What is behind the POTUS mention of the Crusades and ISIS?

2015-02-07T08:04:45-05:00

Many have offered reasons, opinions and conjecture as to why the POTUS would mention this? Some say he writes his own speeches, or at least edits them, why would this be important?
What is the driving force in his constant downplaying of ISIS and the threat they pose? Any ideas?

http://video.foxnews.com/v/ [login to see] 001/why-president-obama-compared-christianity-to-isis/?intcmp=obnetwork#sp=show-clips

Why President Obama compared Christianity to ISIS

Obama: 'People committed terrible deeds in name of Christ'

Response by Cpl Jeff N. made Feb 7 at 2015 8:24 AM

2015-02-07T08:24:45-05:00

This is his standard approach to radical islamists and jihadists. He is unable to confront reality. He reached back centuries to try to make a comparison that is simply off the mark. He then tried to tie these events to Jim Crow laws, the civil rights movements (perhaps slavery, I don't recall). It is the ultimate grope of a coward.

He apparently doesn't know the history of the crusades or 19th and 20th century America. He seems to forget that it was Christian organizations that fought slavery, ran the underground railroad and were at the forefront of the abolitionist movement at places like Harpers Ferry. John Brown was an avowed Christian and a Calvinist for example.

The civil rights movement, in many ways, relied and worked with Christian churches to advance the case. This doesn't mean every Christian was in full support but many were and organizations like the Southern Baptist Leadership Conference (SBLC) were at the forefront. MLK was a Christian minister, I guess that makes him a terrorist in Obama's eyes.

We are going to have a hard time living down these types of remarks. It is embarrassing.

Response by SGM Mikel Dawson made Feb 7 at 2015 8:35 AM

2015-02-07T08:35:26-05:00

What is behind this POTUS anyway. Why, the first thing he did after elected did he bow to the Saudi King? Why can't he admit - Islamic Terrorists? Why did he call FT Hood "Work place Violence"? Is he relating to his muslim back ground? Doesn't he know the back ground behind the Crusades? The questions can go on and on and on.

Response by SGT Orazio Castellana made Feb 7 at 2015 9:41 AM

2015-02-07T09:41:09-05:00

One he is a Muslim. Two it does not fit is agenda. Three it's a reality that he does not want to face due to fact he is trying to change or enforce his ideology on others.

Response by SGT Steven Eugene Kuhn MBA made Feb 7 at 2015 9:49 AM

2015-02-07T09:49:24-05:00

I JUST FOUND THIS!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I_To-cV94Bo

Bill Warner, PhD: Jihad vs Crusades

Which was worse? Watch the data and you decide. This video is part of Bill Warner's astounding lecture: "Why we are afraid. A 1400 years secret": part of a m...

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 7 at 2015 9:51 AM

2015-02-07T09:51:37-05:00

Well after reading all the responses, let me suggest a different position for POTUS down play of ISIS.

Apparently, we have some in the world who are trying to pursue this as a religious war. ISIS is a very small percentage of the Islamic following and twist the teachings of the Koran. And for those of you that will try to attack my response, I come from a household with parents where one is muslim and the other is Catholic. So I've learned both prospectives of the religions and fully understand that they are both about helping your fellow human being. So if you give ISIS more importance then all of the other groups who live under thre flag of terror. We let them think they are winning, succeeding and affecting the peaceful lives of every day people of the world.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 7 at 2015 9:55 AM

2015-02-07T09:55:53-05:00

I'd be lying if I didn't have "deus vult" in my head when deployed. Considering the nature of our enemies it's hard to keep faith out of it.

To get on topic, and to be fair, there are pretty clear parallels at play here. What were the crusades if not a series of campaigns to violently take land and expand the faith in the name of God? Is this not what the Islamic State is doing? History is history, and there's no good to try and deny that Christianity has a bloody past.

Response by PO3 Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 7 at 2015 9:57 AM

2015-02-07T09:57:54-05:00

I have no clue why he does the things he does. He's a politician and they do things only because they want to influence their constituency in some way. I'm not a politician so it's hard for me to decipher their intent, because of that I usually just don't try.

SGT Steven Eugene Kuhn MBA I have a question for you. If I'm not mistaken you live in Europe. How do you think your neighbors view President Obama? I've always wanted to ask somebody over there what they think.

Response by PO2 Steven Erickson made Feb 7 at 2015 10:17 AM

2015-02-07T10:17:12-05:00

I submit that this is part of his personal belief system whereby he thinks that exceptionalism is a major contributor to oppression in ourselves and our world.

In basic psych terms, it's called "leveling"... I will bring you (in this case, "us" and the US) down to the others' level (in this case, violent religious zealots). That way, we're all the same. If no one's exceptional, then no one feels inferior. If everybody's right, then nobody's wrong.

Just pondering from the shallow end of the IQ pool...

Response by CMC Robert Young made Feb 7 at 2015 10:20 AM

2015-02-07T10:20:35-05:00

SGT Kuhn, I also saw portions of the speech and am at a complete loss as to what the point was too. It seemed to be a rambling stream of consciousness type of talk with no well defined message.

I understand that bad things have happened in the past. They have been generated by all faith traditions. They have all been opposed for their evil.....but only once called for what they are. This just seemed to be more misdirection from the obvious problem which is clearly Islamic Extremists killing other people (from all faiths) in the name of their god. Let's call it what it is, and deal with now; not lament the failures of the past....we're failing right now!!

Response by Cpl Kevin Zimmermann made Feb 7 at 2015 11:24 AM

2015-02-07T11:24:25-05:00

The portion of his speech that compared the atrocities of the Crusades to contemporary Islamic barbarism is a quite common comparison made by Muslim apologists. One can find this same tired comparison offered in books, in speeches, and in many Islamic apologist materials widely distributed. The idea is to give modern day Christians a different perspective and...in my view, the argument is fundamentally unsound when applied to members of a global community. The fact that our President would recycle this tired argument is troubling but, as I said, it is hardly a new argument. It is very disappointing.

Response by MSgt Michelle Mondia made Feb 7 at 2015 12:28 PM

2015-02-07T12:28:30-05:00

Perhaps He said that because so many people want to understand that mind set. People can't fathom the motivation for such destruction and inhumanity. He's saying...look at history. Look at the Christians. I don't think he's throwing shade, I think he's letting people know this is not new. Religion is a bloody mess and we should strive to keep religion out of it. Judge not, so to speak. Christians don't want to be compared to the Spanish inquisitor or the crusading knight. Just as Islam fears being compared to IS and other extremist off shoots. We have guard against self righteousness and extremism.

Response by CPT Jack Durish made Feb 7 at 2015 12:44 PM

2015-02-07T12:44:48-05:00

I doubt that any of us will ever really know "what is behind the POTUS mention of the Crusades..." while responding to the barbarism of ISIS. Many have speculated in this discussion and elsewhere. The only thing I can be certain of is that his response leaves me (and many Americans) frustrated. The President of the United States is supposed to be our voice to the rest of the world and his words reflect nothing of my feelings on this matter. I suspect by his comments, Cpl Jeff N. is feeling frustrated. Indeed, it seems apparent that President Obama is blaming us for the crimes committed by ISIS. He is mitigating their guilt by asserting that they are merely acting in defense of our past crimes of which they are the victims.

Others in this discussion thread have provided links to historical evidence that run counter to the President's argument. I especially appreciated SGT Steven Eugene Kuhn MBA's link ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I_To-cV94Bo ) Yes, some Crusaders used the confusion of war to commit crimes, some to steal treasure, others to give vent to psychopathic tendencies, and a few for reasons we'll never discern. However, by the evidence presented in this YouTube video, there is no discernible moral equivalency between Jihad and the Crusades as the President would have us believe.

I am tempted to agree with SMSgt Minister Gerald A. Thomas as he speculates that the President is merely signalling that he is a Muslim, but that would imply that our Commander-in-Chief is too cowardly to publicly proclaim his true religious beliefs. Could that be true?

Yes CMC Robert Young , bad things have happened in the past. Terrible things happened during the Inquisition in the name of Christ. But what does that have to do with us. The United States didn't exist then. It wasn't even a dream at that time. Certainly Columbus sailed the ocean blue at the time of the Inquisition and discovered the fringes of the land in which freedom would be plant, but the spark of Liberty wouldn't be kindled until several hundred years later.

And, yes, Mr. President, slavery existed in America and found apologists among some who anointed themselves as Christians. Tragically, a political party sprang up to defend slavery and attempt to enslave blacks even beyond the end of slavery using Jim Crow laws and domestic terrorism. However, Mr. President, if you were half the scholar you claim to be, you would know that it was your party, the Democrats, who must bear the brunt of that charge. It was the Republican Party that came into existence with the explicit purpose of ending slavery. It was a Republican President, Abraham Lincoln, who led the fight to end slavery. It was a united Republican Party that garnered just enough Democrats to overcome the Democratic majority in Congress to pass the Civil Rights legislation. It is the GOP that counts among its members many of the black heroes that you purport to celebrate including Dr. Martin Luther King.

Maybe, just maybe, the high horse is being ridden by the man who is lecturing us in an apparent attempt to cover the sins of Islam.

That being said, I must admit that I stand with PO3 Private RallyPoint Member when he says "I have no clue why he does the things he does."

Neither do I.

Do you?

Bill Warner, PhD: Jihad vs Crusades

Which was worse? Watch the data and you decide. This video is part of Bill Warner's astounding lecture: "Why we are afraid. A 1400 years secret": part of a m...

Response by SGT Steven Eugene Kuhn MBA made Feb 7 at 2015 1:37 PM

2015-02-07T13:37:01-05:00

A bit more info:
http://blessings.buzz/2015/02/05/video-obama-wants-to-talk-about-the-crusades-lets-educate-him/

VIDEO: Obama Wants to Talk About the Crusades, Let’s Educate Him

We have to get educated to respond to the talking points of the Left whenever ridiculous comments make headlines like President Obama's speech at today's National Prayer Breakfast. Learn the key elements about exactly what the crusades were, when they occurred and why. We no longer learn any of this in American public schools, doesn't…

Response by SPC Cedar Bristol made Feb 7 at 2015 3:49 PM

2015-02-07T15:49:00-05:00

He is talking about Christians 1000+ years ago to remind us that most muslims in the present day are as different from Isis jihadis as todays Christians are from those who sacked cities in the crusades and burned heretics alive.

Also, he knows that there is a large faction of American Christians who claim that they are being persecuted, and the louder this faction gets, the better Obama's party looks to the general public.

Response by SGT Steven Eugene Kuhn MBA made Feb 7 at 2015 4:39 PM

2015-02-07T16:39:52-05:00

I JUST found this by chance and I want to post it on every comment below so forgive me but I really woudl like to hear what you have to say about this...he has an unfair advantage having the British accent, makes him sound so intelligent! lol I would love your comments!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1sjKfzEo_Jo

Mehdi Hasan,Islam Is A Peaceful Religion,Oxford Union,arabic subtitle

Response by PO3 Brendan "Smitty" Smith made Feb 7 at 2015 5:07 PM

2015-02-07T17:07:46-05:00

It's part propaganda, "Look, there not so bad." It's part, "I have no idea what to do about the problem" and it's part, (if you think he's a little more Muslim than he let's on) that he doesn't really want this fight.

Either way, I loved Louisiana Gov Bobby Jindal's response. "Mr President, we have the Christian Crusade thing under control, could you possibly turn your attention to Radical Islamic threat we face in the present day. Thank you."

Response by SGT Steven Eugene Kuhn MBA made Feb 7 at 2015 6:55 PM

2015-02-07T18:55:04-05:00

A great rebuttal!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LwwF0_KmBAY#t=159

Obama's Ridiculous Christianity/ISIS Comparison || Louder With Crowder

Check out http://louderwithcrowder.com for more! Today, our president made a comparison between Christians and ISIS that is so unbelievably absurd, so mind-n...

Response by SGT Steven Eugene Kuhn MBA made Feb 8 at 2015 3:23 AM

2015-02-08T03:23:00-05:00

More interesting info:
http://www.bizpacreview.com/2015/02/06/giuliani-totally-unleashes-on-obama-after-national-prayer-breakfast-178124

Giuliani totally unleashes on Obama after National Prayer Breakfast - BizPac Review

Former New York City Mayor, Rudy Giuliani didn’t hold back about his thoughts on President Obama’s comparison of Christianity with the barbaric terrorism of ISIS during the annual National Prayer Breakfast on Thursday. Obama brought up violence by Christians in the Crusades to somehow justify the brutality brought on by ISIS just days after a …

Response by SSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 8 at 2015 4:12 AM

2015-02-08T04:12:26-05:00

Out of touch with reality or even more sinister, just doesn't care.

Response by CMSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 8 at 2015 4:27 AM

2015-02-08T04:27:47-05:00

Having watched the comments several times I am at a loss to objectively say what the president was trying to refer to as anyone on a "high horse." How is being repulsed at a man being burned to death in a cage being compared to putting yourself above anything?

Could you picture any other president in our history commenting in this way?

Response by SPC Christopher Smith made Feb 8 at 2015 9:56 AM

2015-02-08T09:56:56-05:00

The speech was not the down paying of ISIS, it was the elimination of religious segregation and damnation that has happened over the last 13 or 14 years. Many people have demonized all Muslims because of their faith, rather than identify the group's causing the problem unjustly in the name if their faith. He was correct in everything he said. The Catholic church and many Christians did evil things under the banner and name of their faith.

Response by SGT Jim Z. made Feb 8 at 2015 11:42 AM

2015-02-08T11:42:03-05:00

From a friend

Response by SSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 8 at 2015 2:39 PM

2015-02-08T14:39:18-05:00

And the president thinks we are dumb and we have proof of that. This coming from a person who hides his records from college and the like.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 8 at 2015 4:05 PM

2015-02-08T16:05:14-05:00

Moral Relativism.
The big weakness of modern liberalism, is that they fail to stand for something, but rather excuse bad behavior because:
Someone else did it too
They are victims of their circumstances
They were disadvantaged
They had a bad family life
The government did not help them enough

BULL$#!T.
While circumstances certainly affect a person's development and moral compass, each individual is a sentient being who make up their own mind to do something wrong, almost always knows it is wrong (rarely excepted), and justifies it some way to themselves or others.

Islamic State burned that poor bastard on purpose. They weren't getting the reaction they wanted from beheadings anymore, so they upped the ante. On purpose. They are animals.

The crusades were inspired by a desire to liberate the holy land from muslim oppression. Not unlike every war fought in Israel/Palestine for the past 1500 years. Lots of nastiness in medieval warfare. Nevermind the horrors that occurred when the Caliphate came rolling in a century earlier. Or in the intervals between crusades. Or in the invasion of Spain by the Moors. Or the Reconquista. Or the Golden Horde.
Please.
It is 2015. Those MFers burned a man alive and videotaped it with happy music for propaganda.
Not the same. Not even close.

I don't know what the hell the President is thinking here. I am not a mind reader. But if I were to venture a guess, he is equivocating based upon his ideological alignment with Moral Relativism.
If you lack conviction that your cause is right, you have a listless and directionless outlook on life. That is our foreign policy, in a nutshell.

Response by 1SG David Niles made Feb 8 at 2015 4:10 PM

2015-02-08T16:10:01-05:00

Couldn't tell you, he does not share his inner thoughts with me...But I don't think it was as nepharious as he is made out to be, I think it was more a statement of his ignorance than anything else.

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 8 at 2015 8:58 PM

2015-02-08T20:58:44-05:00

I don't think that there is anything sinister nor is there anything particularly incorrect here. Christianity has a sordid history because its believers are human beings. Islam has a sordid history because its believers are human beings. I think that the POTUS is reminding us that there are more things in common in us and people in the Middle East than there are differences.

Response by COL Charles Williams made Feb 8 at 2015 11:22 PM

2015-02-08T23:22:13-05:00

Lets see... Hmmm... I he apologizes for American actions, he refuses to say Terrorist (most times) or Islamic extremism... I think if he is not Muslim, he is sympathizes with them. Trying to compare events today with the Crusades is silly at best. I am disappointed to say the least.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 9 at 2015 12:12 AM

2015-02-09T00:12:29-05:00

I believe Bill Moyers did a lot better job putting all this into context.

http://billmoyers.com/2015/02/05/isis-brutality-burning-lynching/

The Fiery Cage and the Lynching Tree, Brutality’s Never Far Away | BillMoyers.com

As the world reacts to ISIS brutality, Bill Moyers reminds us of homegrown barbarism in our not-so-distant past.

Response by SSG Leonard Johnson made Feb 9 at 2015 3:16 AM

2015-02-09T03:16:54-05:00

Well it a shame the administration will compare us to crusades.... abut won't equate the Muslims to Radical Islam

Response by SSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 9 at 2015 4:49 AM

2015-02-09T04:49:10-05:00

You know why...we all know why. He is rationalizing our war on terror. What he fails to mention is why the Crusades started in the first place...because of the spread of Islam across N. AFRICA and most of Europe...they were sick of it, or it directly competed with Catholicism of the time. It goes right along with him offering apologies for America...as I see it, the only people that needed apologies are the Natives and the slaves used to build our great country, which were more then the Negros, it included the Chinese, Irish, and Italians, and Germans....we all got roped in.

Response by SPC David S. made Feb 9 at 2015 11:29 AM

2015-02-09T11:29:13-05:00

Could of sworn I commented on this but I looked for my post and its was gone. So here it is a second time.

His remarks come from that of an apologist where he is trying to use a moral comparative between Islam and jihad and Christianity and the crusades. However he, either because of ignorance or deliberate intent, forgot to mention that the crusades were attempts to reclaim land that was conquered by Muslims. He goes so far as to use slavery and slams Christians in his comparison. The fact remains that today ISIS is capturing and enslaving men and women, torturing, and trafficking young girls as sex slaves as of today. That is the BIG difference in Islam and Christianity. I also find it very troubling that Mr. Obama is meeting with people who we know are supporting such groups.

http://www.breitbart.com/national-security/2015/02/07/the-muslim-brotherhood-comes-to-the-white-house/

I know I more than likely sound like a Christian zealot and that is simple not the case. I would feel this way about any religion or ideology that professed and condoned this kind of behavior.

As others have posted Dr. Bill Warner's presentation on Jihad vs Crusades there is also another comparative that is going around and that is the genocidal behaviors of ISIS and that of the National Socialist Party or the NAZIs. The comparative argument can work both ways as it just depends on who's side your on and what message you are trying to deliver.

http://www.wnd.com/2014/08/isis-genocide-aims-for-christian-free-nation/

While I appreciate the olive branch approach extended by Mr. Obama I feel doing so with ISIS is like stepping into a boxing ring only armed with rhetoric and seeking victory.

Muslim Brotherhood Comes to the White House

The Obama White House has finally released the names of the fourteen Muslim “leaders” who met with the President this past week. Among the group -- which included a comedian, along with a hijab-wearing basketball player and a handful of left wing activists -- were a select few individuals with disturbingly close ties to the global Muslim Brotherhood.

Response by LtCol David Gran made Feb 9 at 2015 12:47 PM

2015-02-09T12:47:03-05:00

I don't think I can add anything to this discussion beyond. "That speech really pissed me off".

Response by CSM Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 9 at 2015 1:38 PM

2015-02-09T13:38:50-05:00

Smoke and mirrors. Misdirection. Common tools of a magician or con man, or a politician, who has much in common with the aforementioned two.

Reason? Simple, he is defending Islam.

And the sheep keep grazing.

Response by Cpl Bill Foster made Feb 9 at 2015 11:57 PM

2015-02-09T23:57:47-05:00

The only thing I got from his comments, is that religious extremism is dangerous matter what religion it is. I don't think he was downplaying the horrific acts of ISIS , but simply reminding people that Muslims are not the only ones to have ever committed heinous acts in the name of their religion. I'm a Christian myself, but I am honetly appalled at some the things that have happened and still happen today in the name of God. But again, that in no way excuses the acts Islamic extremists...they definitely need to be felt with.

Response by SFC Collin McMillion made Feb 10 at 2015 1:31 PM

2015-02-10T13:31:31-05:00

I think our president Is part chameleon, he can change anytime he wants.

Response by Lt Col Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 10 at 2015 6:09 PM

2015-02-10T18:09:51-05:00

He was simply making the point that the Muslim faith isn't the only religion that has been distorted for violent purposes. He said it at a prayer breakfast which I think was appropriate. I did think it was weird that he mentioned India though since their history isn't typically highlighted in that way. Overall I'm not sure why everyone is making such an issue of his comments.

Response by LCpl Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 11 at 2015 2:17 AM

2015-02-11T02:17:50-05:00

First, POTUS said the "terrorist are killing in the name of religion, NOT Killing in the name of Mohammad" but when he mentioned the Crusades he specified 'Killing in the name of Christ" or words to that affect. At this point Obama is embarrassing himself with every explanation out of his mouth. He pretty much has his staff and spokespeople mouthing the same thing and how it's NOT about Islam. I have high hopes someday someone will say " you don't expect us to believe that BS do you?" I wouldn't agree to anything obama wanted until he said" Islamic Terrorists or Muslim terrorist" just on shear principle

Response by SGT Steven Eugene Kuhn MBA made Feb 12 at 2015 4:42 AM

2015-02-12T04:42:44-05:00

Response by SGT Mark Sullivan made Mar 6 at 2015 12:07 AM

2015-03-06T00:07:04-05:00

There is a far cry difference between ISIS and the Crusades. I have no idea why he would mention this, but, I can speculate and mention that he wants to appease those people who get all bent out of shape, and state anything negative said about islam is racists, even though islam is not a race. Appeasement is such an ugly thing, per wikipedia Appeasement in a political context is a diplomatic policy of making political or material concessions to an enemy power in order to avoid conflict. And was commonly applied to Neville Chamberlains foreign policy towards Germany in 1937 when Germany invaded Czechoslovakia. Seems like appeasement is the thing these politicians do when it comes to ISIS, or radical islamists.

Response by MAJ Ken Landgren made May 1 at 2015 2:58 PM

2015-05-01T14:58:11-04:00

If you ignore the truth, it will go away? Don't mention a worthy adversary because their is no plan to deal with them?