Posted on Jul 6, 2016
Drowning death of Navy SEAL trainee ruled a homicide by medical examiner
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Some would say that this is the cost of doing business. As a former US Navy Training Safety Manager I think we can, and must, do better. What are your thoughts on this?
Drowning death of Navy SEAL trainee ruled a homicide by medical examiner
Posted from washingtonpost.com
Special Operations
Navy SEALs
Safety Manager
CPO
Posted >1 y ago
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Felt like I was doing the examination myself; such a sad thing to see a Sailor pass and for the lack of control and safety is inexcusable. Training need to be conducted not only for those there to be SEALS but those who are there to instruct them.
Just.....wow.
Just.....wow.
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CPO Mark Lovelace, CSP Maybe comparing apples to oranges but a Marine recruit dies and heads roll, maybe even up to and including the CG at the time and 15 drill instructors are concurrently investigated on allegations of hazing and/or harassment. A Navy SEAL trainee dies, it is ruled a homicide, and the system closes ranks behind the instructor and defends their training methods. Of course the investigation is ongoing. Hopefully there was not a culture among the SEAL instructors which condoned or contributed to extreme training methods such as pushing stressed trainees as in this case until he was unable to recover or gain control of himself and he drowned.
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CPO Mark Lovelace, CSP
Tom I think you are dead on target. I know there is a very fine line between making the training intense enough to be effective, and keeping the trainees safe. I'm afraid that line gets crossed all too regularly.
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SGT Charles W.
Are you talking of regular Marine recruits or Force Recon Recruits, because there is a huge difference in what's expected, tempo of training, etc. My understanding from talking with people from the spec ops community is that part of SEAL training is "dry drwoning" them (meaning making them have increased levels of CO2 and they pass out under water) and then they are easily revived. It's suppose to instill confidence in your team mates. Don't know if it's BS or not, but there are many things that can go wrong doing something like that, but it's something that can happen in reality. But you're right, there's fine line b/t training and stupidity.
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Capt Tom Brown
SGT Charles W. - In this case I was comparing the two separate incidents - the Navy SEAL & the Marine Recruit.
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So, first off, Special Ops is not immune to death, even in training. The training they go through is gruesome, hence why the pass rate is so low. It's crappy that anyone is lost during training, but it happened to a couple of students in RANGER school during swamp phase from hypothermia, etc. etc. We all hear the stories, BUT one thing in this article struck me which is, the trainee was "found to have cardiomegaly". Cardiomegaly by itself kills because the heart is so enlarged that the fibers can't stretch anymore, so the heart barely even contracts, decreasing the flow of blood to the lungs, body/organs, and brain. If this is ruled a homicide, it should be the Doctor that passed him on his medical physical. When cardiomegaly occurs, there are outward and inward signs and symptoms, and they were either missed or overlooked. Either way, he wasn't able to pick-up oxygen from the lungs very effectively and was even more ineffective at delivering oxygen to the brain or tissues/organs of the body. So, yes, this was a tragic accident, BUT it could've been prevented if it was picked up on during the physical.
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CPO Mark Lovelace, CSP
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I'm not a physician (nor do I play one on TV), but I've read that cardiomegaly is fairly common and frequently found in highly trained athletes. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Athletic_heart_syndrome
Shouldn't we have conducted a comprehensive screening on the prospective BUDS candidate to rule out any physical condition which might lead to a catastrophe such as this?
Shouldn't we have conducted a comprehensive screening on the prospective BUDS candidate to rule out any physical condition which might lead to a catastrophe such as this?
Athletic heart syndrome - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Athletic heart syndrome, (AHS) also known as athlete's heart,[1][2] athletic bradycardia or exercise-induced cardiomegaly is a non-pathological condition commonly seen in sports medicine, in which the human heart is enlarged, and the resting heart rate is lower than normal.
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SGT Charles W.
CPO Mark Lovelace, CSP - He should've had an extensive work up to find out if this is what is was or not. Because cardiomegaly is usually from years of untreated high blood pressure forcing the heart to enlarge.
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SGT Charles W.
Capt Tom Brown - I could be wrong, as it could be athletes heart, it's the underlying pathophysiology that is "the devil is in the details". Either way though, whether athletic or not, it still has the same side effects on the body.
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