Posted on Feb 12, 2023
Have you, or someone you know, been looked down on for having a "General (honorable conditions)" discharge instead of a "Honorable" one?
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OK, I did re-up, then suffered what would be, today, from PTSD. In 1979, the only American Psychiatric Association had a gap from "Combat-Fatigue" to codifying PTSD, so Army psychiatrists only had "depression" to work with.
The US Army or agents of it, effectively caused the issue, no matter what label is hung on it, but of more shame should be that the VA doesn't easily review those diagnoses, shortchanging many individuals, because there are differences, especially as civilians look at "UNDER HONORABLE CONDITIONS", even such Veterans that have become elected Officials. (I was denied a "service medal ,"from Governor Rick Scott, because the Marion County Human Resources Director was so well educated that she said that mine was not the same as "HONORABLE".
More importantly, I appear to have been "dissed" by Senator Rick Scott (FL's Jr. Sen.), when I brought up this disrespectful treatment and his people (or he did) ignored my request(s) for many missed honors.
BTW, I have to thank Senator Marco Rubio for asking the VA to better review my Army stressor-caused "depression".
I detest that anyone's better than "GENERAL" discharge is, "Uh-h-h...'ed", when we, ourselves didn't cause the problems anymore than any PTSD sufferer did with theirs.
The US Army or agents of it, effectively caused the issue, no matter what label is hung on it, but of more shame should be that the VA doesn't easily review those diagnoses, shortchanging many individuals, because there are differences, especially as civilians look at "UNDER HONORABLE CONDITIONS", even such Veterans that have become elected Officials. (I was denied a "service medal ,"from Governor Rick Scott, because the Marion County Human Resources Director was so well educated that she said that mine was not the same as "HONORABLE".
More importantly, I appear to have been "dissed" by Senator Rick Scott (FL's Jr. Sen.), when I brought up this disrespectful treatment and his people (or he did) ignored my request(s) for many missed honors.
BTW, I have to thank Senator Marco Rubio for asking the VA to better review my Army stressor-caused "depression".
I detest that anyone's better than "GENERAL" discharge is, "Uh-h-h...'ed", when we, ourselves didn't cause the problems anymore than any PTSD sufferer did with theirs.
Benefits
Honorable Discharge
Discharge
Veterans Affairs (VA)
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 5
PFC Edgar Mosier, I'm sorry for the difficulties you're facing.
DoD recognized the situation you are describing back in 2014 and the SECDEF issued guidance to all the Military Department Boards for Correction of Military/Naval Records (BCM/NR). He instructed them to give a 'very liberal' determination to those veterans applying for an upgrade whose characterization of discharge and who assert that they suffered PTSD and/or sexual assault or sexual harassment trauma that they believe mitigated the misconduct that led to the discharge.
Specific to you, you can apply though an easy interface on the VA's website* (instead of going though the Army Board for Correction of Military Records).
Additionally, if you need legal representation regarding the upgrade, DAV sponsors the Veterans Consortium* that provides free legal representation to Other Than Honorable discharges that fall into this category. I don't know if they would handle a General upgrade that is in the category, but you can always contact them to find out more information.
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* SECDEF Policy Memo (2014) - https://arba.army.pentagon.mil/documents/SECDEF%20Guidance%20to%20BCMRs%20re%20Vets%20Claiming%20PTSD.pdf
* VA Discharge Upgrade website - https://www.va.gov/discharge-upgrade-instructions/
* Veterans Consortium - https://www.vetsprobono.org/helpavet/item.9816-Discharge_Upgrade_Program_Sponsored_by_DAV_Charitable_Service_Trust
DoD recognized the situation you are describing back in 2014 and the SECDEF issued guidance to all the Military Department Boards for Correction of Military/Naval Records (BCM/NR). He instructed them to give a 'very liberal' determination to those veterans applying for an upgrade whose characterization of discharge and who assert that they suffered PTSD and/or sexual assault or sexual harassment trauma that they believe mitigated the misconduct that led to the discharge.
Specific to you, you can apply though an easy interface on the VA's website* (instead of going though the Army Board for Correction of Military Records).
Additionally, if you need legal representation regarding the upgrade, DAV sponsors the Veterans Consortium* that provides free legal representation to Other Than Honorable discharges that fall into this category. I don't know if they would handle a General upgrade that is in the category, but you can always contact them to find out more information.
---------------------------------------------------------------
* SECDEF Policy Memo (2014) - https://arba.army.pentagon.mil/documents/SECDEF%20Guidance%20to%20BCMRs%20re%20Vets%20Claiming%20PTSD.pdf
* VA Discharge Upgrade website - https://www.va.gov/discharge-upgrade-instructions/
* Veterans Consortium - https://www.vetsprobono.org/helpavet/item.9816-Discharge_Upgrade_Program_Sponsored_by_DAV_Charitable_Service_Trust
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PFC Edgar Mosier
Respectfully, Col., at 60 PLUS, I have more than volunteered and paid my dues.
And, for all my heartache(s) caused by the non-concerned of my more youthful days, I am surviving and sharing my earned vigilance with our fellow soldiers.
Further, sir, within the last year, under a disability review, I had a brilliant witch-doctor tell me that I could not have, could not have had PTSD, due to the demise of a younger brother that died at Ft. Hood due to what amounts to a case of medical neglect (that would garner many repercussions in the non-military-world). That brother, I had bottle-fed, diapered, cooked for, washed laundry for, monetarily support, even prior to my enlistment; In other words, short of not causing his birth, I was as near of a parent as any "step" would have been.
Now, the March Of Dimes and the Mayo Clinic, as well as others, admit that the loss of a loved one can stress one into PTSD. Now, imagine it's your employer that's responsible...
I hope to enlighten just one sufferer, before they are put through any more torturous begging.
In closing, I must share what, a twenty-one year old heard a retiring USAF JAG Officer explain to my grieving mother: Once signed, effectively, any Service can effectively turn a soldier into hamburger (US Issued...) and their folks cannot do much about it.
As far as I know, that "legality" and power is still in play.
And, for all my heartache(s) caused by the non-concerned of my more youthful days, I am surviving and sharing my earned vigilance with our fellow soldiers.
Further, sir, within the last year, under a disability review, I had a brilliant witch-doctor tell me that I could not have, could not have had PTSD, due to the demise of a younger brother that died at Ft. Hood due to what amounts to a case of medical neglect (that would garner many repercussions in the non-military-world). That brother, I had bottle-fed, diapered, cooked for, washed laundry for, monetarily support, even prior to my enlistment; In other words, short of not causing his birth, I was as near of a parent as any "step" would have been.
Now, the March Of Dimes and the Mayo Clinic, as well as others, admit that the loss of a loved one can stress one into PTSD. Now, imagine it's your employer that's responsible...
I hope to enlighten just one sufferer, before they are put through any more torturous begging.
In closing, I must share what, a twenty-one year old heard a retiring USAF JAG Officer explain to my grieving mother: Once signed, effectively, any Service can effectively turn a soldier into hamburger (US Issued...) and their folks cannot do much about it.
As far as I know, that "legality" and power is still in play.
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Personally, I look at the reason why the person got a General instead of an Honorable.
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PFC Edgar Mosier
Might one ask, "How?" and are you more able to question such than some civilian?
I would wish that the VA require of any educational institution that they have Human Resource cert'd / degreed people understand the actual likenesses and differences between the five.
My first DD-214 states "HONORABLE", whereas my second states, "UNDER HONORABLE CONDITIONS". That indicate by just wordage that Service that was cut short (due actions of the military) was somewhat less 'honorable'...
I would wish that the VA require of any educational institution that they have Human Resource cert'd / degreed people understand the actual likenesses and differences between the five.
My first DD-214 states "HONORABLE", whereas my second states, "UNDER HONORABLE CONDITIONS". That indicate by just wordage that Service that was cut short (due actions of the military) was somewhat less 'honorable'...
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First thing on the VA, if you served an enlistment that would be considered Honorable, the VA should be considering you Honorably discharged. The only thing that should be effected today is GI Bill, which had different rules back then anyway.
Have you considered applying for a discharge upgrade. I would think that would be an easy fix if you can produce a diagnosis of PTSD, even if it is from a civilian doctor.
Have you considered applying for a discharge upgrade. I would think that would be an easy fix if you can produce a diagnosis of PTSD, even if it is from a civilian doctor.
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PFC Edgar Mosier
Cpt, my Cpt, respectfully, have you ever / would you ever say such to some noticeably disabled veteran the same?
Would you tell a Lejeune amputee such or would you expect the VA to 'man-up' to their stated creed, "Our mission, as the Department of Veterans Affairs, is to care for those “who shall have borne the battle” and for their families, caregivers and survivors. Our core values focus our minds on our mission of caring and thereby guide our actions toward service to others."?
<LINK: https://www.va.gov/icare/#:~:text=Our%20mission%2C%20as%20the%20Department,actions%20toward%20service%20to%20others.
Or should I apologize for my disability NOT being seen?
Would you tell a Lejeune amputee such or would you expect the VA to 'man-up' to their stated creed, "Our mission, as the Department of Veterans Affairs, is to care for those “who shall have borne the battle” and for their families, caregivers and survivors. Our core values focus our minds on our mission of caring and thereby guide our actions toward service to others."?
<LINK: https://www.va.gov/icare/#:~:text=Our%20mission%2C%20as%20the%20Department,actions%20toward%20service%20to%20others.
Or should I apologize for my disability NOT being seen?
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CPT Lawrence Cable
PFC Edgar Mosier - Both the Colonel and I are just pointing out that there are now pathways to correct what you see as injustices, and I would agree that it isn't just. However, the definition of PTSD keeps evolving and DOD has been active in trying to correct some of these actions. We both are trying to show you were to start, if you aren't willing to try, then it's on you.
I'm 67, didn't pull a VA rating until I was 65 because I didn't apply.
I'm 67, didn't pull a VA rating until I was 65 because I didn't apply.
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PFC Edgar Mosier
CPT Lawrence Cable - Respectfully, sir, I understand what you said, understood the intent, also.
As stated, I am attempting to better aid our more youth-filled comrades.
It took me forty-two years to reach any (70%) due aid, even when I was directly under the VA's medical thumb (I worked on the cancer ward in the Little Rock VA Hospital, while I worked for my ASEE), because I didn't beg just right.
It took another year plus to obtain the 100% for dealing with the barriers of my PTSD and the learned self-respect (pride) in self, via total disability individual unemployability, with the aid of an attorney (I didn't mention fully that the County-connected "Veterans Center" supplied VSO was about as helpful as a screen door on a submarine.
If one soldier is better informed due my "on you", then God's aided my quest.
But, those minor benefit differences between what I have VS the cost of entry... Hellfire, I'd rather have that younger brother back, and that, sir, ain't on me. It's on an unconcerned machine and the parts that like a great cancer, are tolerated.
So, respectfully, thanks for your insight(s), but the injustices just cannot be unrung any less than any Bell's Peal can be undone, and those that were involved... hellfire....
I just keep reciting, with all my heart The Lord's Prayer (Thy Kingdom Come, Thy Will Be Done on earth as it is in Heaven. ...)
Cancer may have been the reason on Mom's Death Cert, but I'm sure she died years before, of a broken heart...
So, please, just join me in thanking God for another day closer to Heaven, where injustice won't live.
As stated, I am attempting to better aid our more youth-filled comrades.
It took me forty-two years to reach any (70%) due aid, even when I was directly under the VA's medical thumb (I worked on the cancer ward in the Little Rock VA Hospital, while I worked for my ASEE), because I didn't beg just right.
It took another year plus to obtain the 100% for dealing with the barriers of my PTSD and the learned self-respect (pride) in self, via total disability individual unemployability, with the aid of an attorney (I didn't mention fully that the County-connected "Veterans Center" supplied VSO was about as helpful as a screen door on a submarine.
If one soldier is better informed due my "on you", then God's aided my quest.
But, those minor benefit differences between what I have VS the cost of entry... Hellfire, I'd rather have that younger brother back, and that, sir, ain't on me. It's on an unconcerned machine and the parts that like a great cancer, are tolerated.
So, respectfully, thanks for your insight(s), but the injustices just cannot be unrung any less than any Bell's Peal can be undone, and those that were involved... hellfire....
I just keep reciting, with all my heart The Lord's Prayer (Thy Kingdom Come, Thy Will Be Done on earth as it is in Heaven. ...)
Cancer may have been the reason on Mom's Death Cert, but I'm sure she died years before, of a broken heart...
So, please, just join me in thanking God for another day closer to Heaven, where injustice won't live.
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