Posted on Mar 27, 2015
Wait time after submitting an award, (DA Form 638)
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What is the ideal turn around time for an award after it has it has been submitted. Some awards, such as the Army Achievement Medal, are only a Battalion Commanders Approval. Shouldn't that be a quick turn around? What about a higher award?
What do you do if you haven't got a response and it is appears to be lost in the system rather than the approval authority denying? In that case has anyone been denied an award and had the form returned saying such? I haven't found any regulation yet specifying a time frame or approval yet. It may be out there but I didn't see it in good ol' AR 600-8-22.
What do you do if you haven't got a response and it is appears to be lost in the system rather than the approval authority denying? In that case has anyone been denied an award and had the form returned saying such? I haven't found any regulation yet specifying a time frame or approval yet. It may be out there but I didn't see it in good ol' AR 600-8-22.
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 14
CPT (Join to see) , how does it go, "Do unto others..."
First off, nothing should sit in a commander's box unless there is a reason for reflection, research or more information. As LTC (Join to see) said, the XO needs to ensure the paper keeps moving.
Secondly, leaders really miss the point of the administrative awards (in contrast to awards for valor et al, which need a deliberate process for what I hope are obvious reasons). Submitting someone for an award on a DA 638 is less about the four achievements; it is about the soldier's service or a particular achievement that can be adjudicated in a conversation or a phone call in three minutes or less; e.g. "Hey sir, I want to submit 1LT Rosa for an AAM because he kicked butt during annual training." As a commander, the answer is either "ok" or "nope", possibly, "let's talk about it" but the first two are probably the norm.
For service awards, it has to do with overall performance and level of responsibility. A CSM and a commander in any command can tell you right now who are the exceptions -- the PSGs or SSGs who we want to push for an MSM or the ones we want to give less than the norm -- i.e. the Lieutenant that only rates an AAM.
So what takes so long? Procrastination. Inefficiency. Lack of respect. One thing I detested in the military was the "staffing", whereby people who had no real interest in a matter kept an action for weeks to sign off on that action. The common one is to hear that the S1 shop has to review the DA 638 for errors, because if their are errors on the form, it would like bad in their files. While I have never known a typo on an award form to cost an NCO a promotion to Master Sergeant, I do know that the total document is less than about 1000 words -- does it take weeks for multiple soldiers, NCOs and officers to review a two-page document for typos, especially with spell-check?
When you command, treat every award as if it was for you, meaning if you knew your boss sat on an award for a period of time out of apathy or laziness, how would that make you feel. Commanders and their senior NCO counterparts are responsible for ensuring the efficiency of the processes. In my experience, the Army does not do a good job in this regard.
First off, nothing should sit in a commander's box unless there is a reason for reflection, research or more information. As LTC (Join to see) said, the XO needs to ensure the paper keeps moving.
Secondly, leaders really miss the point of the administrative awards (in contrast to awards for valor et al, which need a deliberate process for what I hope are obvious reasons). Submitting someone for an award on a DA 638 is less about the four achievements; it is about the soldier's service or a particular achievement that can be adjudicated in a conversation or a phone call in three minutes or less; e.g. "Hey sir, I want to submit 1LT Rosa for an AAM because he kicked butt during annual training." As a commander, the answer is either "ok" or "nope", possibly, "let's talk about it" but the first two are probably the norm.
For service awards, it has to do with overall performance and level of responsibility. A CSM and a commander in any command can tell you right now who are the exceptions -- the PSGs or SSGs who we want to push for an MSM or the ones we want to give less than the norm -- i.e. the Lieutenant that only rates an AAM.
So what takes so long? Procrastination. Inefficiency. Lack of respect. One thing I detested in the military was the "staffing", whereby people who had no real interest in a matter kept an action for weeks to sign off on that action. The common one is to hear that the S1 shop has to review the DA 638 for errors, because if their are errors on the form, it would like bad in their files. While I have never known a typo on an award form to cost an NCO a promotion to Master Sergeant, I do know that the total document is less than about 1000 words -- does it take weeks for multiple soldiers, NCOs and officers to review a two-page document for typos, especially with spell-check?
When you command, treat every award as if it was for you, meaning if you knew your boss sat on an award for a period of time out of apathy or laziness, how would that make you feel. Commanders and their senior NCO counterparts are responsible for ensuring the efficiency of the processes. In my experience, the Army does not do a good job in this regard.
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SSG John Bacon
I used to love doing things directly from the regulations. They always get kicked back for corrections because it wasn't in the "approved format" Then when you try to educate your S1 on what a correct format looks like and you get a talking to by your 1SG. Then soldiers want to know where the award went and you have to tell then that you need 4 bullets for an AAM because that is the BN Standard. So frustrating when you try and do it the correct way and every body else doesn't.
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Awards approved at battalion commander level authority should take 1 week for turnaround on average. 2 weeks max if the unit is really busy with training etc.
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LTC (Join to see)
CPT Aaron Kletzing Are you a Seinfeld fan? Have you seen the episode where Puddy is selling Jerry a car and admits that some of the add-ons are just made up? Â Knowing what I know now, awards approved at the battalion command level should be measured in days and hours, not weeks. Â Those commanders that take longer have no one to blame but themselves. We're talking about a two-page form document with very little actual texts.
But your estimate is a great improvement over what I would say is the "norm".
But your estimate is a great improvement over what I would say is the "norm".
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CPT (Join to see)
Just so you know it has 3 months now and not word yet. I have pushed it up but I have lost faith in how they use the award system. It is pretty sad when I recommend and award a soldier in a timely manner.
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CPT Aaron Kletzing
CPT (Join to see) is it bogged down at an above-company level? Can you get your 1SG involved? There was an instance for me personally where an award I wrote up for a SGT in my company was at a standstill at battalion level. I requested a quick mtg with the battalion CSM and respectfully stood in front of him and personally explained why this award needed to go through and why the Soldier had earned it. It got through the next day.
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As a BN XO now, all awards run through me. I insist upon a 72 hour turn around from the S1 shop and command team for corrections, as well as with the Batteries when the corrections are sent down.
With respect to signatures, it is your BN CDRs perspective of when he signs but in my opinion the BN XO is failing if he allows his boss to sit on awards for more than 72 hours.
With respect to signatures, it is your BN CDRs perspective of when he signs but in my opinion the BN XO is failing if he allows his boss to sit on awards for more than 72 hours.
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CPT Aaron Kletzing
LTC (Join to see) -- CPT (Join to see) just updated us this morning that there has been no movement on the award after 3 months. What should be do now? Is it too much for him to chat with the BN XO about it?
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LTC (Join to see)
CPT Aaron Kletzing & CPT (Join to see) Not at all. Talk to him as soon as you want to, that long is completely unacceptable in my book. I would have the ass if my S1 shop allowed any award to sit anywhere close to this long.
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