Posted on Oct 8, 2019
What should I do if I am being asked to do counselings for my soldiers while on convalescent leave?
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Okay, so I’m on con leave for the next 60 days. I just had a cyst removed off my tail bone. I’m in a team leader slot, but squad leader just was on con leave in the begging march this past year till the ending of June. He never answered his phone once for us, texts or anything like so. Now he’s telling me that just cause I’m on con leave, I still have to do my counselings for my guys and get all these papers together. I’m just one day out of surgery. So my question is what should I do? My hardest thing is my hard slot e6 didn’t do shit while he was on con leave such as, not respond to us or text or anything. But expects myself to do all these. I just don’t understand.
Advice
Counseling
Leave
Posted 5 y ago
Responses: 13
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You tell him that you can't effectively counsel Soldier who you haven't seen. It would be a disservice to them.
Don't compare yourself to people you don't want to be like, that's a slippery slope into Shitbag Creek. Be the kind of leader you want to be, preferably one who takes care fo their Soldiers. However, you can't do that fairly without being their to evaluate their performance. Respond that to the Squad Leader and let it rest. If he has an issue with it he can hoot and holler and threaten, but he can't actually do anything. Squad leaders can't give article 15s and you are on a Commander authorized leave of absence. Until he out ranks the commander, your job is to stay away from work.
Don't compare yourself to people you don't want to be like, that's a slippery slope into Shitbag Creek. Be the kind of leader you want to be, preferably one who takes care fo their Soldiers. However, you can't do that fairly without being their to evaluate their performance. Respond that to the Squad Leader and let it rest. If he has an issue with it he can hoot and holler and threaten, but he can't actually do anything. Squad leaders can't give article 15s and you are on a Commander authorized leave of absence. Until he out ranks the commander, your job is to stay away from work.
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SFC (Join to see)
SPC (Join to see) as I said, you tell him that and stop responding. You're on an authorized leave of absence. Carefully explain to him that "the top" doesn't outrank the commander and when the commander instructs you to come off leave you will be there, and that this is the last time you'll be responding, then turn off your phone.
This is one case where you have to let them fail so they are forced to do the right thing. They want you to write the counseling so that they have their little boxed check when they are inspected. You need to force them to take responsibility for their part and assign someone else to do the effective counseling.
This is one case where you have to let them fail so they are forced to do the right thing. They want you to write the counseling so that they have their little boxed check when they are inspected. You need to force them to take responsibility for their part and assign someone else to do the effective counseling.
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SPC (Join to see)
Rgr that SFC. I’m still in the group chat with my sqd leader. But I haven’t answered phone calls or texts or checked my email at all since last night at 0300. And I don’t plan on doing it any time soon. Thank you SFC.
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SFC Michael Stampley
AR 600-8-10 para 5-3a. Convalescent leave is a nonchargeable absence from duty granted to expedite a Soldier’s return to full duty after
illness, injury, or childbirth. There is your answer. Absence from duty means just that. However......
illness, injury, or childbirth. There is your answer. Absence from duty means just that. However......
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SPC (Join to see), are you asking if you 'have' to do them or if you 'should' do them?
I would be careful conflating your Squad Leader's performance with what you are obligated or compelled to do. You have no idea why the Squad Leader was unable to perform any additional duties while on conleave, and you do not know if they actually knocked out any paperwork to due outs from the PSG.
You are on conclave, an authorized absence from duty. So the easy answer is no, you don't 'have' too. Additionally, if you are a SPC, I would say don't do it, don't answer the phone and don't check your email.
However, you are in a leadership position and as you mentioned to SGT Javier Silva that you have eyes on the stripes of an NCO. Leaders are never off the clock. What if one of your Soldiers is suicidal? Would your perception of your leave status change? Counseling are an integral part of your Soldiers' development. I am not suggesting that you do them because I am pressuring you to be the NCO that I envision. I am merely suggesting what SSgt (Join to see) highlighted, be what you think is a leader.
No one wants to do your job for you, you tried, and you keep going back to your Squad Leader's performance of their duty. If you want to be like them, go for it. The regulation has your back. But I guarantee your Soldiers will view you just like you view the Squad Leader.
Like I said, this is a question for your gut, as a leader, we have to do the right thing, even when we don't 'have' to. I don't agree with SPC (Join to see), even though he is correct. There have been times I told Soldiers to make sure they take care of themselves, but that type of selfishness only grows in you as you pin on more rank and responsibility and eventually you end up a garbage leader or worse.
I would be careful conflating your Squad Leader's performance with what you are obligated or compelled to do. You have no idea why the Squad Leader was unable to perform any additional duties while on conleave, and you do not know if they actually knocked out any paperwork to due outs from the PSG.
You are on conclave, an authorized absence from duty. So the easy answer is no, you don't 'have' too. Additionally, if you are a SPC, I would say don't do it, don't answer the phone and don't check your email.
However, you are in a leadership position and as you mentioned to SGT Javier Silva that you have eyes on the stripes of an NCO. Leaders are never off the clock. What if one of your Soldiers is suicidal? Would your perception of your leave status change? Counseling are an integral part of your Soldiers' development. I am not suggesting that you do them because I am pressuring you to be the NCO that I envision. I am merely suggesting what SSgt (Join to see) highlighted, be what you think is a leader.
No one wants to do your job for you, you tried, and you keep going back to your Squad Leader's performance of their duty. If you want to be like them, go for it. The regulation has your back. But I guarantee your Soldiers will view you just like you view the Squad Leader.
Like I said, this is a question for your gut, as a leader, we have to do the right thing, even when we don't 'have' to. I don't agree with SPC (Join to see), even though he is correct. There have been times I told Soldiers to make sure they take care of themselves, but that type of selfishness only grows in you as you pin on more rank and responsibility and eventually you end up a garbage leader or worse.
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SPC (Join to see)
Rgr that CSM. I’ve been working on them throughout the night. I can’t sleep and just busted them out last night. My guys are supposed to be stopping by this week to drop papers off to me that they had to get done.
And your correct, as a team leader(clearly you were one too) I love my job. I love my guys. I’m always there for them in any way necessary. And yes, I would definelty drop my leave and have my wife drive me to wherever if they were suicidal or have any problems. They come before me and my wife gets that and understand that picture now.
I do have my eyes on stripes. That’s all I want to get. So I can help and guide my guys a whole lot better than I do now in my abilities.
And your correct, as a team leader(clearly you were one too) I love my job. I love my guys. I’m always there for them in any way necessary. And yes, I would definelty drop my leave and have my wife drive me to wherever if they were suicidal or have any problems. They come before me and my wife gets that and understand that picture now.
I do have my eyes on stripes. That’s all I want to get. So I can help and guide my guys a whole lot better than I do now in my abilities.
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CSM William Everroad
I agree with you, but I am not encouraging him to perform duties, I am encouraging him to find a real reason not to do it other than the fact that his crappy Squad Leader didn't.
The fact that it altered his perception of the Squad Leader's professionalism when he didn't do work on con leave is enough to suggest to me that he has a double standard. He feels that the Squad Leader should have answered the phone, but didn't, and now he wants to know if it is ok to blow him off for that reason. I merely want him to go through the thought process of what he is actually obligated to do.
I already mentioned the doesn't have to, and if he were a union worker in a civilian job, that would be the end of it. Civilians don't have to run into enemy fire to pull out one of their troops, and neither does a Soldier, but... they 'should'.
Little things like this in the normal course of an NCO's duties forms the core of who and what they will be in the end. Check the Army values. The extra effort we put in will never be rewarded, and sometimes punished, but we are here to take care of and train troops.
There are creative solutions to every problem. Honestly, I would ask them to come by the house and do it there if they were willing, just to get them knocked out and not have to worry about it when I got back.
The fact that it altered his perception of the Squad Leader's professionalism when he didn't do work on con leave is enough to suggest to me that he has a double standard. He feels that the Squad Leader should have answered the phone, but didn't, and now he wants to know if it is ok to blow him off for that reason. I merely want him to go through the thought process of what he is actually obligated to do.
I already mentioned the doesn't have to, and if he were a union worker in a civilian job, that would be the end of it. Civilians don't have to run into enemy fire to pull out one of their troops, and neither does a Soldier, but... they 'should'.
Little things like this in the normal course of an NCO's duties forms the core of who and what they will be in the end. Check the Army values. The extra effort we put in will never be rewarded, and sometimes punished, but we are here to take care of and train troops.
There are creative solutions to every problem. Honestly, I would ask them to come by the house and do it there if they were willing, just to get them knocked out and not have to worry about it when I got back.
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SPC (Join to see)
that’s what gets me CSM, you taught right for so long and see the way RIGHT is. But then you have a leader, someone you look up to, change things. Make it easier. “I’m on con leave and I don’t need to acknowledge my guys. I’ll see them once I get back”. And it does alter the way I look at things between what’s right and wrong. After being taught right for so long.
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Emulate and be the leader you want to be. If you're just doing the counseling to complete the required paperwork, maybe who ever fills in for you will do it or backdate it when you return. If your are trying to train and guide your soldiers it may be something you want to do. It is convalescence leave so focus on your recovery, but remember do you want your soldiers saying this about you when you return.
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SPC (Join to see)
Your right sgt. I started doing a couple monthly’s, that’s what’s due. But they have to update everything too, so they’d have to bring les,erb,Medpros,car inspections, insurance and drivers license both civ and military. I told my highest ranking under me which is a brand new pfc that he’s gonna step up into my position and he said no. I just let my squad leader know and he said that nobody in my team will be a team leader besides me.. I talked to the other team leader in our squad which is a SGT and he said that he already has his team. That’s he’s not going to take mine while I’m out for these 60 days
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