Posted on Dec 12, 2015
If Donald Trump is elected President, would it be more honorable to resign from service or to serve under his "leadership"?
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Posted 9 y ago
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I'd say by virtue of your question you don't have the leadership, discipline and demeanor needed to lead so I say resign. Because if you haven't resigned under this POTUS then I'm not sure of your priorities.
Will you hold yourself to that same question in civilian life? Every time your boss or CEO changes you going to quit if you don't like his or her 'leadership' style? Good luck with that.
Will you hold yourself to that same question in civilian life? Every time your boss or CEO changes you going to quit if you don't like his or her 'leadership' style? Good luck with that.
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MAJ Bryan Zeski
Chief, if my boss was a racist nationalist, then yes, I'd probably find a new job. No amount of $ is worth supporting, through my efforts, ignoble causes and dishonorable men.
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Major, I'm going to say this and it's gonna sound ugly.
With all due respect.
That is the dumbest, most ill informed and selfish question I have ever read posted from an officer in the US Military.
You worked your butt off to become a major in the Army; now you are looking at a small part of a horribly skewed, political theater cycle that occurs every four years; while considering screwing your career away. Did you consider that this is political theater, it is all propaganda, mal-truths and biased media reports? We, as service members, never know the truth about politicians, but we serve regardless of their theatrics.
It appears to me that you have not been paying very much attention to the Belt Way (inside DC) for the last 20 or so years. That place is a cesspool of corruption, mal-truths, and false convictions. Yet we all swear/swore an oath to defend it and hope those civilians don't get us all killed.
So, if you have such a weak stature that one political candidate would cause you to forsake your oath. Maybe you might want to go ahead and resign. You could teach high school history or drivers ed.
But that is just my experience. Best of luck in what ever you decide.
With all due respect.
That is the dumbest, most ill informed and selfish question I have ever read posted from an officer in the US Military.
You worked your butt off to become a major in the Army; now you are looking at a small part of a horribly skewed, political theater cycle that occurs every four years; while considering screwing your career away. Did you consider that this is political theater, it is all propaganda, mal-truths and biased media reports? We, as service members, never know the truth about politicians, but we serve regardless of their theatrics.
It appears to me that you have not been paying very much attention to the Belt Way (inside DC) for the last 20 or so years. That place is a cesspool of corruption, mal-truths, and false convictions. Yet we all swear/swore an oath to defend it and hope those civilians don't get us all killed.
So, if you have such a weak stature that one political candidate would cause you to forsake your oath. Maybe you might want to go ahead and resign. You could teach high school history or drivers ed.
But that is just my experience. Best of luck in what ever you decide.
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MAJ Bryan Zeski
I appreciate your comments. The thing is, I posed it as a rhetorical or hypothetical question, not as a specific question asked for career-advice.
As an aside - how would it be foresaking an oath to resign - for any reason? Everyone gets out at some point - resigning is just how it's done from the Officer side. People resign every year for reasons of finance, health, family, etc... how is resigning for ANY reason forsaking an oath? Sure, if someone just up an walked away or went AWOL, that would be a breach of trust - but not resigning.
As an aside - how would it be foresaking an oath to resign - for any reason? Everyone gets out at some point - resigning is just how it's done from the Officer side. People resign every year for reasons of finance, health, family, etc... how is resigning for ANY reason forsaking an oath? Sure, if someone just up an walked away or went AWOL, that would be a breach of trust - but not resigning.
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PO2 Robert W.
Thank you for the insight Major, I now understand the question to be a hypocritical discussion question.
It is my experience that the WHY someone resigns is the most important part of the action. Boldly decrying a candidate and then resigning gives strength to the failings you condemn. I would suggest that resigning over a political candidate's election into office would be condoning that candidate. If you believe the person is harmful to your service then stay and fight to mitigate this person's effect. Once we resign, we can no longer effect positive change. We effectively surrender to the candidate's ideal.
It is my experience that the WHY someone resigns is the most important part of the action. Boldly decrying a candidate and then resigning gives strength to the failings you condemn. I would suggest that resigning over a political candidate's election into office would be condoning that candidate. If you believe the person is harmful to your service then stay and fight to mitigate this person's effect. Once we resign, we can no longer effect positive change. We effectively surrender to the candidate's ideal.
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1SG (Join to see) said it best. You volunteer to serve your country. You serve to ensure the freedoms of our citizens to vote for the best candidate for your Commander in Chief.
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As much as I may disagree with someone, I would not resign over them. Like many others here are saying, one's service is to a cause greater than one person and the four to eight years you might have to call them a Commander-in-Chief.
On a personal level, I have considered the concept of voluntary service and our oaths. They aren't just words. When I commissioned, I felt like I was finally making a public declaration of the calling that's been in my blood for most of my life (and that I will carry unto my last breath). One way or another, we will all hang up the uniform and conclude our official service, but the calling transcends.
That in mind, I think resignation is still a credible matter of honor. There is a classic scenario which perfectly illustrates this: the colonel who resigned his commission after being offered command of an army that was raised by the President to invade his own country. We all have a personal perception of what it means to be American or what America is supposed to be. While the election of one man is not worth resignation, certain decisions and events could be. These could be red flags indicating a progressive rot in the moral and cultural fabric of our society over a prolonged period of time. Occupant of the Oval Office aside, if the nation has changed to such a degree that it is no longer the nation you are willing to die for, then perhaps resignation is fitting. Enduring a couple of administrations you don't concur with is one thing, but there can come a point at which one can say, "this isn't one person. It's bigger. This isn't the country I once knew."
I still believe in America.
God bless these United States. Live free or die.
On a personal level, I have considered the concept of voluntary service and our oaths. They aren't just words. When I commissioned, I felt like I was finally making a public declaration of the calling that's been in my blood for most of my life (and that I will carry unto my last breath). One way or another, we will all hang up the uniform and conclude our official service, but the calling transcends.
That in mind, I think resignation is still a credible matter of honor. There is a classic scenario which perfectly illustrates this: the colonel who resigned his commission after being offered command of an army that was raised by the President to invade his own country. We all have a personal perception of what it means to be American or what America is supposed to be. While the election of one man is not worth resignation, certain decisions and events could be. These could be red flags indicating a progressive rot in the moral and cultural fabric of our society over a prolonged period of time. Occupant of the Oval Office aside, if the nation has changed to such a degree that it is no longer the nation you are willing to die for, then perhaps resignation is fitting. Enduring a couple of administrations you don't concur with is one thing, but there can come a point at which one can say, "this isn't one person. It's bigger. This isn't the country I once knew."
I still believe in America.
God bless these United States. Live free or die.
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And you think the "Cdr-in-Chief" currently sitting in the office shows any positive example of leadership? If that is your concern you should leave the service now. Do not wait for the election. You do not have the proper attitude to serve
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SFC Terry Pease
I agree totally, everyone has a line....if you can no longer serve because of a bias...for example me...whenever Obama took over I decided to retire...to make way for someone else. I tried to focus on doing my job but the policy changes coming down was too much for me with the repeal of dont ask dont tell...My anger impeded my ability to serve so in my weakness I stepped down. I served well...just so horrible..I let a two term President get the best of me...I let politics cloud my own emotions..My piss poor attitude was not healthy for me to stay in...sooner or later I would say something that would cause paperwork...and possible UCMJ for failing to comply to policy changes...Everyone has a threshold...If this guy will reach his with trump its time to leave...
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If you didn't resign while Obama was running the show you won't when Trumb is, no balls
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Suspended Profile
Sir, I have to ask you...,What are you fishing for? Are you in a crisis of conscience? If the current "CINC" does not beg the same question, I'd say your moral compass needs recalibration. We all took the same basic oath he took, yet he gets away with shredding the Constitution. Once you thrust aside your oath, you need to walk away.
MAJ Bryan Zeski
SGM, I'm not fishing for anything - just trying to draw in some discussion about the possibility of some elected officials degrading the honorability of service.
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Suspended Profile
MAJ Zeski, I have to counter your question with another: At what point are we as oath takers, who swore to defend the Constitution against all enemies; foreign and domestic, obligated to stand up to an elected leader who has no regard for the Constitution? Are we to sit idly by while the Executive branch of this country violates the trust of the American people? While the Legislative branch ignores the will of the people who elected them to represent us? While the Judicial branch bats their eyes at the Executive and allows violations of the Constitution? Waiting for four years to have our voices heard while this country is being led to ruination means some of the damage cannot be un-done. I am not for mutiny of any sort, but the current state of affairs begs the question. All three branches, only two elected, have degraded this country and its honor.
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The fact that you asked this tells me you should just resign...and that goes for anyone that answered that way.
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