If they are running for office of course. If they are getting a free meal on Vet's day I would say something to them. If they were walking around in uniform, that was obviously wrong, I would do as I would do for ANY Soldier I saw on or off post, and make the corrections.
Until police will actually apprehend someone, its kind of counterproductive.
Until police will actually apprehend someone, its kind of counterproductive.
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