What is the best path forward after being informed you're being considered for QMP?

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 16 Jul 2016 19:42:10 -0400

A friend of mine has been on active duty for 16 years. Due to deployments, PCS, and forced re-class it was difficult to get a class date for ALC. He finally got one for next year, but has just been informed that he is being considered for QMP for failure to attend NCOES requirements for his grade. What is the best path forward in this situation? He's a great leader and he only has four years left until retirement. I'd hate to see yet another great leader pushed out when there has already been such a mass exodus in recent years.

Response by SSG Derrick L. Lewis MBA, C-HRM made Jul 16 at 2016 7:49 PM

SSG Derrick L. Lewis MBA, C-HRM — Sat, 16 Jul 2016 19:49:58 -0400

SGT Private RallyPoint Member ,
In all honesty and frankness, one should be prepared at 16 years because retirement today is not promised. Yet it best for your friend to begin to focus on posturing himself for the next chapter coupled with ensuring he continues to take care of his team members. However, if he has a good leadership team, they will be both empathetic and understanding of his circumstance in which they will afford him the time to slowly phase him self out to prepare and ultimately focus on himself and family (if applicable) without seeming selfish. Now is the time to maximize the SFL-TAP Transition Assistance Program. Lastly, if he is not fully ready to exit, he can always looking into Army Reserve or National Guard options if available. But above all, be ready to close this chapter and open a new one. Hope this helps and best of luck moving forward.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 16 at 2016 7:55 PM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 16 Jul 2016 19:55:43 -0400

I don't know if my ex was hit with QMP, but after being promoted to SSG, he spent 5 years trying to get to BNCOC due to deployments, TDY, field exercises. He had multiple class dates that he was forced to cancel by his leadership because they felt his attendance was not a priority. He finally got a DA ordered class date in conjunction with PCS orders, that way his unit couldn't make him cancel, they'd have to go through DA to change it.

To my memory, there isn't much the individual can do about the QMP. They will look at his record to decide if he is lacking. They'll see that he has a class date scheduled, and hopefully they will also see that it has been military duties preventing him from attending NCOES, not a lack of effort on his part. They'll also look at his overall history to see if he is a subpar Soldier, average, or above average that has been fighting the machine we call the Big Army. I'm not sure if he can write a statement as to why he is just now getting a class date schedule, have him check with his 1 shop, I think they'd have the answer.

Tell him to just keep moving forward with his career path like as if he isn't being looked at, be the best he can be, and schedule other training as well if possible, whether it is MOS related or not.

Response by LCDR Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 16 at 2016 8:25 PM

LCDR Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 16 Jul 2016 20:25:05 -0400

There is likely an exception to policy (within the instruction) which he could ask for.

Response by MSG Pat Colby made Jul 16 at 2016 9:23 PM

MSG Pat Colby — Sat, 16 Jul 2016 21:23:01 -0400

What Rank is your friend? How many years of TIG? Deployments are explainable. Any failed APFT's or Ht/Wt issues during the time? Bad NCOER?

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 16 at 2016 10:19 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 16 Jul 2016 22:19:24 -0400

The best path forward is that your friend needs to graduate ALC before the QMP board meets. If he does that he will be removed from the QMP list.
Outside of that, your friend should start to transition. There's no exception to policy for QMP. They won't be eligible for Reserve Component.

Response by SGM Matthew Quick made Jul 16 at 2016 11:56 PM

SGM Matthew Quick — Sat, 16 Jul 2016 23:56:35 -0400

Your friend needs to prepare for separation...great leaders don't shirk mandatory NCO schools for years.

Response by WO1 Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 17 at 2016 1:30 AM

WO1 Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 17 Jul 2016 01:30:46 -0400

Have him look into TERA, I don't have his entire situation in front of me, but from what I see he may qualify, as TERA is a option for those selected for involuntary separation. Again it's not a guarantee that he'll get it. Would hate to see a NCO with 16 years, not make it to retirement.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 17 at 2016 3:47 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 17 Jul 2016 03:47:41 -0400

Write a letter to the board and have leaders in your friends CoC write letters of recommendation to the board on his behalf.

Response by SPC Kyle Williams made Jul 17 at 2016 6:02 AM

SPC Kyle Williams — Sun, 17 Jul 2016 06:02:30 -0400

no ones military carreer is that jam packed full of deployments and other stuff for a full 16 years. At some point he has to accept some responsibility for not attending sooner.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 18 at 2016 8:46 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 18 Jul 2016 08:46:29 -0400

I have seen this before, if he or she graduates from ALC than they have opportunity to have QMP lifted. No guarantees but has been done before.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 18 at 2016 9:45 AM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 18 Jul 2016 09:45:17 -0400

***UPDATE***

Based on the actual professional and helpful responses so far, it seems as if the best path forward is for him to graduate ALC before the board meets, which unfortunately will not be able to happen as he is in AIT for a forced reclass. Barring that, letters of recommendation for retention from Sergeants Major and Majors (or above), as well as a letter from the service member explaining the situation. I will provide an update in September/October after the board meets to let you all know whether it worked or not.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 19 at 2016 1:07 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 19 Jul 2016 01:07:15 -0400

I went through a similar scenario. QMP was initiated because of no fault of my own. I was injured during the APFT at SLC. This resulted in a negative 1059 that only states, failed to meet course standards by failing APFT. It does not say sustained injury during APFT or anything helpful. So, a QMP was initiated. My leadership stepped up and signed a letter to the board, that explained my situation and stated reasoning behind why I should not be QMP'd. I went back and accomplished SLC and scored superior in everything, so that when the board looked at my packet they would see that the APFT thing was a fluke. My advise in all of this is... Your friend needs to step-up and get his ducks in a row. My SLC graduation was 17 FEB and my QMP documents had to be in NLT 5 March. I was also TDY en route to Korea and was concerned about not getting my DA1059 on my record prior to the board because HRC or Fort Gordon had system issues at that time. I scanned and emailed my DA1059 to the HRC address that he should of got at the bottom of his notification letter.

He needs to know that just because the packet was initiated that it doesn't mean it will happen. The board members individually judge all candidates for QMP and stack them from least impressive to most impressive careers. First half of the stack are the NCOERs with no in the Army Values and those with UCMJ actions against them and/or a negative DA1059. Those are pretty much automatic for QMP. The last half of the stack are those who seem to be stagnant in their career. Not progressing. This would be your friend. Now, with the right information provided by his leadership in the form of a letter to the panel, he should be placed at the end of the stack because it shows it's not his fault, should that actually be the case.

To some it all up... If he wants to stay in, he needs to fight to stay in. Don't make someone else' decision easy to end his career. Never let your future be in the hands of others. I didn't give up and I wasn't going down without a fight. I am still in the Army and will be through retirement. Receiving that letter from the QMP board stating that they decided to retain my services in the Army was a great feeling.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 21 at 2016 12:57 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 21 Jul 2016 12:57:09 -0400

Your friends best option is to everything he/she can to get into school as soon as possible. If not, write a very good appeal letter explaining the situation. There are quite a few civilian lawyers that are good at putting together these appeals. I would highly recommend they look into that and provide them with absolutely every document that has caused any extenuating circumstances. If your friends lays out a good strong professional case as to why the Army should keep them... He/ she has a very good chance of being retained. Unfortunately some people don't realize that we are humans and not machines. I went through a similar process with QMP... After back to back deployments and in my 30's I decided to finally have children. My children are 13 months apart and I was 100% prepared to jump back in full force when I got hit with QMP for not attending school. When I decided to have my children back to back schools were not a QMP factor.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 7 at 2016 5:45 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 07 Aug 2016 05:45:04 -0400

He should and I hope he has already submitted documentation to the board president addressing the NCO's potential for continued service. He should make sure to have strong letters of support from peers and CoC. Once a rebuttal option is selected and a rebuttal packet submitted - and for those Soldiers who choose not to submit matters to negotiation - the board will review the file and consider several factors. These may include the Soldier's moral and ethical failures; his or her future potential for performance of duties; declining efficiency and performance over a continued period of time; discipline problems; or other derogatory factors such as a failure to meet height or weight standards or the Army Physical Fitness Test, or the imposition of a field commander's bar to re-enlistment.
Good luck I just went through the same thing and I am waiting on the results. I am a great person and NCO like your friend and true Leadership show his resiliency to overcome obstacles. Don't let certain negative Leadership opinions impact your future decisions and judgment. Stay motivated. I find that Leadership can be real with facts but also be positive with guidance. Good luck to your friend SGT. NCOs should always stick together.