Posted on Nov 20, 2015
CW4 Unmanned Aircraft Systems Operations Technician
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PO3 Electrician's Mate
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Edited 9 y ago
lol I remember a question asked in a novel ... the good guys use high tech imaging equipment to basically shoot every bad guys without them even know the good guys are there, and one of the good guy ask their team leader ... isn't that an act of a coward?

The team leader answer:"Call me coward everyday you want, I am bring everyone home"
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CPO Andy Carrillo, MS
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No more so than a Spectre gunship or Cobra Longbow or cruise missiles launched from offshore. Perhaps when dealing with ISIS and those who support a world-wide caliphate this administration has come to Niccolo Machiavelli's belief that "It is better to be feared than loved, if you cannot be both. If an injury has to be done to a man it should be so severe that his vengeance need not be feared. The first method for estimating the intelligence of a ruler is to look at the men he has around him..." Just sayin'...
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MAJ Hugh Blanchard
MAJ Hugh Blanchard
9 y
Wonderful reference to Machiavelli....
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CPO Andy Carrillo, MS
CPO Andy Carrillo, MS
>1 y
MAJ Hugh Blanchard - I never considered the danger in trying to 'free' a people who wish to remain servile to an ideology, or their political party, or even enslaved to their government benefits. This explains much...
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MAJ Hugh Blanchard
MAJ Hugh Blanchard
>1 y
Chief Carrillo, To some folks, living under a dictator seems natural. Perhaps they have never known anything else. To us, it seems wrong. But we must understand that not everyone wants exactly the same things we do. I recommend freedom as the best way to live - but I am not going to force anyone to do something they don't want to do.
Regards, Hugh
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CPO Andy Carrillo, MS
CPO Andy Carrillo, MS
>1 y
MAJ Hugh Blanchard - I love your answer because it also answers the age old question about why, if there be a God, He doesn't step in and do something about our problems: "I recommend freedom as the best way to live - but I am not going to force anyone to do something they don't want to do.
Regards, God." Well said!
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SP5 Retired
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Edited 9 y ago
The mission is to achieve and objective with minimal loss of friendly resources (lives!). Sorry for the double entry - fat fingers!
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CPT Jack Durish
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This topic requires a very careful and exact definition of terms which puts us in trouble right away. Islamists have very different definitions than those who follow Western philosophy. Those on the opposite sides of the Left/Right ideologically can't debate because they too have vastly different concepts that skew the meanings they ascribe to words. (This is why debate most often devolves into shouting matches.) So, here goes. I believe...

A coward is a person who fails to act or speak out of fear.
Courage is the ability to act or speak in spite of fear.
The person who does not fear when danger is present is neither a coward nor a hero, merely a fool.

Drone operators who do not fear the consequences of their acts are thus, fools.
The drone operators who have acted and spoken out have demonstrated courage in two ways.
I applaud them.

Now, that leaves us at the doorstep of those who make the decisions: Our leaders.

One of the greatest tests of leaders' courage is sending others in harm's way. It is their greatest responsibility and the one that carries the greatest consequences. It seems obvious (to me, at least) that an over-reliance on drones in place of direct action may be construed as an act of cowardice on the part of leaders. They are avoiding risk. They are also fools in failing to recognize the increased danger of collateral damage.

And, yes, I am saying that I believe that President Obama is a coward and a fool. I believe he has demonstrated this in many ways. His over reliance on drones is just one, maybe one of the most obvious. It also demonstrates that he is a fool or simply doesn't care about the collateral damage.
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MAJ Hugh Blanchard
MAJ Hugh Blanchard
>1 y
There are big cultural differences, no doubt. A Pakistani General wrote a book which I recommend, "The Islamic Way of War." Eye-opening...
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CPT Jack Durish
CPT Jack Durish
>1 y
GySgt John Olson - You should read Mark Twain's Letters From Earth (if you haven't already) He touches on this very subject with great humor and insight (but don't think I'm stealing your thunder. You articulated the concept very well)
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CPT Jack Durish
CPT Jack Durish
>1 y
MAJ Hugh Blanchard - I'll have to look into that one. Thanks for mentioning it.
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SSG Audwin Scott
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If drones are helping us get the advantage of taking out the enemy and saving more of our troops, of course not!
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MSgt F 35 Weapons Requirements Manager
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No. I don't see it as being any different than high altitude bombing, cruise missile strikes, or naval bombardment.
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SrA Daniel Hunter
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I wonder if soldiers in WWI asked the same question about tanks and flying machines.
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Capt Seid Waddell
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Edited 9 y ago
It might be good to ask 11B's in contact with the enemy if the drone pilot that took out an enemy emplacement that they faced if they thought that the drone pilot was part of the combat team.

As to the four airmen in the article, we had the same thing back in the '60s and '70s - the Viet Nam Veterans Against the War. This is more a political statement than an objective analysis, IMHO.
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Lt Col Scott Shuttleworth
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Websters defines coward as "someone who is too afraid to do what is right or expected : someone who is not at all brave or courageous: one who shows disgraceful fear or timidity." Our drone pilots and operators are definitely not cowards nor is using a drone a cowardly act. Absolutely not. A weapon is a weapon is a weapon. Doesn't matter if it comes off the wing of a drone, manned jet, ship, artillery, or directly from the hands of a infantry man...somebody in the loop made the decision to send that weapon on its way. The enemy is just as dead. It reduces risk, is cheap to operate, and we get the same result. Cowardly no!!! Smartest thing we could do...absolutely. War isn't fair, it is about exploiting your capabilities to win and ensuring our guys come home safe. This is an effective way to win.
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Capt Brandon Charters
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No. Ever since warriors were using bows and arrows, man has strategically distanced himself on the battlefield. Autonomous systems are no different.
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MSgt Marvin Kinderknecht
MSgt Marvin Kinderknecht
9 y
I believe whenever munitions are used, there will be collateral damage. The Airforce cannot pick out Joe but not Jim when we drop bombs. A drone cannot do that either.
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