Posted on Feb 16, 2018
What do you think the education curriculum should be?
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I think kids need to be taught more useful subjects. English, math, health, gym, history, computers are a gimmie, but I think most kids should be limited to accounting because most math as adults is money related. Additionally, teach things like: Home Ec, How to change oil/tire, apply for loans, interview for jobs, accounting, CPR/AED/First Aid, etc. What do you think?
Education
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United States
Teaching
Teacher
Posted 7 y ago
Responses: 23
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I think logic and critical thinking should be taught from an early age. Philosophy teaches us how to break down an argument and create intelligent counter points, identify unreliable information, and just generally HOW to think in a logical step by step process. As opposed what we see today - emotionally driven arguments, louder rhetoric, and disreputable information.
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CPO Lou Oliver
While I agree with you, I also believe that basic skills need to be taught as well. If one is going to go to college, fine teach those students advanced math and such as part of a college prep course. However trig and precal never helped balance a checkbook, therefore even these students need math for life skills. The best system would be the three way system of old. In addition to the college prep route you would have a basic education for those going into retail, updated to include computers, which are part of modern life. Finally, a vocation route that teaches the math and science as it relates to the trades, and by the trades I mean not just your brick layers or auto shop students, I include nurses and dental aids as well. I also believe that we need our schools to focus on the early history of the US, for it is what makes us Americans and capitalist.
Today, even your college senior is likely to not understand why we have an electoral college or the difference between a democracy, which the US is not, and a republic.
Today, even your college senior is likely to not understand why we have an electoral college or the difference between a democracy, which the US is not, and a republic.
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SGT Denny Espinosa
I agree that critical thinking is a must: looking at the same issue from all angles, then coming up with multiple arguments/reasons both pro and con. This can go a long way to removing any blinders we might be unknowingly wearing. Thinking logically, step-by-step, is covered via Math. Remember having to break down the problem, then prove the results by plugging in the solution and solving it backwards? (example: If 1+2=3, then 3-2=1)
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PFC Jim Wheeler
I think philosophy gets a bad rep from a lot of people as "useless," but I truly think it has more value than many subjects that are taught in schools.
I think a good philosophy course would go over some of the more famous philosophical thinkers (Plato, Aristotle, Aurelius, Montesquieu; and even some of the Eastern philosophers i.e. Confucius, Sun Tzu) and the basics of logic and reason. This would teach students how to analyze and understand documents, how to construct logical arguments and debate effectively, and valuable critical thinking skills that can assist in every other school subject.
I think a good philosophy course would go over some of the more famous philosophical thinkers (Plato, Aristotle, Aurelius, Montesquieu; and even some of the Eastern philosophers i.e. Confucius, Sun Tzu) and the basics of logic and reason. This would teach students how to analyze and understand documents, how to construct logical arguments and debate effectively, and valuable critical thinking skills that can assist in every other school subject.
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SFC Jerry Humphries
Today kids are being indoctrinated not educated, they are being told what to think not how to think for themselves, I agree the need critical thinking skills so they can learn to properly question and debate issues. Reading, writing and mathematics, another thing that would be to their benefit local ,state, American history not (throw out Howard Zinn's version)but they way it used to be taught, and Civics.
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As the old guy in this conversation, the weak point in the American Education system, aside from methodology that isn't working well, is the belief and focus that every that graduates needs to go to college. What's happened is that Public Education has generally abandoned the notion of vocational education and the places that do have it, the programs tend to be weak and often outdated. If you look at the educational model of much of Western Europe, they tend to split the educational course of the students around middle school and the non college bound students steered into real apprenticeship programs learning real world skills that are applicable to the nations industries. Here we graduate them with a mediocre scholastic education and no life skills with the qualifications to flip burgers at the nearest McDonalds. Those that can afford it can then go to a technical school to learn some real world skill, or join the Military and hopefully come out with a skill or at least money to go back to school and learn one, and the rest are left to work at Walmart.
I won't get into the growing trend of demanding BA/BS's for jobs that don't require the skills. I believe that trend is driven by that situation above, people graduate High School here with no marketable skill or work experience.
Getting down off my soapbox now.
I won't get into the growing trend of demanding BA/BS's for jobs that don't require the skills. I believe that trend is driven by that situation above, people graduate High School here with no marketable skill or work experience.
Getting down off my soapbox now.
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CPT Lawrence Cable
SGT Charles Bartell - After almost 20 years, in many markets they are the only Carpenters, but I've worked around and with them since the 90's and I can say that their carpentry skills were non-existent at the time, as were their masonry skills and general concrete work. They don't build they way we do in Mexico and Central America. But years of experience around the illegals tells me that they are just like all the rest of the guys, the boss ain't around and they slack off, they will get drunk and miss work, get in trouble with law and disappear, or sneak behind the building to smoke a joint. The early illegals tended to be farm boys that were used to hard work, by 2000 the majority were city kids with varied work experience, and a very high proportion have little education.
I admire many of them, and if I lived in one of the shitholes these guys lived in, I would probably swim the river too. But their presence destroyed the wage scales in the industry that is just now starting to recover. I've heard opinions similar to yours from every builder trying to justify hiring them, but in the reality is that the reason they get hired is that they work cheaper. Not better, not harder, cheaper.
Apprenticeships in Europe are more like work studies or internships here and attached to the education system.
I admire many of them, and if I lived in one of the shitholes these guys lived in, I would probably swim the river too. But their presence destroyed the wage scales in the industry that is just now starting to recover. I've heard opinions similar to yours from every builder trying to justify hiring them, but in the reality is that the reason they get hired is that they work cheaper. Not better, not harder, cheaper.
Apprenticeships in Europe are more like work studies or internships here and attached to the education system.
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SGT Beth Day
Ironically much of that belief is a result of the post WWII GI bill. Before that it was mostly rich, elite kids that had the opportunity for college. Some scholarship or working thru, but not a lot. Because of the GI Bill literally millions of people who never thought of college could attend. It was an amazing shift in the attitude toward American education ... and often overlooked. Now things started to shift to "college for all" and "college is the only way to success".
Not true. Not every person is cut out for traditional college ... either by ability or desire. And competition of 4 years of college is not a guarantee of success.
Having said that, post secondary (or possibly concurrent secondary) training is essential. Soon there will be very few burger flipping jobs. Instead someone to fix the robotics will be needed.
Not true. Not every person is cut out for traditional college ... either by ability or desire. And competition of 4 years of college is not a guarantee of success.
Having said that, post secondary (or possibly concurrent secondary) training is essential. Soon there will be very few burger flipping jobs. Instead someone to fix the robotics will be needed.
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CPT Lawrence Cable
SGT Beth Day - Why does it have to be post secondary? Vocational training in Europe begins around what we would refer to as Middle School. What we need to do is major reform to the educational system to make it relevant to the needs of the real world when theses kids get out instead of wasting time teaching them this modern version of "New Math", the developers of both which should be taken out and horsewhipped. I am not against Better, I'm against New for New's sake (never see that in the Military, do we :^0). As an example of better, the trend towards Distance Learning is a positive thing IMO. Getting away from the language and math teaching methods that put a man on the moon for some modern mumbo jumbo isn't.
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SGT Beth Day
It doesn't. And if you actually read my post carefully I had noted OR CONCURRENT secondary education.
I might add I'm exceptionally aware of how various European education systems work as I have hosted international high school students for over 20 years. Some things could transfer to the US, some not. It would be a big mistake to say European schools do everything right and we do everything wrong. There is good and bad to be taken from both.
I might add I'm exceptionally aware of how various European education systems work as I have hosted international high school students for over 20 years. Some things could transfer to the US, some not. It would be a big mistake to say European schools do everything right and we do everything wrong. There is good and bad to be taken from both.
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I believe you’ll find most of those classes are offered. It a matter of emphasis. Which are REQUIRED and which are ELECTIVE.
As a college professor i was disturbed by the number of students who were functional illiterates/innumerates. Even more disturbing was the huge gaps in their general knowledge or how much of what they knew was JUST PLAIN WRONG.
As a college professor i was disturbed by the number of students who were functional illiterates/innumerates. Even more disturbing was the huge gaps in their general knowledge or how much of what they knew was JUST PLAIN WRONG.
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CPL(P) (Join to see)
I wish I had a class with you. That must have been a trip. I would have had difficulty not piling up the lawsuits as I dropped every single snowflake in the front leaning rest that spouted off neo-Marxist propaganda and used pretty much any word with "ism" attached or asked me to take whatever BS they were saying for granted as they try to sneak in "well, you know," in their attempt to frame things as the slimy weasels they've become.
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