What is the protocol for waking up two MPs asleep in their patrol car parked in a secluded location at 0645 in the morning while doing PT?

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 04 Aug 2016 02:02:52 -0400

Response by SN Greg Wright made Aug 4 at 2016 2:05 AM

SN Greg Wright — Thu, 04 Aug 2016 02:05:39 -0400

An article 15 for dereliction of duty, I'd think.

Response by Sgt Christopher Cooper made Aug 4 at 2016 2:07 AM

Sgt Christopher Cooper — Thu, 04 Aug 2016 02:07:30 -0400

As a former MP, I'd tap on their window, have them open their doors and exit the patrol car, make the senior use his/her cell phone and call their watch commander and hand me the phone

Response by CPT Russell Pitre made Aug 4 at 2016 2:12 AM

CPT Russell Pitre — Thu, 04 Aug 2016 02:12:16 -0400

Take a good picture and send it to US Army WTF Moments!

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 4 at 2016 2:20 AM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 04 Aug 2016 02:20:38 -0400

In a previous assignment the MP Det was under my command, however not in this case.

Response by TSgt Melissa Post made Aug 4 at 2016 3:31 AM

TSgt Melissa Post — Thu, 04 Aug 2016 03:31:26 -0400

My former Chief found some of our security forces members asleep in the gate guard station. He thoroughly yelled at them, then contacted their chain of command. I believe they lost a stripe and might have had extra duty.

Response by Capt Michael Greene made Aug 4 at 2016 4:08 AM

Capt Michael Greene — Thu, 04 Aug 2016 04:08:16 -0400

Don't wake them. They might charge you with something bogus, just to make it seem like your allegation is motivated by revenge.

Instead, just report the place and time and a fair description, including the car number, to the HMFIC, preferably LTC or higher. Follow up in writing "Colonel Cop, I am concerned..." to keep records. Be sure YOUR boss and his boss know exactly what's going on, so they don't get blindsided.

Fortunately, your rank gives your testimony credibility, so your story will be believed.

Finally, always jog with your ID, and watch your back for several months after you make the report.

Response by PO1 Tony Holland made Aug 4 at 2016 4:48 AM

PO1 Tony Holland — Thu, 04 Aug 2016 04:48:12 -0400

Get a witness and take a photo - then summon the Sergeant of the Guard or OOD. If they are armed I wouldn't want to startle them.

Response by 1LT Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 4 at 2016 5:09 AM

1LT Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 04 Aug 2016 05:09:22 -0400

LTC Private RallyPoint Member - Are they armed? In today's environment I would take caution. Perhaps call COC or their watch commander? In years past I would have awakened them gently to caution them? Warmest Regards, Sandy :)

Response by SCPO Jason McLaughlin made Aug 4 at 2016 5:42 AM

SCPO Jason McLaughlin — Thu, 04 Aug 2016 05:42:22 -0400

I would go by Mickey D's and pick them up some breakfast and coffee. They are going to be hungry when they wake up.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 4 at 2016 6:18 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 04 Aug 2016 06:18:28 -0400

Report it to their COC and make them write their General Orders, as well as a 10 page paper.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 4 at 2016 6:37 AM

MSG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 04 Aug 2016 06:37:45 -0400

Protocol could be dereliction of duty

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 4 at 2016 6:56 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 04 Aug 2016 06:56:22 -0400

Call the MP station and tell the desk sgt. They will take care of that.

Response by COL Jean (John) F. B. made Aug 4 at 2016 7:26 AM

COL Jean (John) F. B. — Thu, 04 Aug 2016 07:26:41 -0400

LTC Private RallyPoint Member As a "COL Cop", as Capt Michael Greene stated below, the proper thing to do is to wake them and have them contact their Patrol Supervisor and/or Military Police Duty Officer (MPDO) and ask one or both to report to the scene. If you felt uncomfortable doing that and you had a cell phone, you could call the MP Station direct (or 911, although I don't recommend that)... No phone and uncomfortable waking them? -- remember the vehicle number, time and location and report it to the Provost Marshal or PM Operations Officer as soon as you have the opportunity.

One thing to remember... Just deal with the issue, not the individuals (i.e., ass-chewing, etc.). MPs on duty only report to and take instructions from the Military Police chain of command. They should, however, honor your request to call the Patrol Sup or MPDO.

I would then follow-up with the Provost Marshal to ensure he/she was aware of it. The soldiers would most likely be relieved from duty and recommended for disciplinary action by their chain of command (which is different than the Provost Marshal chain).

MPs sleeping on duty would most likely be given a Field Grade Article 15.

Response by SGM Erik Marquez made Aug 4 at 2016 8:45 AM

SGM Erik Marquez — Thu, 04 Aug 2016 08:45:48 -0400

LTC Private RallyPoint Member ...may I suggest as we have History... you simply ask yourself .."What would SGM Marquez or SGM Bennett do?"

The answer will be clear, justifiable and very defensible in a MCM should it come to that.

Response by SFC J Fullerton made Aug 4 at 2016 9:14 AM

SFC J Fullerton — Thu, 04 Aug 2016 09:14:15 -0400

Take a picture and post it here. Just kidding. Wake their asses up, get their names and tag number of the vehicle. Report it to the MP Desk Sgt.

Response by CPT Pedro Meza made Aug 4 at 2016 11:50 AM

CPT Pedro Meza — Thu, 04 Aug 2016 11:50:28 -0400

Tap lightly on their window, remember people with guns should never never never be startled.

Response by PO2 Kevin LaCroix made Aug 4 at 2016 11:53 AM

PO2 Kevin LaCroix — Thu, 04 Aug 2016 11:53:07 -0400

PT over their vehicle.

Response by SGT Eliyahu Rooff made Aug 4 at 2016 11:54 AM

SGT Eliyahu Rooff — Thu, 04 Aug 2016 11:54:59 -0400

While there are regulations that tell us how to deal with this situation, my inclination would be to very quietly remove the valve cores from all four tires and leave the two of them to explain it themselves after they wake up and can't go anywhere.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 4 at 2016 12:35 PM

1SG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 04 Aug 2016 12:35:19 -0400

There is a distinct possibility that there is intent at play here, what with the out of the way parking spot. As such, this is more than a "hey bubba - wake the hell up!" situation.
They were supposed to be patrolling the facility, but instead decided it was siesta time. I am quite sure that their CoC will find that requires corrective action.
Since they are not going anywhere, I'd take a picture and give the watch officer a call and have him/her come out and resolve it. Stick around to make whatever statement is necessary and then hand it off. If I know MPs, you will find them doing post beautification next week.

Response by SFC Scott Lutzke made Aug 4 at 2016 12:48 PM

SFC Scott Lutzke — Thu, 04 Aug 2016 12:48:38 -0400

Your question seems disingenuous. It cannot be that a Field-Grade Cavalry Officer needed help in this matter. It's almost as though you felt the need to denigrate an entire branch/MOS on what is largely an open forum. The fact that you had an MP Det under your command in the past seems to further confirm this theory.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 4 at 2016 1:47 PM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 04 Aug 2016 13:47:11 -0400

Sir, I would just go find the MP BN CSM let him know what car number and the location of the vehicle. Or call the watch desk and let them know.

Response by CPO Dave Berube made Aug 4 at 2016 2:01 PM

CPO Dave Berube — Thu, 04 Aug 2016 14:01:21 -0400

Many interesting answers and I totally agree that this is unacceptable. I would like to approach it from another angle. If you start seeking a root cause, one of the latent roots falls on the shoulders of their Watch Commander. What type of environment is he creating that they would even think to do this? Are there no systematic checks and balances in place to catch/prevent this? This is most likely a symptom of a bigger problem that might rise even higher in the chain of command..

Response by SGT Sean Depuydt made Aug 4 at 2016 2:30 PM

SGT Sean Depuydt — Thu, 04 Aug 2016 14:30:10 -0400

Tap on the widow and ask them to call their patrol supervisor. Follow up with Desk Sgt and PM. Really, it does happens from time to time. I worked my ass off, long hours, and few days off at the time. Granted, we all know better, so it is a risk. Punishment is usually swift and unforgiving for MP's who make mistakes or poor decisions.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 4 at 2016 2:52 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 04 Aug 2016 14:52:03 -0400

Knock at the window to wake them up and if necessary, report to higher. A similar event happened to me while stationed in Germany. Arriving at an on post dumping location, I found weapon parts (M16,50Cal). I stayed on location and called the MPs.

Response by LCpl Cody Collins made Aug 4 at 2016 2:57 PM

LCpl Cody Collins — Thu, 04 Aug 2016 14:57:23 -0400

Set off some Fire Crackers next to their car ! I bet they will never sleep on the job again.

Response by MSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 4 at 2016 2:58 PM

MSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 04 Aug 2016 14:58:43 -0400

I'd probably just slap the window on the passenger side real hard... If it was a unit PT, I'd have the unit surround the car, slap the window have them all yell...

I'm willing to be that they wouldn't both sleep after that...

Response by SMSgt Thor Merich made Aug 4 at 2016 4:24 PM

SMSgt Thor Merich — Thu, 04 Aug 2016 16:24:08 -0400

Actually a great question, as it happens much too often. Instead of regurgitating someone else's answer, I will just say that most of the previous answers (except taking a picture) were good answers.

Response by PO1 Donald Hammond made Aug 4 at 2016 6:23 PM

PO1 Donald Hammond — Thu, 04 Aug 2016 18:23:51 -0400

There is the "proper" way and the way that will make sure they will never fall asleep on watch again. Maybe banging on the top of the car and screaming at the top of your lungs that there is "incoming!" See how bad their PTSD is. Okay okay. Can't do things like that in today's military.

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 5 at 2016 3:53 AM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 05 Aug 2016 03:53:00 -0400

OK, for all who commented, thank you.
For the record, I did nothing the day I saw them, however I have returned to that location since then and they were not there. If I run across MPs asleep in their patrol car again in my PT sessions, or anytime for that matter, I will "gently" wake them up and discuss the situation as one professional to another. If that appears to be ineffective, due to attitude, etc., I will raise to their CoC Leadership.
I especially appreciate those of you who are MP professionals and your perspectives, and for the record, this was not intended to be disrespected to MPs specifically, but interaction with them sleeping on duty is different than with a CQ, or Staff Duty Officer, or FOD, or Watch Officer or even an Officer/NCO in their cubical/office who is sleeping during the duty day. They are armed, and as law enforcement professionals (regardless their age or maturity), I respect them.
In a previous assignment the MPs fell under my Command and UCMJ, and with those Soldiers, I would have taken action then because I knew them, and presumably they recognized their Battalion Commander, and we would have resolved it on-the-spot.
This was not intended to be a funny post, or looking for silly responses, but I can see how it comes across that way and brings out the WTF mentality in many on here. This was about leadership, standards, and whether there are differences in actions based on being Law Enforcement Professionals and everything that entails, even being in the Military and on a Military installation.
My secondary intent was to put a topic that would provide discourse across rank, age, experience and job specialties in order to improve any who participated.

ASSIST, PROTECT, DEFEND.

Response by MSG Dan Castaneda made Aug 5 at 2016 9:52 AM

MSG Dan Castaneda — Fri, 05 Aug 2016 09:52:58 -0400

As I read all these post, I am disappointed at how many people are quick to slam these Soldiers for messing up. While I do not condone sleeping on duty, there is many more ways to handle this than trying to get these two Soldiers slammed. Why don't you take some of those leadership traits you have learned and talked to them. May go a lot further in their development than greeting them reprimanded. Today's military has turned into such a cut throat organization that we no longer want to take care of each other.

Response by SSG Jeremy Sharp made Aug 5 at 2016 12:31 PM

SSG Jeremy Sharp — Fri, 05 Aug 2016 12:31:40 -0400

WOW! As a former MP this is alarming! I would probably approach the vehicle and knock on the window to ensure that they are ok. Then collect names and advise them to report to the Military Police Desk Sergeant where I would meet them once I completed my PT. I would then address the concern with the appropriate level in their chain of command. Since you are a LTC and have a vested interest in the security of the facility they are supposed to be safeguarding I would say that should be the base Provost Marshal.

Response by CPL Anthony Slaughter made Aug 5 at 2016 3:39 PM

CPL Anthony Slaughter — Fri, 05 Aug 2016 15:39:42 -0400

It should be the same as if they fell asleep on Guard, Staff Duty, CQ, etc. Tap on the window (don't want to damage the car by banging on it or whatever), have them get out of the car and contact their Watch Commander, and then make them do Flutter Kicks until he gets there.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 5 at 2016 8:16 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 05 Aug 2016 20:16:58 -0400

WOW. As an MP, I would smoke there A$$$ like there is no tomarrow.

Response by MSgt Wayne Morris made Aug 6 at 2016 4:55 PM

MSgt Wayne Morris — Sat, 06 Aug 2016 16:55:57 -0400

Carry an air horn for possible future events as they would have a hard time explaining the hole in the roof.

Response by COL David Turk made Aug 7 at 2016 8:22 AM

COL David Turk — Sun, 07 Aug 2016 08:22:32 -0400

Contact PMO and give details (official response).
Having said that, that incident occurred to a "sister" unit in my very early career, only it was a patrol jeep. They woke up to four flat tires.

Response by SFC Joseph Weber made Aug 7 at 2016 11:09 AM

SFC Joseph Weber — Sun, 07 Aug 2016 11:09:08 -0400

Climb on the roof, jump on the hood, toss the bottle of piss you previously filled at the windshield, run away while they realize all their tires are flat.

Response by SSG Leon Drew made Aug 12 at 2016 4:40 PM

SSG Leon Drew — Fri, 12 Aug 2016 16:40:57 -0400

How about not going bat shit crazy on them and tapping on the window and say not a good thing to be doing and be glad I wasn't being asshole! Calling watch commander only if they are disrespectful and insubordinate. Cut someone some slack! Remember back to when you were a low rank and I'm sure we all screwed up more than once! Be the leader that gave them a break and they will remember next time! Lead from the front not from the Reg book!

Response by PFC Pamala (Hall) Foster made Aug 12 at 2016 5:43 PM

PFC Pamala (Hall) Foster — Fri, 12 Aug 2016 17:43:18 -0400

Better to lead by example then tear them up. Exhaustion is NOT a joke-physical or mental, WHICH could have been the case. CoC has to be on watch for this and some are NOT wanting to be mentors, BUT drive others to the ground. I fell asleep on CQ one night cause I was on meds for an injury that I alerted my CoC about and they put me on CQ anyhow. THEY got a rude awakening from a MAJOR and COL, and I snapped from what they were doing to me. You can be rulebook 24/7...you have to lead with common sense as well.

Response by LTJG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 12 at 2016 8:38 PM

LTJG Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 12 Aug 2016 20:38:34 -0400

Notify their SgtMaj lol.

In all seriousness, if I was feeling not like an asshole I would knock in the window. If I saw it a second time, I would probably call PMO/MP and see who the watch commander was and report it to him. Yeah you don't want to get someone in trouble on purpose, but it's their freaking job to protect others on base. Someone could die or national security could be compromised if cops aren't watching at the right time. What if another unit needs backup they aren't able to respond? You could get brothers and sisters killed. It's a hazard not only to those they protect but all others on shift with them as well. I'd say they need a good ass chewing as a warning and then a Page 11 if it happened again, and that's being lenient.

As others have said, this is punishable by Court-Martial. However, it would leave a bad taste in my mouth if I was responsible for ruining someone's career as it just as easily could have been you or me in that situation. (Even though technically it was their fault for falling asleep in the first place)
I'm sure everyone here has had those nights where you had no coffee/energy drinks/water source and were struggling to stay awake. I can empathize.

Response by SGT Charles Tittl made Aug 14 at 2016 2:27 AM

SGT Charles Tittl — Sun, 14 Aug 2016 02:27:26 -0400

The 'ol MRE heater in a Gatorade bottle on their hood would do the trick!