Posted on Oct 3, 2016
Why do people seem to have a lower opinion of the National Guard than the Army Reserve?
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So I served proudly in the Missouri Army National Guard for 7 years, ETS'd for a short time then I came back and switched over to the Army Reserve. One thing that always seemed to bug me while I was in the Guard was that it was always seemingly looked down on like "a step below" the Army Reserve, whether it was from AD or from civilians who would say "Oh so you're not in the REAL army"
Posted in these groups: USARNG
Army Reserve Elements
Army Reserve Elements
Posted 8 y ago
Responses: 10
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Yes, this is a holdover from the Vietnam War era when the National Guard was looked upon as a dodge to stepping foot in Vietnam and when a majority but not all National Guard units were just muster units for older Veterans to serve out the remainder of their service in peace. It was BS then and it's BS now. Many people forget that NG and USAR units compromised a large chunk of the Soldiers taken captive in the Phillipines in World War II, that later took part in the Bataan Death March. Some forget the role the National Guard played in the Berlin Airlift. And there were plenty of National Guard units that served in Vietnam. The reputation reared it's ugly head again in the 1980's, when the Democratic Governors banded together and attempted to prevent their National Guard units from deploying to Central America, I believe led by everyone's hero, MA Governor Micheal Dukakis. At the time the Democrats thought Central America was going to be Vietnam part II and passed all sorts of obstructionist measures in Congress (one of them made Marine LTC Oliver North famous when he ignored it......Boland Amendment). President Ronald Reagan took the Democratic Governors to court and won decisively that he had the right to deploy troops from the NG anywhere he wanted on the face of the Earth without their consent. That was the last I personally heard of the NG being a protected service that never deployed, early to mid part of Reagan's tenure. After that they started sending NG units to Korea, Germany, Central America, etc, etc. But during the 1980's still the majority of NG units remained CONUS and it really was not until the GWOT that you had mass deployments overseas to Afghanistan and Iraq. National Guard was largely passed over for the first Gulf War in the early 1990's in favor of direct musters from the IRR to Regular Army units. Thank the Pentagon for that decision, NGB attempted to fight it but was rebuffed.
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SPC Erich Guenther
BTW, in defense of the Democrats at the time, Central America was in part a shooting war that we were involved directly in. Ronald Reagan repeatedly denied it to the American People at the time but that was BS as well. It wasn't until the Clinton Administration that the Special Forces troops that took part in the fighting could wear their CIB's in public (some are still pizzed off about that). Furthermore I had a buddy that was in the Army Aviation unit (LT and later CPT) that flew intelligence missions over Central America using Beachcraft King Air Aircraft to intercept radio communications of the Sandinistas and he was regularly shot at as well (never with SAMS only bullet stuff) and he got whatever that pay is called when you get shot at (sorry folks memory fades sometimes). I thought it was funny they were targeting his twin propeller plane with Soviet SAMs at times (they never fired, just lit him up) and called him jokingly "Five O'Clock Charlie" after the MASH 4077 Character, when he came home on leave. He later got a job flying MD-80's for American Airlines on the DFW to Chicago O'Hare route.
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SPC Erich Guenther
Also, no Regular Army troops took part in the shooting war only Special Forces and only in El Salvador I believe. Not sure the extent that Army Aviation via Fixed Wing took part but my buddy said they were CIA Missions flown by the Army so perhaps it was sheltered that way via the CIA vs Army Aviation.....definitely Army Airplanes though as he described them. Oh yeah, and Vietnam Veterans will recognize this but the old CIA Front : Southern Air Transport was also involved in Central America as well it was one of their planes that Eugene Hasenfus was shot down in.........that blew up the whole Iran Contra Affair further. Ronald Reagan had his fingers in the pie in multiple conflicts going on all over the Earth at the time but he kept the uniformed Army out of them as much as possible.
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MCPO (Join to see)
On top of the legacy attitude of "dodging" service, another problem was one of logistics. The RA folks got weapons and equipment out of the box. Once it was broken and used up, it was shipped to the Reserve units, who used them for another decade or more. THEN, when everything was done, the National Guard folks got them.
This was exacerbated with the first Gulf War, when large numbers of NG units were activated, and HORDES of the members dropped out and went AWOL or suddenly became conscientious objectors - some even went on the air. I recall interviews on CNN with NG members saying, "I didn't join to go to war! I only joined for the college benefits!!" There were BUTTLOADS of senior NG brass that were forced to retire because of the shenanigans.
BUT, in the intervening years, they have performed amazingly well. The PROBLEM is that the bad reputation remains. It's slowly fading - considering how many AD folks are working shoulder to shoulder with NG folks. I don't know if it will ever go away, but it's fading...
This was exacerbated with the first Gulf War, when large numbers of NG units were activated, and HORDES of the members dropped out and went AWOL or suddenly became conscientious objectors - some even went on the air. I recall interviews on CNN with NG members saying, "I didn't join to go to war! I only joined for the college benefits!!" There were BUTTLOADS of senior NG brass that were forced to retire because of the shenanigans.
BUT, in the intervening years, they have performed amazingly well. The PROBLEM is that the bad reputation remains. It's slowly fading - considering how many AD folks are working shoulder to shoulder with NG folks. I don't know if it will ever go away, but it's fading...
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SGT (Join to see)
Your response provides so much clarity. As a younger soldier, I've wondered much about this, too.
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Because they just do not realize the many differences between the different services. Most people do not realize that the Guard is older than either the Reserves or the Regular Army. Not that it makes any difference which has been around longer really. Many Guard units can trace their lineage back to the Revolutionary War. Guard members also bring a lot of various skill sets to the fore. We have E-4's in our units that are accomplished businessmen, ER nurses, Paramedics, many Emergency Response and Police that deal with crap everyday. You more than likely will never get that kind of training as an E-4 in the RA, yes sometimes our PT scores aren't as stellar or our marksmanship might lag a little. The majority of National Guard soldiers bring much more technical experience to the table than their counterparts in the RA.
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A lot of folks just seem to have to have somebody to look down on, to make themselves feel better.
For real issues, there are always units that exemplify people's stereotypes.
For real issues, there are always units that exemplify people's stereotypes.
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