Posted on Mar 20, 2014
Initial entry soldiers barely meeting standards; how can we build them up?
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More and more soldiers are arriving at their first duty station barely meeting Army standards for pt tests. Is this a product of the anti - hazing climate change in the Army restricting Drill Sergeants from producing better soldier's, or are the volun-told duties lowering the want to produce more capable soldiers? How can we as NCOs build Physically and mentally fit soldier's when the toughening phase in basic is barely better than initial conditioning from the delayed entry program?
Note: Image added by RP staff
Note: Image added by RP staff
Physical Training
APFT
Standards
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 9
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SSG (Join to see) by experience, I think that AIT breaks down all the hard work done in BCT. You go from healthy food, 3 times a day with 0 snacks, not eating from 1700 to 0700, fasting cardio, 3 runs a week, plus all the pushups you do when you messed it up TO pizza weekends, going to the mall and eat whatever you want, lazy PTs in the mornings, snacks at the school, etc. On top of that you have HRAP, Home Recruiting Assistance Program, that's 2 weeks with no PT, eating whatever you want at your hometown. When you get to your first unit station, you have the first week of inprocessing plus most people get PTDY if they are married. So, when you get to your first APFT at your first unit station, the last time that you got an organized PT was more than a month ago and your diet is long forgotten. If the soldier didn't build the discipline to do PT on their own, didn't watch his diet plus have the stress of the new experience, he is against all odds. I think AIT should keep up the hard work done in BCT, with some freedom but watching the physical fitness of the soldiers.
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SSG (Join to see)
I came through osut, no ait for me. 16 weeks at the same station, same drills. I came in at a 211 and left basic with a 299 and a ranger bat contract. I worked hard every day and not by choice all the time. We were destroyed physically and driven to mental fatigue every day. But that climate has changed dramatically in the last 4 years. The way our iet soldiers are treated and trained has dropped. The strive to exceed the standard is overshadowed by the complaints of hardship by the soldiers.... this should not be. How can I/we as NCOs prepare soldiers for war and the army lifestyle if BCT/OSUT is considered a hardship?
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I could do 11 pull-ups at entry. 1 week later into boot I could do 3. I was about there all through boot. A few months later after grad I could do 19 by any method.
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SSG (Join to see)
The crackdown on "hazing" has drill sergeants and BCT companies doing the bare minimum to train soldiers. I just had two guys show up with 214 and 224 scores. I entered BCT at a 202 and left at a 299. That was 4 years ago. This is nuts.
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Sgt Packy Flickinger
Mine wasn't hazing, it was fuel. I was bodybuilding when I went in. I ate 8000 calories a day and still had only 1% body fat. I couldn't get enough to eat in boot camp. Week 4 in boot camp I weighed 136 lbs. at 6'2".
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SSgt (Join to see)
I had a very similar experience. I graduated OSUT with a 204 pt score, and in a lot of pain. The PT for the entire experience was worthless, because it was one size fits all, entirely focused on recruits loosing weight, something I didn't need at all.
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Sgt Packy Flickinger
Did you find group pt run incredibly hard running at the slow pace? More like a fast March with a little bounce.
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The requirement for graduation is to achieve a 50-50-50 APFT (50 per event) and then it's up to the unit to ensure the Soldier passes their APFT. While in theory it is easy to accomplish (using PRT), it is somewhat challenging for the Squad Leader as the expectation is that the newly arrived Soldier will be able to meet all minimum standards once they graduate OSUT/AIT.
Some of the Soldiers join the military so out of shape it that you wouldn't believe it. I've witnessed Soldiers lose more than 60 pounds during BCT 60 pounds! There were mothers and families that could not recognize their Soldier at BCT graduation. It is difficult to change a lifetime of sedation in a few weeks.
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SPC (Join to see)
Also, I personally, coming in at the point when NCO's were still allowed to do "wall to wall counseling" as I've heard it called, and seeing the new soldiers coming in, not only is there an inability to complete the APFT to satisfactory standards becoming rampant, but the new soldiers lack respect for both soldiers who deserve it and their NCO leadership. I have witnessed soldiers get torn up because they "forgot" to stand at Parade Rest for 1SG.
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