Awards
Awards
Posted on Nov 6, 2013
PCS, Impact, Deployment, and other awards: Should they be determined by rank?
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Should a commander be able to say that they will only give a Bronze Star Medal to SSGs and above? Is this how awards are determined IAW AR 600-8-22? What if a SGT or below has met the criteria to earn a more prestigious award? Why does BDE or higher say that they are only alloted a certain number of awards for deployment or PCS or for an impact award? If your repsonse is "Tradition" or "That's the way it always has been," does that make it right?
Deployment
Awards
PCS
Posted 11 y ago
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I specifically wrote about this in my letter of resignation from active duty. Officially the Navy states in the SECNAV 1650.1 that rank can never be used as a determinant for an award, but in practice it is all the time. This demoralizes junior officers and all enlisted, as even a terrible O4 departing a ship as department head receives a COM, while an E6 who essentially ran the department receives his umpteenth NAM. This practice is one of the main reasons why good and competitive personnel leave the service. Additionally, awards are also given out way too frequently. The awards manual says that it should only be given when going above and beyond one's job, but we see them given as "deployment" or "end of tour awards". This practice should stop and only spot awards should be given for service that is truly above and beyond what is expected.
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Capt (Join to see)
I have seen a lot of this before, but thankfully I know of a few exceptions (I have a particular example in mind). I agree this consistently happens across all services, but it is not the rule and should not be.
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CMC Robert Young
LT, I concur. The USCG takes a similar approach particularly with the end of tour award. I have a number of very strong E4-E6s who have accomplished exceptional things and when I have submitted the CG1650 to the department head, been told to hold the information for an end of tour award. My question is always "Why are we waiting two more years to recognize what was clearly superior work now?" Lunacy! And that situation is far too often degraded by the level of the award being issued. Es get LOCs (an award so low it's not recognized by any other service) or CGAMs; and the O4 & up crowd gets at least the CGCM if not the MSM. The process is broken.
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SGT(P) (Join to see)
Respectfully, I'd have to disagree with you SFC Gates. The amount of asinine ridiculousness I've seen within the Army in regards to the awards process simply cannot be topped by what you described above. My current unit, until a few months ago, weren't even issuing awards to E-4 and below for this DEPLOYMENT. Yet E-7 and up had already submitted the DA 638's for Bronze Star's....their justification? They don't deserve an award for doing what they're told, and they have no responsibility.
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PO1 Rudy Lopez
SFC Gates, you have to be careful on your assumptions on how the "Navy" and the "Marine Corps" are different in how they handle awards, but remember, the Marine Corps is a Department of the Navy, thus part of the Navy. In fact history shows that the original requirement to become a Marine was your must me an "able body seamen"
Now that the history lesson is over. It is unfair to blanket the Navy as a whole in terms of "passing out awards." You fail to understand that there are tens of thousands of Sailors that fall under Marine Corps purview; Hospital Corpsman, Religious Program Specialist, Personnel Specialist, Doctors, Dentist, Psychologist. All of those Navy personnel fall under a Marine Corps command and their awards are authorized through the governing command.
I spent 15 years in the Navy, 1 year combined Boot Camp, Corpsman School, and Fleet Marine Force School for Corpsman. The next 14 years I spent with either the Marine Corps or Army Special Operations Command. So you'll have to pardon my subtle discomfort when I am lumped into your assessment of "The Navy." You probably didn't intend it to come out that way, but you were probably uninformed. Don't worry, a good number of years back the Master Chief Petty Officer of the Navy didn't really know how many Sailors he had at Camp Pendleton, he thought there were a few hundred, but realistically there is more like a few thousand.
Now that the history lesson is over. It is unfair to blanket the Navy as a whole in terms of "passing out awards." You fail to understand that there are tens of thousands of Sailors that fall under Marine Corps purview; Hospital Corpsman, Religious Program Specialist, Personnel Specialist, Doctors, Dentist, Psychologist. All of those Navy personnel fall under a Marine Corps command and their awards are authorized through the governing command.
I spent 15 years in the Navy, 1 year combined Boot Camp, Corpsman School, and Fleet Marine Force School for Corpsman. The next 14 years I spent with either the Marine Corps or Army Special Operations Command. So you'll have to pardon my subtle discomfort when I am lumped into your assessment of "The Navy." You probably didn't intend it to come out that way, but you were probably uninformed. Don't worry, a good number of years back the Master Chief Petty Officer of the Navy didn't really know how many Sailors he had at Camp Pendleton, he thought there were a few hundred, but realistically there is more like a few thousand.
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<p>If you look at the criterion for a given award, it is outlined specifically what is required for that award. By the nature of the jobs they hold, senior enlisted and officers have more opportunity to have the requisite level of achievement based on their positions. Thus, no matter how fair a given command is, there will always be a perception of favoritism.<br><br>That said, if a command actually has a rank-based standard for the awards, they are absolutely wrong. On my first tour when I was a captain, I put a PFC who worked for me in for a BSM, and I specifically argued with the powers-that-were when they wanted to put me in for the same. He got his BSM. I got my ARCOM. It was just. He was going above and beyond. I was doing my job.<br><br>End of tour awards are silly to begin with. Your campaign medal is your end of tour award. This isn't the Special Olympics (no offense to them at all, I've volunteered there and I'm proud of them). This is the Army. Awards should be given based on the level of excellence accomplished, not based on the opportunity to actually do your job overseas. <br><br>All that said, it is still true that a SFC excelling will more likely have a positive impact on the entire unit than a PFC excelling will. It should not be surprising when more SFCs get BSMs than PFCs. So long as the command isn't biased against the PFCs, or propping up the SFCs, then I think it is acceptable that there is a disparity. </p>
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LTC Paul Labrador
Totally agree. Service awards are based upon impact made on the organization. If a junior soldier or officer made a significant impact, then they deserve the higher award. Period. But as you pointed out, the nature of duties typically assigned to certain ranks often will determine their ability to impact the organization or mission. It's easier for the Commander or Senior NCO to impact than a worker bee private...
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Suspended Profile
Well, to add fuel to the fire, I don't think anyone in any garrison, deployment, position, OR retirement should get an award for doing their job. The deployment award is called the ICM or ACM. PCS awards should not be expected by any Soldier nor given out to everyone because they're leaving. Retirement awards should not be mandatory.<div><br></div><div>Impact awards are the best. If a commander sees something they like, exceptional work, outstanding Soldier, the commander should pull that person over, say "Great job, keep it up, here's a ____ (based on outcome and affect!) medal for your work."</div><div><br></div><div>On the flip side, We (the capital/royal we, the Army) can't write awards to reflect what happened in detail so their is no question the Soldier deserves the recommended award.</div><div><br></div><div>As a final note, MG Petreus approved bronze stars for my E4 and E5 from OIF1 based on the write up and recommendations from the Team Chief and Brigade Commander… no quotas ever mentioned.</div>
SFC (Join to see)
I hear you MAJ Scantlin, I would have no problem with there being no awards for doing your job. But, what about those that volunteer to deploy with another unit to do a job above their paygrade and outside of their MOS? I'm not trying to argue the what ifs but, would that warrant an award?
I agree on the retirement awards too. In all honesty, what good are they? I understand the concept but, can a service member's career be summed up in one award?
I almost wasn't allowed to PCS from Korea because I didn't have a PCS award. Granted, I had to leave under abnormal circumstances and later received my award.
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Suspended Profile
What if's are OK, they help with figuring out all of the loop holes!
The three factors you mentioned, outside of their MOS, above pay grade, and volunteered to fill the position, are huge in any consideration for an award I might recommend a Soldier for. In this case, the Soldier probably did an outstanding job for them if "all" they accomplished was what a trained and correctly-experienced Soldier did for "just their job."
Great questions...
SFC (Join to see)
Thanks Sir! I've just been trying to get as much insight on this subject as I can. I appreciate your honest answers!
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