The battle of the tank busters: Frogfoot versus Warthog. Who would win the battle?

SP5 Mark Kuzinski — Mon, 05 Dec 2016 07:53:31 -0500

The A-10 Thunderbolt II is the undisputed king of close-air support.

But what you may not know is that the plane nearly wasn’t picked to handle close-air support – it had to compete with the Northrop A-9. And that plane looks a heck of a lot like the one the Soviets picked to bust American tanks if the Cold War went hot.

So who would win the battle; The Su-25 “Frogfoot” or the A-10?

Response by SP5 Mark Kuzinski made Dec 5 at 2016 7:54 AM

SP5 Mark Kuzinski — Mon, 05 Dec 2016 07:54:28 -0500

Who would win the battle?

The big reason the A-10 won the A-X competition in 1973 was due to the fact that Fairchild had the design pretty well locked down. The plane was merged with the GAU-8 30mm Avenger cannon, given a very powerful bomb load (up to 16,000 pounds of cluster bombs, laser-guided bombs, iron bombs, AGM-65 Maverick missiles, and rockets). The A-10C, which entered service in 2005, added the ability to use Joint Direct Attack Munitions (GPS-guided smart bombs) and the Wind-Corrected Munition Dispensers (cluster bombs with GPS-guidance and a range of over 12 miles). The plane even carries AIM-9 Sidewinders for self-defense (although, Desert Storm proved that the GAU-8 can take down aircraft, too). In short, this is a plane that is designed to kill enemy tanks, infantry fighting vehicles, armored personnel carriers, and grunts.
The A-10 can not only dish out punishment, it can take it. Like the P-47 Thunderbolt, there are tales of terribly damaged A-10s bringing their pilots home. Perhaps the most famous example was the 2003 incident where Air Force Capt. Kim “Killer Chick” Campbell brought her A-10 home on manual reversion. The A-10 was designed to come home with serious battle damage – and it has.
The Su-25, though, is an interesting beast. The Soviets followed the A-X competition and decided they needed a plane like that of their own.
That said, they picked the loser of the competition to copy. The Su-25 carries about 9,000 pounds of bombs, rockets and missiles, including the AA-8 Aphid. It is a bit faster, hitting Mach .8 as opposed to the A-10’s Mach .56, and has a longer range (750 nautical miles to the A-10’s 695). Like the A-10, it, too, has a 30mm Gatling gun.
So, which plane is the better option? Let’s be very blunt here: The A-10 brings more payload and is tougher. The Frogfoot might be 40% faster than the Warthog, but it can’t outrun a Sidewinder, while an AA-8 is likely to just annoy the Warthog’s pilot and really infuriate the crew chief.
Let’s be honest, the Soviets made a knock-off of the losing design, and it would probably lose in a fight with an A-10, too.

Response by MCPO Mark Durland made Dec 5 at 2016 7:57 AM

MCPO Mark Durland — Mon, 05 Dec 2016 07:57:58 -0500

I have NO idea, but it sure would be fun to watch!

Response by SSgt Dan Montague made Dec 5 at 2016 9:51 AM

SSgt Dan Montague — Mon, 05 Dec 2016 09:51:07 -0500

I don't know much about the Frogfoot, but I do know the A-10 has more than proven it's self many times over. Not just for fire power but durability and survivability for the pilot. Keeping the A-10 was the best decision thus far when it comes to military aviation.

Response by SPC(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 5 at 2016 12:43 PM

SPC(P) Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 05 Dec 2016 12:43:12 -0500

Aircraft Vs Aircraft I'll go with the A-10 but a lot of this goes into the experience of the pilot as well.

Response by Capt Seid Waddell made Dec 5 at 2016 1:46 PM

Capt Seid Waddell — Mon, 05 Dec 2016 13:46:09 -0500

Maneuverability and the gun.

Response by TSgt Joe C. made Dec 5 at 2016 8:27 PM

TSgt Joe C. — Mon, 05 Dec 2016 20:27:13 -0500

Warthog all the time, no doubt!

Response by SGT Frank Leonardo made Dec 6 at 2016 12:35 AM

SGT Frank Leonardo — Tue, 06 Dec 2016 00:35:21 -0500

A 10 troop support cannon with wings

Response by TSgt Dan Decker made Dec 6 at 2016 8:03 AM

TSgt Dan Decker — Tue, 06 Dec 2016 08:03:46 -0500

No battle. The A-10 would blow the Frogfoot away from the gitgo. I worked A-10s for 3 years while stationed at Nellis AFB. Awesome plane. In dissimilar air to air combat, the A-10 could out turn every aircraft that ever went up against it. The only way another aircraft could score a kill on a Warthog was to stand off and hit it with a missile. And that usually didn't occur to the other pilot until he had lost repeatedly. Seems they simply had to show off and let the Warthog driver know they were there. That big gun can stay pointed at you on the ground or in the air for what seems like days. I used to ride in pickup trucks serving as targets for the A-10 while our Nellis pilots were training Army helicopter pilots how to manage a battle field with tanks, A-10s and choppers. The A-10 would drop in behind us and no matter what the driver of the truck tried to do, would hold that gun on us for up to 30 seconds! The only shortcoming I know of for the A-10 is the small number of rounds available for the gun, about 15 seconds worth!

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 6 at 2016 5:38 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 06 Dec 2016 17:38:38 -0500

The A-10 of course. It has more than proven itself in numerous conflicts over the years.

Response by Sgt Mike Sarris made Dec 6 at 2016 11:32 PM

Sgt Mike Sarris — Tue, 06 Dec 2016 23:32:14 -0500

A-10 all day long. The Frogfoot may have the speed advantage, but the USAF picked the A-10 over the A-9 for a reason, the Russians copied the wrong plane!

Response by LTC Stephen F. made Dec 7 at 2016 12:38 AM

LTC Stephen F. — Wed, 07 Dec 2016 00:38:33 -0500

I know very little about the Su-25 “Frogfoot” SP5 Mark Kuzinski so I am very biased by the my knowledge of what the A-10 Warthog can do in support of ground forces with a skilled pilot as they work in pairs to reap death and destruction on the enemy.
My vote is for the A-10 hands down.

Response by Maj Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 4 at 2017 1:53 PM

Maj Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 04 Jan 2017 13:53:20 -0500

The A-10 was and is still the meanest kid on the block. Was as red flag with my F15E unit. During one skirmish an A-10 pilot scored to kills on the F-15 because he was hiding low and slow. When the mudhen came screaming through the hog popped up and score...oh my goodness was the mudhen pilot mad.

Response by Lt Col John (Jack) Christensen made Jan 4 at 2017 2:26 PM

Lt Col John (Jack) Christensen — Wed, 04 Jan 2017 14:26:15 -0500

Pretty much agree with all the responses to this question. What surprises me is that no one has mentioned the pilot at the controls of the aircraft. This has always been the big difference between US and Soviet/Russian aircraft. Our pilots are trained to independently see and react according to the circumstances in front of them, our adversaries don't react until told to do so by their command authority. The independent thinking aircraft is going to take out the controlled aircraft 100% of the time.