Posted on Aug 11, 2014
How should a SM who is on Permanent Profile have their PT test graded for Promotion Points?
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When I was working towards my Sergeant, I was not on any profile. However, when I was working towards Staff Sergeant, I was on a permanent profile, and when trying to tabulate my points I was trying to find in doctrine how my APFT score was going to be calculated.
According to my S-1 (which, I have never been able to verify this) a Soldier who is on a permanent profile who was injured in the line of duty will get 60 points for the events that they cannot perform/alternate aerobic activity.
According to most leadership, you average the score you received for the events you can do, and apply that to what you cannot do. So, if a Soldier cannot perform the pushups, but maxes the sit-ups and run, they would get a 300.
What do you feel is the way it should be done?
According to my S-1 (which, I have never been able to verify this) a Soldier who is on a permanent profile who was injured in the line of duty will get 60 points for the events that they cannot perform/alternate aerobic activity.
According to most leadership, you average the score you received for the events you can do, and apply that to what you cannot do. So, if a Soldier cannot perform the pushups, but maxes the sit-ups and run, they would get a 300.
What do you feel is the way it should be done?
Posted in these groups: 
APFT
Promotion Points
APFT Promotion Points
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 9
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Are you talking a permanent profile or a temporary profile? If temporary then you simply don't take the PT test until you are off profile. If you are talking permanent profile then you perform the events that are listed in your profile. The most common profile is alternate aerobic event. in that case it would look like this
***FOR PROMOTION POINT PURPOSES ONLY***
Push Ups: 98%
Situ Ups: 100%
2.5 Mile walk: Pass
Total score: 297
Pass the alternate event and you get the average of the other events as your score for the alternate event.
***EDIT***
I just had time to get in the reg and this is what AR 600-8-19 has to offer.
"(1)Permanent profiles.
(a)Those Soldiers with permanent physical profiles for the sit-up and/or push-ups events will be granted 60 points
for each event waived and use the actual score for each event taken and must qualify on the 2–mile run or approved
alternate test according to FM 21–20.
(b)Effective 1 April 1995, Soldiers taking an alternate event for the 2–mile run and receiving a passing score
receive a score for that event equal to the average of the scores for the other two events.
(2)Temporary profiles.
(a)Soldiers with a temporary profile that prohibits taking one or more events of the APFT will use their current APFT score provided it is not more than 1 year old at the time of the promotion point computation and the Soldier was
not afforded the opportunity to take an APFT or an authorized alternate test.
***FOR PROMOTION POINT PURPOSES ONLY***
Push Ups: 98%
Situ Ups: 100%
2.5 Mile walk: Pass
Total score: 297
Pass the alternate event and you get the average of the other events as your score for the alternate event.
***EDIT***
I just had time to get in the reg and this is what AR 600-8-19 has to offer.
"(1)Permanent profiles.
(a)Those Soldiers with permanent physical profiles for the sit-up and/or push-ups events will be granted 60 points
for each event waived and use the actual score for each event taken and must qualify on the 2–mile run or approved
alternate test according to FM 21–20.
(b)Effective 1 April 1995, Soldiers taking an alternate event for the 2–mile run and receiving a passing score
receive a score for that event equal to the average of the scores for the other two events.
(2)Temporary profiles.
(a)Soldiers with a temporary profile that prohibits taking one or more events of the APFT will use their current APFT score provided it is not more than 1 year old at the time of the promotion point computation and the Soldier was
not afforded the opportunity to take an APFT or an authorized alternate test.
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1SG (Join to see)
You will learn that "common knowledge/sense" is not as common as you may think SFC (Join to see)
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1SG Frank Rocha
if the temporary profile is for longer than 90 days an APFT can be administered so long as an aerobic event (2 mile run or approved alternate aerobic event) is performed.
AR 350-1, Para. 1-24e(4) states "Soldiers with temporary profiles of long duration (more than 3 months) may also take an alternate test if approved by the commander and health care personnel."
AR 350-1, Para. 1-24e(4) states "Soldiers with temporary profiles of long duration (more than 3 months) may also take an alternate test if approved by the commander and health care personnel."
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Do I agree with the way it is done? No, not really, because I have always maxed my push-ups and done average on my sit-ups. This means that no matter how fast I walk my score has already been decided as long as I pass. Prior to my permanent profile my PT score averaged about 280-290, with a permanent profile my score is 250-270. So yes looking towards E-6s, I already have fewer promotion points. The current regulation does not inspire SMs with permanent profiles to put forth their best effort, that's for sure.
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SFC (Join to see)
I agree with you a lot. I know when I was vying for SSG the struggle was, indeed, real. However, I have always remained split on this topic. While it sucks for those who have injuries based on combat, training exercises, etc. to be graded on things that we simply have no control over, those who are physically able to complete all 3 events feel that we profile personnel are getting an unfair advantage.
It is a double edged sword.
It is a double edged sword.
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SGT Kristin Wiley
It is, and I have no recommendations for changing it. Other soldiers might score higher with it the way it is. It's not ideal, but I would change the height/weight standards anyday before any fitness standards.
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AR 600-8-19, Enlisted Promotions and Reductions will have the answer you are looking for. As for how it is done, it doesn't bother me. I do not worry about what other people are getting for points while on profile and such. Too often, we are worried about what someone else is getting. I focus on me. I focus on doing my three events and doing the best I can to get the best score possible. If I got upset about what I thought to be a percieved injustice by the Army, then I would spend my whole day whining about how someone has it easy or better. Continune to focus on your and don't worry about what somoene else thinks. They are not signing your paychecks nor helping you in your career.
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SFC (Join to see)
And, while I agree with your mindset, I feel that the issue has merit. I agree that physical fitness is a individual thing MSG, and that your resume at the end of the day should have more to it that simply your PT Score. A physical handicap is something that can be overcome.
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1SG Mike Case
Does the arguement have merit, sure, but lots of arguements in the Army have merit. That is the problem I see. Everyone is worried about what is going on outside of their foxhole. What would your fix be for a Soldier on a permanent profile? Do we evaluate every permant profile and say whether or not they will get to average their score or simply get a go? I have not ever seen a rash of promotions because they got the extra points on an APFT because one or two events was averaged.
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