Why am I obligated to provide an additional 4 years of service when opting to give my VA Education benefits to one of my children?

2022-03-31T15:01:43-04:00

When I first enlisted in 2000, I completed my first 4 years of active duty service and earned the Montgomery GI Bill plus a $40k Army College Fund and paid toward the "kicker" as per my contract. I completed those 4 years with an honorable discharge (stop lossed, and extended for a month actually). I then had a 2 years break in service. Then I continued active service with the Army Reserves and I have remained active through mobilizations and AGR. I am now eligible for retirement with 20+ active Federal years. I recently transferred the VA Education Benefits to my daughter and was forced to relinquish the remaining months of benefits of my Montgomery GI Bill in order to transfer the benefits. This is the only option if you elect to transfer the benefits. You have to transfer them via the Post 9/11 GI Bill. I understood that when I signed over those benefits, I essentially forfeited the remaining Montgomery GI Bill benefits but it was only because we aren't provided any other option. The only way to transfer the benefits are by forfeiting something that was already earned. Then the Post 9/11 GI Bill was granted to all of us who served post 9/11. And if I have been actively serving for over 10 years since the Post 9/11 GI Bill came into use, why do I still have to give more time to transfer them? I earned both those benefits for much more than a contractual obligation. And when it's time to apply for the transfer of benefits, you can only do it once your child is eligible to attend college. Which for me was last July; at the same time I am eligible for retirement. So there was no choice, I could only submit at that time. Left with no other option or alternative for me to be able to transfer the benefits, I signed. And if I want to submit an ETP (exception to policy) for this action in order to retire, which still has to be approved, I will be leaving the service with a debt. They don't only stop providing the VA benefits that my daughter currently receives, but they also want the money they paid out even though I have still been actively serving during this time . This doesn't seem to meet the intent of the entitlement that I earned. And I strongly believe it is some sort of breach of contract.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 1 at 2022 4:05 PM

2022-04-01T16:05:40-04:00

Well, we can split hairs over this, but it won't change anything. The path set before service members is meant to benefit the employer at every turn. Sometimes those transfer limits apply, and sometimes they are waived. It all depends on the needs of the military.

That all said............. I intend to not walk away form 36 months of BAH in my pocket, and will be taking knitting classes at the local community college when I'm 60. Maybe some badminton, maybe some creative writing, maybe some basket weaving. Whatever, just cash in 36 months worth of BAH with tuition covered.

Don't let them win. If you can't transfer the benefit then use it up yourself. Then at worst, use the extra BAH payments to put to your kids otherwise.

Ironically............. As a CA resident veteran my kids can go to school tuition free at state universities. Now....... it doesn't pay any housing or school supplies. Just tuition. But.......... I suppose I'll go to my local community college, get BAH for myself and then be able to use that towards my kids' living costs.

It's all semantics and it will cost the federal government the additional cost of my tuition to pay out the benefits.

Response by SGM Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 1 at 2022 6:26 PM

2022-04-01T18:26:40-04:00

Gabriela, I’m not sure why you had to wait until your daughter turned 18 to do the transfer. I did the transfer in 2013 and my oldest just turned 18 in February of this year. I went into my MilConnect account to verify today after reading your post, and it confirms that I met my 4-year service obligation in 2017. No other barriers remain.

Where did you read that you had to wait until your child was of college age to make the transfer?

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 2 at 2022 11:13 AM

2022-04-02T11:13:11-04:00

Why are you obligated to four additional years?
Because the Transfer of Eligibility (TEB) was conceived as a retention tool to get those mid career Soldiers to commit to getting to the halfway point in their career. Once someone is over ten years they almost never leave the service. It was never meant to to be a "gimme" or "thank you for your service" to everyone in the military.

TEB is not an entitlement.

It is most certainly not a breach of any contract.

The reason you can transfer your Post 9/11 and not your MGIB is because that is the way the law is written. The MGIB doesn't have a provision in the law to transfer it, the Post 9/11 does. Lots of people left the Army without ever using their old GI Bill and enough people said, "I really wish my spouse could use this". You can't have both at the same time. When you submit the transfer it flashes a pop up screen to let you know that it is irrevocable to change your MGIB to Post 9/11. It also has a block you check that says I understand I will be responsible for any payments for TA and BAH if I fail to fulfill my service obligation. I understand people just click all the buttons, but it is a binding agreement and those warnings are there for a reason.

You have been in the Army since TEB was initially announced. At that time there was an ETP for anyone who was within four years of retirement to allow them submit without having to meet the four year requirement. Once four years passed, the Army removed that. Everyone from 2017 on must meet the requirement unless they are separated for a reason outside their control, like an officer being passed over and not being offered SELCON, or someone who is separated by QSP (not QMP), or MEB.

Not sure where you got the idea that you couldn't submit your transfer till your child was 18. The only requirements are you must have six years of service, agree to four more, and the dependent must be listed in your DEERS.

You don't get both the MGIB and the Post 9/11, you get one or the other. You can use some of both if you go about it right. You can use all your MGIB and then request an additional 12 months, but you don't get two GI Bills. Serving in a pre-9/11 and post-9/11 Army does not entitle you to two GI Bills. They each have pros and cons and people have to decide which will be better for them. Only the Post 9/11 GI Bill is authorized to be transferred and that is why you lose all your ACF when you switch.

Response by SFC Dan Thomsen made Apr 7 at 2022 11:08 AM

2022-04-07T11:08:32-04:00

I have fought things like this all the way to congress from a Battalion assignment. I got pushback at pretty much every commander in the chain as saying no and trying to return it. If your memorandum is addressed TO the sitting congress, and the chains of command are THRU addresses, they have no authority to say no and turn it back. They can add a memorandum of non concurrence (forget if that is correct terminology of it) and move it forward to the next level of command but they have no authority to stop it.

Now with that said, No what congress wrote. No what amendments have been made to the law. This looks like the approved bill: https://www.congress.gov/116/bills/hr5522/BILLS-116hr5522ih.pdf

What happens is at each level they write their own policies for subordinate commands and things get "modified" without authority. So from congress it goes to DoD. From DoD it goes to the appropriate branches. From their it goes down but they love to turn entitlements into incentives along the way and sometimes, without authority to do it.

Example: I had to press a fight for aviation warrant officers to get their 10k bonuses for completing flight school with their contracted designator that congress said they would get (but did not specify a certain designator except to say it was what was contracted for). What happened was while these warrant's were at flight school they changed the whole Army MOS designation system and thus changed what an UH-60 pilot's MOS was. So they graduated with one designator (same name and school for the new one as the one they were given) but it didn't match the new one the Army came up with and so they we're told they were no longer eligible for the bonus they contracted for. It took me 1.5 years to fight the chain of command to stop returning it at each level as the )5 or above deemed the NGB and Army policy said they could not get it. Once it hit DA and they saw all the items I attached to the memorandum and all the non-concur attachments they read it clearly and boom ....I won a ton of money for a ton of aviators that we're getting hosed.

I'm not saying you have a winning situation as i am not going to research it like I did for the 3 times I did this to congress (won for the soldiers all three times by the way). But if congress said it in a way that you earned it those guys along the way that tried to change a Congressional Law are wrong.

The Hard Right over the Easy Wrong is the answer here. Can't say those senior officer new me but they didn't like that I pressed passed their no's. But the right thing was done and I'm proud of what I did for these people who EARNED these things and we're denied them wrongly.

Just a moment...

Response by A1C Medrick "Rick" DeVaney made Apr 8 at 2022 8:53 AM

2022-04-08T08:53:52-04:00

Why Would You Believe Otherwise?
Didn't Your Military Information Tell You That?
You Enlisted, Not Your Daughter.
You Actually Have A Signed Contract With Uncle Sam Which States Differently?
Things Sure Have Changed Since My Enlistment...