What happens if a soldier avoids a deployment by fleeing to Mexico?

2018-02-12T21:02:21-05:00

Okay I am not talking about me by the way. But I was intrigued by the question and I can’t seem to find an answer anywhere. I’d like to know if the mexican government would support the return of the soldier for court martial, how he could be apprehended or if he could even make it to the border anyway. Suppose he is CONUS by the way.

Response by LTJG Richard Bruce made Feb 12 at 2018 9:13 PM

2018-02-12T21:13:14-05:00

It will be clearly a case of desertion. Question is how serious will the Army be in getting the person back. If the person is a dirt-bag that knows nothing important, then good riddance. But, if that person is a security risk, knows too much, about too much, then he will be tracked down and found without Mexican involvement. If he is not clumsy and falls down a flight of stairs a few times, then he will be returned to the USA to stand trial.

Response by TSgt David Holman made Feb 12 at 2018 9:42 PM

2018-02-12T21:42:54-05:00

Mexico has an extradition treaty... if he made it all the way down there, even in Mexico he would be considered a fugitive. Wouldn't be hard to get him back. Honestly, if you are asking for a friend who is thinking about this, I would caution him not to (and if he does, you no longer have any deniability).

Response by LTC Jason Mackay made Feb 12 at 2018 9:43 PM

2018-02-12T21:43:17-05:00

Desertion, shirking and or evading important duty. Once he hits thirty days AWOL, he should be DFR. As soon as he is AWOL he has a warrant for his arrest, the desertion just piles on. See AR190-9 and DD553. The 553 is entered into NCIC for apprehension by civil authorities. It is unclear if the 553 becomes an Interpol Red Notice. If the Mexican authorities apprehend him, they are supposed to notify the consulate with In 30 days. This doesn't happen consistently or at all. If the call goes to the consulate, they will see the US warrant, but the Mexican legal issue will play out first. The consulate may make notification about the Mexican apprehension. My assumption is we would extradite.

If he tries to cross back over the border on his own, Border Police may catch it if they run him on his reentry.

My advice to your friend is to deploy and do their job and none of this shit will matter. Once you get apprehended, you are returned to military control at your old unit, then processed for any residual UCMJ/charges and the requisite discharge.

Response by SGT Eric Davis made Feb 12 at 2018 10:00 PM

2018-02-12T22:00:37-05:00

Desertion; subject to UCMJ action and court Martial!

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 12 at 2018 10:10 PM

2018-02-12T22:10:11-05:00

Why Mexico? He's gonna get stuck on the other side of the wall ...

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 12 at 2018 10:11 PM

2018-02-12T22:11:22-05:00

Soldier MIGHT want to consider that he many stick out like a sore thumb. Easy target by cartel members to kidnap and use the soldier to bribe his family... and that usually doesn't end well.

Many soldiers never even get the chance to serve their countries overseas.
Probably shouldn't have signed the contract.

In my opinion, good.
I would rather have a good soldier by my side than one I couldn't count on.
One less sh*tbag means more funding and military education for good soldiers like myself!

Response by MSG David Johnson made Feb 12 at 2018 10:45 PM

2018-02-12T22:45:29-05:00

We had a guy go home on R&R to Puerto Rico and refused to come back. Saying his grandmother had no one to take care of her. I'm not sure whatever happened to him after the units return, but some of the troops were in contact with him on FB and he was terrified that he was going to Leavenworth for being a deserter.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 12 at 2018 10:47 PM

2018-02-12T22:47:47-05:00

Don't forget, on top of the Desertion/AWOL piece, your "friend" would also get missing movement charges as well. In situations like this, the charges would stack up against you, oops, I mean your friend in hopes that a majority of them will stick and you could be splitting rocks at Leavenworth in no time.

Response by Sgt Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 12 at 2018 11:07 PM

2018-02-12T23:07:28-05:00

As others have mentioned, nothing good will come of it. Why would someone join the military knowing that a deployment was a possibility?

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 13 at 2018 1:00 AM

2018-02-13T01:00:28-05:00

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2018/01/11/why-the-u-s-considers-parts-of-mexico-just-as-dangerous-to-visit-as-syria-and-yemen/?utm_term=.0ea6ddfcefc1

Why the U.S. considers parts of Mexico just as dangerous to visit as Syria and Yemen

2017 was a historic year for violence in Mexico, with the most homicide investigations since the country began measuring them two decades ago.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 13 at 2018 6:38 AM

2018-02-13T06:38:10-05:00

Article 80 Unauthorized Absence, Article 85 Desertion, Article 86 Absent Without Leave, Article 87 Missing Movement, said person could and probably would get each one. At the very minimum, they could Administratively Separate the person with an Other Than Honorable characterization of service at the maximum a Warrant could be issued for the Soldiers Arrest. Once in Custody the Soldier could be processed for Court-Martial.

Unauthorized Absence: Gone more that 30 Days and Apprehended by Authorities
- Dishonorable Discharge
- Confinement: 18 Months
- Forfeiture: Total
Desertion - In Time of War
- Death, Dishonorable Discharge, or Bad Conduct Discharge
- Confinement: Life
- Forfeiture: Total
Desertion - Intent to Avoid Hazardous Duty/Shirk Important Service
- Dishonorable Discharge or Bad Conduct Discharge
- Confinement: 5 Years
- Forfeiture: Total
AWOL
- Bad Conduct Discharge
- Confinement: 6 Months
- Forfeiture: Total
Missing Movement - Through Design
- Dishonorable Discharge or Bad Conduct Discharge
- Confinement: 2 Years
- Forfeiture: Total

We also have an extradition treaty with Mexico, they ship us criminals all the time.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 13 at 2018 8:12 AM

2018-02-13T08:12:28-05:00

Look in the Uniform Code of Military Justice under Absent Without Leave (AWOL) and Desertion.

Response by SPC David Willis made Feb 13 at 2018 9:50 AM

2018-02-13T09:50:03-05:00

Honestly what's most likely to happen is nothing. Desertion isn't prosecuted like it used to be, and he will probably get a dishonorable or an OTH discharge and that'll be it.

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 13 at 2018 9:58 AM

2018-02-13T09:58:28-05:00

Without getting to far out of my lane and into the legal weeds basically a few things happen. You fail to report to your place of work/duty (chargeable offense 1). If this was deemed and proven to be intentional this can be considered desertion of post (depending on circumstances). After 24 hours you can be charged AWOL (absent without leave). There is a standard procedure for extraditing people between states and even nations. The different agencies have legats who are experts in international law and extradition treaties and they initiate a process to have you returned. Some nations have agreements with us, some do not and others still dont honor their agreements. The process is initiated and the accused is flagged in US and international criminal wanted databases. Then everyone waits to see if the person returns or if they are extradited back to the US.

Response by SGT Dave Tracy made Feb 13 at 2018 9:58 AM

2018-02-13T09:58:38-05:00

So does it go something like this: "I'm butthurt, and I don't wanna do this anymore! I'm going to Mexico and cry!"

Talk about a long-term solution to short-term problems.

If this is about a real person, and not hypothetical, tell him to quit being a punk. Suck it up. Its only a few short years out of his life, that HE signed up for and whose contract will eventually end. No matter how much Army life sucks--or he IMAGINES it sucks having probably never known real "suck" in life to compare Army life against--if he gets out on good terms, instead of having a profoundly bad decision follow him for the rest of his life, he'll not only be able to hold his head high, knowing he made it, but will have all the tangible benefits (VA) and intangible benefits (pride, respect, looks good on a resume) of having honorably served a stint in the military.

It's only a few years.

And yes, he'll get caught eventually; even in Mexico. He'll always have to live with worry over the potential ramifications, until those ramifications eventually catch up to him.

Response by Col Jim Harmon made Feb 13 at 2018 11:13 AM

2018-02-13T11:13:37-05:00

Illegal immigration to Mexico is a crime and punishable by ten years in jail (isn't that ironic).

So after spending ten years in a Mexican prison, the solider in question would then go on trial under the U.S. military system for desertion and missing a movement. So more jail time.

Double jeopardy does exist under the UCMJ.

Response by SrA Paul Pfeil made Feb 13 at 2018 11:41 AM

2018-02-13T11:41:34-05:00

Pretty sure the maximum punishment for desertion during war time is death by hanging or firing squad. I hear the cartel isnt fond of us military to begin with. He might find himself in a barrel of concrete.

Response by SGM Mikel Dawson made Feb 13 at 2018 12:28 PM

2018-02-13T12:28:17-05:00

My response is: If you don't wish to deploy, why did you enlist? I mean your friend.

Response by COL William Oseles made Feb 13 at 2018 12:54 PM

2018-02-13T12:54:39-05:00

Easy to make it to the border and you can just walk over. The Mexican Government would have no problem with the soldier as long as the soldier can pay his/her way.
Break the law and will server jail time in a Mexican Jail, not a nice place.

Response by SGT Tony Clifford made Feb 13 at 2018 1:22 PM

2018-02-13T13:22:42-05:00

If you're truly asking about someone else, you're duty bound to report this to your teamleader or squadleader. If you do not, you now have written proof that you're aware of a soldier's intent to dessert. You too can now be charged under UCMJ. Report him, anyone who would be willing to abandon his squad doesn't deserve any loyalty from you.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 13 at 2018 1:32 PM

2018-02-13T13:32:05-05:00

You need to tell your friend to quit being a nancy, grab onto his bootstraps, and remove his head from his 4th point of contact. The ramifications for what you're asking about are a lot worse than going to the box as a commo guy (assuming that's what your friend does too). Anyone who has signed up since September 11, 2001 shouldn't have signed up at all if they weren't prepared to deploy. It's no secret that we've been involved in numerous on-going armed conflicts around the globe for the last 16+ years.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 13 at 2018 1:43 PM

2018-02-13T13:43:51-05:00

Or just don’t be a scumbag.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 13 at 2018 1:47 PM

2018-02-13T13:47:29-05:00

Just tell your “ friend” that there are easier ways to get out of a deployment if he so chooses to be a coward. That he can go to sick call and claim some bs.

Response by SN Greg Wright made Feb 13 at 2018 1:59 PM

2018-02-13T13:59:17-05:00

AWOL. Desertion. Missing movement. Maybe get robbed or beheaded by cartels. Easily apprehended, and Mexico indeed has an extradition treaty with the US. Your 'friend' wouldn't last 6 months, guaranteed. Tell him to man the fuck up and keep the word he gave to his country.

Response by 2LT Ronald Reimer made Feb 13 at 2018 3:04 PM

2018-02-13T15:04:09-05:00

Mexico would welcome him with open arms, shield him from violating any immigration laws that he violated, shower him with free housing, education, healthcare, food and spending money, invite his spouse, children, parents, aunts, uncles, grandparents and cousins to legally immigrate, (jumping ahead of all the other immigrants that were going through the process the lawful, correct way), and provide him and his family with any documents, television or other communication in his native language. Duh. = )

Response by MAJ Michael Rieker made Feb 13 at 2018 3:09 PM

2018-02-13T15:09:56-05:00

If Andrew Tahmooressi provided any example, Mexican authorities don’t take very kindly to Americans who they think are up to no good.

Response by Capt Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 13 at 2018 3:30 PM

2018-02-13T15:30:07-05:00

I believe this could be called desertion and desertion can be punishable by death.

Response by SGM Bill Frazer made Feb 13 at 2018 5:14 PM

2018-02-13T17:14:28-05:00

Field grade Art-15 or court martial. Admin discharge. They will flag his SSN, if it turns up they could be arrested and tried regardless how much time passes.

Response by SFC Christopher Taggart made Feb 13 at 2018 6:37 PM

2018-02-13T18:37:55-05:00

A good article, about a Sergeant that deserted. Why Mexico??

https://www.military.com/spouse/relationships/ms-vicki-we-deserted-now-what.html

We Deserted: What Now?

A soldier and his wife both seek advice after he deserts his unit and they fear getting caught.

Response by PFC Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 13 at 2018 7:10 PM

2018-02-13T19:10:59-05:00

Wow, the next Bergdahl already making his plans of going AWOL and Deserting his team members........

These new civilians coming in wanting to play GI JOE AND GI JANE need to vetted better. They are are just allowing anyone that passes in now...very sad and pathetic

Response by SP5 Peter Keane made Feb 13 at 2018 7:13 PM

2018-02-13T19:13:24-05:00

My brother went AWOL because he couldn't go to RVN. He was gone over a year when they got close, so he turned himself in to the US Marshall. Got a BCD and 6 months Hard Labor

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 13 at 2018 9:14 PM

2018-02-13T21:14:46-05:00

"Asking for a friend" Don't do it.......

Response by Sgt Dale Briggs made Feb 13 at 2018 9:24 PM

2018-02-13T21:24:10-05:00

Why in the hell did your friend enlist in the first place? Deployments? No shit it's what you do, and were in a training mode right now not active combat I believe. Probably and hopefully significant jail time, and a dishonorable discharge and good luck getting a job that's not flipping burgers at McDonalds. Why anyone would do this is beyond me, Federal time would be worse than Afghanastan by a mile, I'm sure some Vet inmate who's run afoul might make him his GF for being a chickenshit.

Response by 1LT Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 13 at 2018 9:28 PM

2018-02-13T21:28:09-05:00

I would counsel your friend to consult the next available mental health practitioner - then a chaplain, priest, imam, or rabbi. It is an ethical, moral, and legal crime to avoid deployment by running away. Mexico is certainly not anywhere near the top of the list of countries in which to seek sanctuary - the odds are he / she would stand out like a sore thumb - and be quickly deported to the United States. Why on God's Green Earth would anyone even toy with the idea of running away after the thorough documentation of military photographs, fingerprints, security clearance, and forensic DNA archival processes? Your friend would no doubt end up being permanently marked, profiled, exiled, and shamed for life. Who in their right mind would want any part of that - absent some seriously disturbed mental illness? Warmest Regards, Sandy :)

p.s. I am curious - what possible reason could he / she have for this intentional desertion???

https://youtu.be/_-Mnp6VAmEc

Branded TV Series Theme Song

The full theme song from the TV series Branded.

Response by CMDCM Gene Treants made Feb 13 at 2018 10:16 PM

2018-02-13T22:16:37-05:00

Okay, first off "your friend" needs to understand there is no statute of limitations on desertion PERIOD.
See the Ms. Vicki article that SFC Christopher Taggart posted for a good example. and read on, please:
I was on USS Nashville and we were in the Med on deployment when a deserter was returned to us for judgment. A deserter is always returned to his/her last command if possible in the Navy even if that command is deployed and overseas.

Petty Officer First Class X (that is an E-6 in the Navy FYI) had some "personal problems at home" and the only way he thought he could solve them was to go home immediately. He had used up all his leave and he decided "fuck it, I'll just go and take care of it and be back in a couple of days." Well, Days turned into weeks, into months and then years.

One day he was driving down the road with his wife and kids and was stopped for a speeding ticket. The State Patrol Officer in PA checked and arrested him on the spot for being a deserter, handcuffed him in front of his children and took him away! Brig Chasers were dispatched and within a day he was back in Navy custody and within 2 days after that, he was on a plane to the Med and eventually to Marcelles, France, and USS Nashville. Once on Nashville, a CM was convened, he was convicted and I had the "pleasure" of escorting him and 2 others to Rota, Spain for confinement there, not back in CONUS. He was sentenced to 24 months, BCD, loss of all pay and allowances, and reduction to E-1.

So, What happens if a soldier avoids a deployment by fleeing to Mexico? Can you guess?

Response by Cpl Eric White made Feb 14 at 2018 8:13 AM

2018-02-14T08:13:35-05:00

We had a junior marine go AWOL. This guy was the epitome of a military turd and everyone tried to help him. He disappeared for about 2 weeks then someone from the unit saw him on base. Marines and I am sure other branches don't have much love for those instances. Our CWO-3 sent a few of us out to "retrieve" him. Needless to say we accomplished the mission and he found out the hard way that what he did wasn't a good idea. Besides being in the brig for three months he caught the desertion charge and was dishonorably separated. People should know what their getting into before they sign the papers military is not for everybody. Yet when the commitment is made for better or worse you're now representing America's fighting force and that comes with responsibility as well as repercussions regarding the shirking of that responsibility.

Response by CW5 Sam R. Baker made Feb 14 at 2018 11:18 AM

2018-02-14T11:18:10-05:00

Leaving any post or duty when not on leave and expected to be there is AWOL or a missed movement, even to a CTC like JRTC and NTC. We have had warrant officers with a GOMOR and released from active duty due to missing formation and trips to the training centers. Missing any right time and place has ramifications that one may not wish to endure if the chain of command does its due diligence.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 14 at 2018 12:48 PM

2018-02-14T12:48:34-05:00

I hope he rots in his own he'll full of cowards like him who joined the military in war time only to run and hide when his name came up.
Good riddance.
Bye, Felicia

Response by MSG John Duchesneau made Feb 15 at 2018 11:11 PM

2018-02-15T23:11:33-05:00

He'd get deported to the US for being an illegal alien. More seriously, if he got caught by the Federal Police in Mexico he would be deported to the US as a deserter and get court martialed.

Response by SSG Emanuel Alvarez made Feb 21 at 2018 12:41 PM

2018-02-21T12:41:33-05:00

LoL! loved the joke.

Response by SSgt Daniel d'Errico made Mar 3 at 2018 5:13 AM

2018-03-03T05:13:15-05:00

First of all, any military member AWOL in a foreign country like Mexico, would be at the mercy of the Mexican government. If this member was without his passport were apprehended, Mexico wouldn't always return him/her to the USA. Mexican jail is no sweet place to be for a "gringo" AWOL military member to be. If the American embassy cuts a deal for that member's release, then that member gets to go back to the USA, face AWOL charges, maybe desertion charges, time in Leavenworth (maybe) and then a dishonorable discharge. Or the judge can send that member's butt to his deployment that he missed. Nah.

Response by PO3 J.W. Nelson made Mar 5 at 2018 9:12 AM

2018-03-05T09:12:40-05:00

Should this individual successfully cross the border into Mexico and miss his deployment date, then he should be listed and pursued as "AWOL" ! Should this period of time extent past the 30 day time from, then he should be designated a "deserted" and sought on a criminal military warrant, and yes the Mexican government will gladly return this man to his own country rather than risk an international incident !

Response by PO1 Gregory Medina made Mar 8 at 2018 6:14 PM

2018-03-08T18:14:41-05:00

Depends on if this country is at war

Response by Capt Tom Brown made Mar 11 at 2018 9:15 PM

2018-03-11T21:15:07-04:00

We used to have an occasional Marine go UA while we were deployed on our WestPac cruise. In these cases, we were already deployed on ships, and they would normally go UA in Okinawa or PRI and not come back when we left port. We just left them out there and took no action other than normal reporting such an incident higher up and to local authorities. Unless they were apprehended breaking a local law, local LEOs paid them no mind. They always came back in a month or so when their money ran out and their girlfriends kicked them out. By then they had usually lost 20-30# and looked like something the cat drug in.

Response by Maj John Bell made Mar 12 at 2018 10:51 AM

2018-03-12T10:51:02-04:00

It doesn't matter where they run. The only thing that matters is that they are AWOL/UA, and eventually declared a deserter.

My first month as a platoon leader, I got back a Marine who had been a deserter from the platoon for 24 years. He deserted the year before I was born. There was no war, he just didn't want to be a Marine anymore. He had a wife three kids and was the General Manager of a KMart about 30 miles North of Camp Pendleton.

Less than 4 hours after being apprehended in the KMart, he was standing in front of my desk, head shaved, heels locked, serious dumbfounded 1000 yard stare; being informed of his rights. Then next day he plead guilty to desertion. 90 days later he was released from the brig and sent on his way with a BCD. He had no job and I don't know what happened with the marriage, but neither his wife or kids were there to pick him up.

Response by CWO3 Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 12 at 2018 1:28 PM

2018-03-12T13:28:14-04:00

Spend the rest of your life looking over your shoulder. Once the Service deems you a potential deserter they turn it over to the proper authorities. Try to reenter US and they gotcha. If you make it through illegally, the first time you get a traffic stop they gotcha. You can run but you can't hide - forever. It's just a matter of time.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 12 at 2018 6:38 PM

2018-03-12T18:38:17-04:00

If they are going to break their word and violate their oath, they are going to suffer. The best thing your friend could do would be to go talk to a Chaplain or lawyer who could help them navigate the situation while bringing as little dishonor upon themselves as possible.

Response by SPC Jovani Daviu made Mar 12 at 2018 7:22 PM

2018-03-12T19:22:51-04:00

I do not like this question. Just the thought of desertion bothers me.

Response by CW3 Kevin Storm made Mar 13 at 2018 8:01 PM

2018-03-13T20:01:22-04:00

So when you get caught for doing something really dumb in Mexico, who is going to help you then?

Response by SPC Trina Cox made Mar 22 at 2018 9:21 PM

2018-03-22T21:21:12-04:00

Should have never joined if he didn't want to deploy

Response by SSG Lawrence Crow made Mar 22 at 2018 9:54 PM

2018-03-22T21:54:34-04:00

AWOL/UA, Desertion, Missing Movement, among many other charges. Perhaps this soldier should have thought it through before taking an Oath to defend.

Response by CMSgt Steve Pennington made Mar 31 at 2018 6:51 PM

2018-03-31T18:51:02-04:00

So here goes a war story. I graduated from high school in 1967, with the draft in force. A friend was drafted in the Spring of '68 and sent to Fort Ord. He and a friend decided to desert and go to Mexico. They got as far as SoCal and ran out of money. His folks flew down to talk him into returning to Ord. Which is what he did. It was so common in those days that the process was NJP, tack your bad time onto the end of your TOS and recycle you in training. He ended up in a Trans Co. in Vietnam driving a fork lift unloading ships. The kicker came when he was discharged and was 8 days past the 2 year point and got the pay raise for over 2 for lomgevity for pay purposes.

Response by CPT Larry Hudson made Apr 4 at 2018 1:33 PM

2018-04-04T13:33:03-04:00

If you are an active soldier you are accounted for every morning. Avoiding deployment is violation of UCMJ and going to Mexico is desertion. Burgdahl deserted his post received nothing in way of justice. You might now get away with it, but if I was your commanding officer, I would ask for prosecution to fullest extent of law and request Mexico extradition to the US.

Response by SSG Brian G. made Apr 15 at 2018 3:30 PM

2018-04-15T15:30:40-04:00

First off the SM is looking at charges of missing movement, AWOL and desertion. Mexico has extradition treaties with the US so if the US government knew the SM was in Mexico and if the SM had not broken any Mexican laws and they had him in custody he would be extradited to the US or simply held while members of the SM branch went to Mexico to retrieve him.

He could be apprehended any number of ways

Response by SSG Chris Allsopp made Apr 17 at 2018 6:12 PM

2018-04-17T18:12:00-04:00

Desertion/AWOL. Any soldier AWOL will have a warrant for arrest and safe return. Mexican authorities work with US authorities well. That being said.... Sometimes it takes a really long time for people to be extradited from Mexico.

Response by SSG Chris Allsopp made Apr 18 at 2018 4:28 PM

2018-04-18T16:28:18-04:00

My best recommendation to someone of that mind set. Don't give up, talk to your brothers and sisters and find the courage to do what you promissed. Trust them, if not them your leadership. Most importantly take care of your battle buddies like you would for your family.

Response by CW3 Kevin Storm made Apr 20 at 2018 11:08 AM

2018-04-20T11:08:32-04:00

Well that would depend, we could go all Private Eddie Slovak on you (look him up), or you could do jail, or get off light with the liberal democrats, get a free sex change and a pardon.

Response by SrA Matthew E. O'Neil made Apr 22 at 2018 10:19 PM

2018-04-22T22:19:49-04:00

I WOULD LIKE TO SEE THE PERSON DO A YEAR IN JAIL FOR DESERTION. I THINK THAT GOING AWOL IS THE WORST THING A SOLDIER, AIRMAN OR SAILOR CAN DO.

Response by SPC Byron Skinner made Apr 23 at 2018 7:09 PM

2018-04-23T19:09:38-04:00

Sp4 Byron Skinner, This question has become very timely with the call up of National Guardsmen and women to, patrol monitor, man electronic surveillance. In his initial request to the states President Trump said that the guardsmen would not be armed and would aid regular armed border patrol personal but not make arrests. To soldiers this sounded just goofy, soldiers go in armed, period. A picture of Texas national Guard manning an electric listening post said to be along the Texas Mexican border. The Team consisted of four soldiers and an M-1114. THe dish for the listening device is quite apparent in the gunners turret of the Vehicle along with a M-240 with an ammunition belt visible. The other three soldiers two standing dismounted and a third in the drivers position all seemed to be armed with M-4's and on the two dismounts magazines were clearly inserted. The dismounts were clearly wearing combat vests and driver and Guardsman in gun turret were wearing combat helmets. The Texas guard clearly were disregarding what appears to be the Commander and Chiefs policy/orders in the role they were expected to play on the Border. The obvious question is what orders are to be obeyed. What the President of the United States said was policy/orders or what the Guard commander of the formation assigned to the task. Although fire arm violence on the Mexican US border contrary to President Trump is an uncommon event and usual also involved robbery. I could understand the wearing of side arms by troops that are traveling with and assisting ICE officers, that is called self defense and I assume that National Guard Troops have the same weapons qualifications that Regular troops in the same MOS has. That would as it did back in the day qualification with the M-1911 in my day, the M-9 today as part of AIT training for 11B's, 11C's and 11H's. Question would a National Guardsman of Hispanic heritage be justified on a moral basis in refusing to carry a weapon on the US/Mexico border be held for disobeying a direct order that counters what most of American considers an order, what the President says??

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 24 at 2018 11:53 AM

2018-04-24T11:53:10-04:00

Why would anyone flee to Mexico? He'd probably end up in the Mexican military and wish he'd deployed. I would talk to this friend and give him some advice about the consequences.

The first question I would ask is why in the hell did he enlist in the first place. It's not like he was drafted. I've seen questions similar to this on other military sites and I always ask why did you enlist. It's not like you can't find out what it's like to be in the military with all of the information that is available online. Those who went into the service before the internet didn't have that option.

He would be in sorry shape if he fleed to avoid deployment and the shame that would follow when he is caught. Don't they have classes on this prior to any deployment because I'm sure this idea has been pondered by some service members. I'd rather get killed than go to Mexico.

Response by SSG Jeremy Sharp made Apr 24 at 2018 12:06 PM

2018-04-24T12:06:52-04:00

Processed as a deserter, warrant filed, BCD if/when found and processed.

Response by 1LT Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 24 at 2018 3:23 PM

2018-04-24T15:23:39-04:00

Not 100% sure on how quickly and effectively said soldier would or could be extradited. However, regardless of official personnel backing in Mexico; people can and will find/report said soldier for the right amount of “motivation”. I lived in Mexico in the past (mind you, I’m Hispanic), and I would never want to go there again. It would also be very difficult to sustain a reasonable life without a steady income, especially when you’re an outsider. It is not safe there, at all...

Response by CW4 Private RallyPoint Member made May 5 at 2018 11:15 AM

2018-05-05T11:15:13-04:00

Wow...really? Get out of my Army, you don't deserve to wear the uniform.

Response by SCPO Renato Hidalgo made May 17 at 2018 3:22 PM

2018-05-17T15:22:38-04:00

The soldier would become an outlaw and would be forced to buy a van and team up with three other individuals to become heroes for hire....but seriously the ex-soldier will be fine in Mexico until he gets busted for whatever reason. It depends on the severity. In the Navy we had one guy fake his death on the Carrier and snuck out to meet his sister in Mexico. If he would have deserted it wouldnt have been a big deal, but because he faked his death to collect the insurance money, NCIS went into Mexico and extradited his dumbass back to the states to face charges.

Response by Sgt Mike Jacobi made May 19 at 2018 12:27 AM

2018-05-19T00:27:23-04:00

would depend on the political climate at the time and the size of the bribes he could pay.

Response by SSgt David Marks made May 19 at 2018 3:08 AM

2018-05-19T03:08:35-04:00

They are considered AWOL until they are gone for 90 days or more, then it's desertion, then it's turned over to the FBI. Then they come and get you/or them wherever you are.

Response by PFC Private RallyPoint Member made May 19 at 2018 3:43 AM

2018-05-19T03:43:05-04:00

He would be considered a deserter. If he is extradited, he would be executed or spend a long time in Fort Leavenworth.

Response by LCDR William Stevens made Jun 1 at 2018 9:23 AM

2018-06-01T09:23:50-04:00

Since it is not "you" but a "friend" hopefully the same thing that happened to evaders and deserters that fled to Canada back in the 60s -70s. Get use to the loss of connection to family and get used to always looking over your shoulder.

Response by PO3 Tom Adams made Jun 2 at 2018 6:34 AM

2018-06-02T06:34:15-04:00

Desertion followed by a COURT MARTIAL and SUBSEQUENT FIRING SQUAD.

Response by CPL Peter King made Jun 4 at 2018 11:58 PM

2018-06-04T23:58:18-04:00

“Cowardice in the face of the enemy”.

I believe that Mexico would not return deserters if they faced the death penalty.

Unless you are conscripted you can not use consciousness objector!

Response by SGM Bill Frazer made Jun 5 at 2018 8:47 AM

2018-06-05T08:47:40-04:00

PS- They put a bounty on his head, and retirees get a free license! LAMO

Response by Poly Amorgy made Oct 30 at 2018 8:10 PM

2018-10-30T20:10:39-04:00

Yes, the Mexican government and every other government in the world would support the return of the soldier for court martial. The BEST thing the soldier could do is to turn himself in at the border, on the way back into the US, if he's already crossed into a different country. Then he should BEG the military to take him back, and if they refuse and decide to prosecute him he should plead temporary insanity. They'll probably kick him out on the basis of a mental disability. THIS HAPPENS ALL THE TIME!!!

The military is really only good for people who have strong political connections and whose family members have been high-ranking officers. Everyone else gets shat upon, but it is a good way to get a few extra bucks for college ... but not that good because you're essentially signing your life over to the care of some of the dumbest and cruelest people on the planet.

Response by Poly Amorgy made Oct 30 at 2018 8:25 PM

2018-10-30T20:25:26-04:00

OH! You're talking about Trump, aren't you? Mexico would definitely return him, but he received so many medical deferments from playing too much golf that the military wouldn't have been able to do anything with him anyway. They would have called his mommy and she would have had the nanny pick him up in time for his afternoon bubbly bath and nap. Didn't Trump campaign on forcing Mexico to pay for the wall? How ironical.

Response by Cpl James R. " Jim" Gossett Jr made Nov 11 at 2019 3:10 PM

2019-11-11T15:10:39-05:00

Someone needs to find him and kick His Sorry A$$, before turning him in...

Response by LTC Charles T Dalbec made Nov 11 at 2019 6:10 PM

2019-11-11T18:10:42-05:00

I will NOT respond to a stupid question like this which could cause current and future problems for AWOLs. Ok

Response by SGT(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 1 at 2020 2:52 AM

2020-01-01T02:52:33-05:00

To reiterate my original post, this was not about me, never considered it, never will. I now think I should've probably worded this better. This was just a hypothetical, I was bored one day and thought of the "what if" scenario. Kind of a "what would happen if I burned the barracks down?" We all know it's not a great idea, buuuut, there was no information anywhere on a not common but real thing. I appreciate the one's that gave a direct answer, and I apologize to the one's that thought I was yeeting to another country.