Why do we spend so much time fighting about how to correct minor infractions?

PO1 Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 16 Oct 2015 18:24:36 -0400

I have been in the Navy for 8 years. In that time I have deployed at sea, gone IA with the Army, and been collocated with intel units from all services including the Coasties. I find that we (all services) spend an inordinate amount of time harassing our subordinates, peers and occasionally our supervisors about minor infractions in uniform. Example 1: A soldier once stopped me and retrieved my name rank and unit info because he thought my mustache was out of regs. Army answer was yes Navy answer was no....frankly does it really matter?
Example 2: A Colonel stopped one of my Airmen in Bagram for wearing a boonie hat because it wasn't Friday. His unit claimed that was unacceptable, our unit politely told him to mind his own business. Why did he care?
I understand that we are all supposed to be professionals and ensure standards are met, but why do we spend so many man hours on silly shit that at the end of the day does not effect mission?

Response by Capt Mark Strobl made Oct 16 at 2015 6:36 PM

Capt Mark Strobl — Fri, 16 Oct 2015 18:36:45 -0400

What may seem benign in garrison will provide an unnecessary distraction when the first bullets fly downrange. Not having to address "silly" things allows everyone to focus on the mission. The "business" is rather unforgiving of those who cannot attend to the petty issues.

Response by SSG Warren Swan made Oct 16 at 2015 6:45 PM

SSG Warren Swan — Fri, 16 Oct 2015 18:45:38 -0400

welcome to the new and improved F*ck F*ck games where bullsh*t happens regularly, the rules are made up, and your feelings do not matter. It's a sad reality tho and not limited by branch of service. This is the main reason I hated going to bigger FOBS. You're dirty? Not in this chow hall. Weapon still loaded? Not on here it isn't. Some of it's required, and I accept that, but to some extremes it's taken is ridiculous.

Response by Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS made Oct 16 at 2015 7:19 PM

Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS — Fri, 16 Oct 2015 19:19:21 -0400

This goes back to my running topic of "Safety is vigilance" however, even great philosophies can be taken to extremes.

One of the phrases I've heard is "the standard you walk past is the standard you accept" which sounds really great in practice. Another great phrase is "is the juice worth the squeeze."

I'm very pro maintaining discipline, and keeping to the standard. I'm also pro not wasting limited resources such as time on absolute silly things.

Does a Colonel (Light or Full) getting involved in minutia positively effect efficiency or morale? Or is this on par with yelling "keep off grass"? If he's doing that, what isn't he doing?

Now if there is valid safety concerns, or parallels to safety concerns... rock on. Let's do this. But there's a certain point where you just walk by and say "Is that mustache in regs?" to which "Yep. Navy regs" and "Oh, my bad. Whoops, carry on."

Response by MSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 16 at 2015 7:20 PM

MSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 16 Oct 2015 19:20:49 -0400

If we can't trust people to do the little things then how can we possibly trust them to do the big things? When I worked on the flight line, little things like FOD can become a huge problem and cost destruction and damage to aircraft or cost lives. Sometimes it's just the little things...

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 17 at 2015 3:18 PM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 17 Oct 2015 15:18:01 -0400

My take on this is that teach not just pride in uniform but attention to detail. That being said however, it the context that the correction is being made and the attitude of the corrector. If I saw a soldier with an obvious uniform violation, I would be sure of it first . I would say something like "Thank you for your service, fellow soldier, just want to mention that your name tag is over the wrong pocket...etc. I also think it should be looked in the context of the leadership/command climate. If it an "anal" atmosphere of pettiness and micro-management, that is clearly wrong.

Response by Cpl Jeff N. made Oct 17 at 2015 3:47 PM

Cpl Jeff N. — Sat, 17 Oct 2015 15:47:20 -0400

Little things add up to big things. It seems like nothing (and sometimes it may be) but discounting attention to detail and, good order and discipline as a waste of time/effort and only as harassment is folly.

“For the want of a nail the shoe was lost,
For the want of a shoe the horse was lost,
For the want of a horse the rider was lost,
For the want of a rider the battle was lost,
For the want of a battle the kingdom was lost,
And all for the want of a horseshoe-nail.”
- Ben Franklin

Response by Cpl Tou Lee Yang made Oct 17 at 2015 8:36 PM

Cpl Tou Lee Yang — Sat, 17 Oct 2015 20:36:24 -0400

this is to give the person (who makes the infraction) a little amount of power. this is one of the reason i'm glad i am no longer in the military. now i can wear flip flop with a white t-shirt without a worry that a power hunger individual would want to show me his balls is bigger.