Should we have decompression time after combat service?

2014-08-26T00:08:41-04:00

I have recently joined the board of an organization (Team Veteran Foundation). Through my work there I have met a psychologist working on a book. She spoke about the decompression time that WWII troops experienced before returning home. This in contrast to the 24 hour return direct from Afghanistan.

Case in point. Remember the Band of Brothers series they spent all that time in Austria after VE day and then came home by ship and then by train. This resulted in as much as 6 months of non-combat time to decompress.

I have never served in an active fire zone. So I need combat veterans to please provide me your thoughts, reflections and views.

P.S. The mission of the Team Veteran Foundation is to eliminate or greatly reduce the Veteran Suicide rate. http://www.ttvfoundation.org

The Team Veterans Foundation Home Page

Response by PO1 Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 26 at 2014 12:55 AM

2014-08-26T00:55:40-04:00

Absolutely...away from family and friends.

Response by Cpl Matthew Wall made Aug 26 at 2014 7:49 AM

2014-08-26T07:49:06-04:00

I guess I'm confused by the question. Are troops not getting decompression time anymore? When we got home we had to stay on base for a week before we could go on leave. Went on leave for a couple of weeks and then came back and went back to training. We did a deployment rotation every 6-7 months. Are you saying we should have longer?

Response by Cpl Dennis F. made Aug 26 at 2014 12:18 PM

2014-08-26T12:18:55-04:00

Absolutely.
I was slated to return to 2nd Tanks in Lejeune where many of my fellow tankers had returned, I was offered and opted for an early out instead...big mistake. I went home to family and friends who had not a clue and felt like I had returned to a different planet. The result: I was "out of sorts" to understate for years. Had I had the chance to meet up and talk with those who had experienced what I had, I believe I would have had use of many wasted years.

Response by SGT(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 27 at 2014 5:00 AM

2014-08-27T05:00:53-04:00

I've served 2 combat tours to Iraq 2003 - 2004 & 2011. There was very little time to decompress after the tours were over before coming home.

Response by Cpl Dennis F. made Aug 28 at 2014 5:49 PM

2014-08-28T17:49:49-04:00

I'm kind of surprised at the low response on this. Perhaps a component of the need for this is the fact that it is not necessarily immediately seen as a problem until problems (PTSD) develop at a later time from its not being addressed.

Response by SFC Mark Merino made Aug 30 at 2014 5:30 PM

2014-08-30T17:30:09-04:00

Fantastic topic. I remember getting off the plane and the wife (ex) tossing me the keys to drive home. BAD IDEA! There definitely needs to be a period of decompression longer than is currently in place. I'm for letting the troops get drunk as well before they get home. It's better to exercise some demons PRIOR to trying it at home for the first time. If someone is going to "screw up big time" when they are drunk after all that trigger time, let's see if we can identify it before it gets plastered all over the media at home. Just a few thoughts......

Response by PO1 Matthew Maxon made Aug 31 at 2014 11:32 AM

2014-08-31T11:32:46-04:00

After I left my last ship, I had done 3 Iraq deployments and was getting ready for a 4th when I transferred off. If I hadn't done that 3 years of shore duty and when I first got there, I went to Fleet and Family Service Center and talked to someone for a while and I don't know I would be as adjusted if I hadn't done that. People need to decompress and get into a better mind set after combat deployments.

Response by Capt Jeff S. made Sep 1 at 2014 5:56 PM

2014-09-01T17:56:07-04:00

If they are coming out of a hot combat zone where they saw action, they earned time to decompress.

Response by MAJ Bill Whitman made Sep 5 at 2014 1:24 PM

2014-09-05T13:24:21-04:00

I left combat in OIF1 in June 2003 and in the course of a plane ride was back home at Fort McPherson in Atlanta. Civilian clothes through the regular airport into my family's arms. No parades or downtime, maybe two weeks off to start out processing to PCS to Fort Carson. I would wake up in a surreal haze for months not knowing where I was, had vivid flashbacks to dust/dirt/heat etc. even in the cold of Colorado. Definitely favor decompression but not in the current format of block leave after deployment. It needs to be before coming back, maybe 2-3 months at a rear area or in Europe.

Response by LTC Paul Labrador made Sep 5 at 2014 1:31 PM

2014-09-05T13:31:20-04:00

LTC Dave Grossman talks about this in his book "On Killing". He mentions that all primitive societies had "cleansing rituals" that warriors had to go through before being allowed back into society. Even in WW2 (as mentioned) the long periods of time between the end of combat and return home (took a week or so to cruise back home on a troops ship) served as a "cleansing time" for our soldiers. Nowadays, soldiers can literally be in a combat zone shooting at somebody and 18hrs later be at home on their sofa. That can be extremely jarring.

Response by SFC William Swartz Jr made Sep 5 at 2014 3:36 PM

2014-09-05T15:36:06-04:00

There should be, as has been stated earlier in the thread, some sort of decompression time outside of the combat zone prior to a servicemember returning home to their family. After OIF in June, 2003, I was tapped by the CO to serve as the NCOIC of the detail sent to Kuwait to turn-in our company's tanks. I was also awaiting a possible Red Cross message on my wife for health issues, so he wanted me to be closer to home than being in Iraq at the time. I, along with the 15 other Soldiers, spent about 3-weeks in Kuwait getting the tanks moved to Cp Arifjan and cleaned then turned-in and we were able to talk about things concerning what we had witnessed and done during the previous 7 months, and were able to return to a more normal mind-set than had we immediately boarded a plane for the US. It helped me, I believe, in that when I returned home I did not experience any of the anxieties over "missing my weapon" and was able to slide into a nearly normal family routine. By establishing a base, perhaps in Germany, where units redeploying can stop-over for a month or so to get the decompression process started, it in my opinion, would do wonders for the individual servicemembers, the units as a would and the families back home when the units hit their home station.

Response by Maj Chris Nelson made Sep 5 at 2014 4:36 PM

2014-09-05T16:36:44-04:00

So, I marked yes...but kind of mean NO also.... I do not fully agree with the Army way of doing it (based on what I have heard on the Block Leave). I came directly home from Iraq and Afghanistan...and Desert Storm for that matter.... For both Iraq and Afghanistan, went strait to family. From Iraq, my wife told me later that it took me about 1 year to fully "unwind". Afghanistan, which was much more dangerous for me due to location and activities, was much less transition.... The Air Force has 2 weeks of free "repatreation" time, and then I followed it with 2 more weeks of personal leave.

I have heard of a study that was done, do not know ALL the specifics, but it involved the UAV operators out of NV.... They would go to work (in NV), fly their UAV in Iraq or Afghanistan...doing observation, fire missions, killing bad guys, then at the end of their shift, they would jump in the truck and drive home in 20-45 minutes depending on where they lived.... They did not have enough time to transition from the reality of combat to the reality of home in that short drive home....LOTS of mental health issues....but I never heard specific numbers....just a significant trend. GOT to have some type of decompression time.

Response by PO2 Steven Erickson made Jan 27 at 2015 4:24 PM

2015-01-27T16:24:50-05:00

Never been there, but it CAN NOT be a bad thing to "take a knee" to decompress and process what the men/women have been through.

I have no idea what would be necessary or effective.

Response by SPC David S. made Jan 27 at 2015 4:25 PM

2015-01-27T16:25:07-05:00

SSgt Tim Meuret are you guys around the Chicago area. I'd really like to help out if needed with your efforts.

Response by SSG Jim Foreman made Jan 27 at 2015 5:39 PM

2015-01-27T17:39:16-05:00

Yes, at the rate of veterans suicide something needs to be done. Although the Army has programs in place there needs to be follow-up when the troop leaves the military. It is evident the VA has not filled the gap and I’m not sure if they can. There needs to be some type of counseling centers for war fighters run by war fighters

Response by SFC Boots Attaway made Jan 27 at 2015 7:20 PM

2015-01-27T19:20:16-05:00

Decompression time to unwind with NO formations except for roll call. Counseling, video games and other recreational activities. Screen for those who may have PTSD.

Response by CPT Jack Durish made Jan 27 at 2015 7:53 PM

2015-01-27T19:53:15-05:00

"Should we have decompression time after combat service?" That's a tough one to answer. On the face of it, it seems simple to say "yes". However, I wonder how many would resent what they might perceive as an artificial delay keeping them from getting back to "the real world" and their loved ones? (Everybody referred to it as the real world during the Vietnam War. Is that term still used?)

It would be hard to disguise any delay for decompression as anything other than artificial. Keep in mind that the delays experienced by those returning from WWII were accepted because they reflected the transportation problems of moving thousands of men home from a war that ended relatively suddenly. Vietnam, on the other hand, saw soldiers returning in relative dribbles on a daily basis, riding in jet transports. Inasmuch as few were needed for other assignments and most were within months of the ends of their enlistments, they were released from active duty and thrown back into the civilian world.

A standup comic, Blake Clark, once described the situation in a humorous anecdote. He said that he was pulled out of a fire fight and deposited in the airport in Atlanta Georgia just 28 hours later. He was walking from the jetway to baggage claim when he was overwhelmed by the situation and had to top to reorient himself. As he was standing there, a "peacenik" got in his face and screamed "Murder!" at him. So, Blake said, "I murdered him." (You had to be there to appreciate the drollness of his delivery.)

Yes, we can laugh at it now, but it's a serious problem. It may account for many of the suicides that are occurring. I wish I had some insight that would help.

Our VFW post recently added a message to veterans directing them to a crisis hot line.

http://www.vfw6024.org

What else can we do? I guess I'll have to check into the Team Veteran Foundation and see what else. Thanks for the reference...

VFW 6024 Home

Landing page for vfw6204.org

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 28 at 2015 3:04 AM

2015-01-28T03:04:21-05:00

Excellent question! I definitely think it would be beneficial.

Response by SGT James Hastings made Jan 28 at 2015 8:22 AM

2015-01-28T08:22:58-05:00

Unfortunately for me I was discharged overseas and went to work the next day as a DAC for the Army. I survived my suicide attempt. I never realized how much 'baggage' I was carrying around.

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 1 at 2015 4:21 PM

2015-03-01T16:21:01-05:00

Your military team becomes your family while you train, eat, sleep, and work together for months at a time. To suddenly let go and possibly never see them again the minute you are out of harm's way can cause stress that your biological family cannot understand. In fact they may resent it.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 1 at 2015 7:47 PM

2015-03-01T19:47:28-05:00

First, the combat side. Yes, we need a decompression time for combat troops. I don't think people want to be away from their families....so perhaps giving a vacation or something for the troops? They can travel via Space A with high priority for minimal added costs. SOMETHING for them to help provide offsets for families that cannot afford to be without work for a time.

I also think that the Reserves could do a better job of reintegration on stateside mobilizations. My first tour, I came home (individual mob), and thought "Ahh hell, I got this. Nobody shot at me. It's gonna be EASY." Came home, returned to drill like nothing happened. No access to resources, no "Do you have any questions?" Nada. My wife nearly left me because I was admittedly somewhat of an ass. It was "my way or the highway" as I worked with some very strong-willed civilians that attempted to end-run the military to advance their own desires/careers. Likewise, my wife had developed her own routine. Although I didn't have to deal with the symptoms of PTSD, someone providing a "What to expect" would have been helpful. Additionally, I don't feel I am entitled to some sort of "all expenses paid vacation for myself and my family....save that for those needing decompression from a combat zone.

There are so many things that we could do to improve the transition for our combat troops. They are making the effort, but I think there are still many struggles that could be helped by better integration into community.
v/r,
CPT Butler

Response by CPO Raymond Stratton made Mar 12 at 2015 3:14 PM

2015-03-12T15:14:59-04:00

The sheer numbers speak for themselves as to the issues and the need for decompression of returning veterans, especially those in a combat or in a stressful environment. I served on the flightdeck of aircraft carriers as a flightdeck coordinator. I know of several times of long periods at sea that decompression would have been helpful and the navy a it's own form of decompression -called port calls to allow relief of built up stress. The human mind is very powerful especially the subconscious and we need coping mechanisms. This is where i believe decompression comes in... I have seen first hand how valuable a retreat was to the healing of veterans dealing with PTSD and keeping it bottled up for years. May be for all but those who fought for this country deserve the extra attention if needed. V/R ATC(AW) RJ Stratton, USN (1976-2000)

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 10 at 2017 1:18 PM

2017-01-10T13:18:37-05:00

My decompression time back from Iraq in 2005 was 203 days in Kuwait and then flying back to Boise Idaho to out-process which was done in within 3 days. I did not know what they did not understand because I broke my ankle and I wasn't mad again 3 months to decompress with a broken ankle. I do know that I heard about soldiers Ace Combat and lost a buddy you were given two or three days of leave in the rear in theater and then bring them out to the front to mitigate PTSD. Did this happen to you?

Response by SSgt Christopher Britt made Jan 10 at 2017 7:05 PM

2017-01-10T19:05:01-05:00

In late 1990, I was deployed to Desert Storm. Stationed at Ramstein. Being Air Force, there wasn't a whole unit going. Just myself and another troop from Rhein Main. (He didn't survive) Upon returning I was on a C5 with about 50 other troops returning home. Got off the plane and half of them were greeted with friends and family. I didn't get the greeting. I picked up my bags and went home. Two days later, I'm back to work. To this day, that bugs me.

Response by LTC Jason Mackay made Jan 10 at 2017 8:34 PM

2017-01-10T20:34:15-05:00

Our Canadian Allies all rotate to Cypress from Afghanistan for a week or two weeks. They hang out on the beach. Sleep. drink beer. And unwind as a unit. I think we could learn something there....and I hate the beach.

I am sure we could find a way to screw this up with CQ and Staff Duty in some puritanical hell hole with no booze....but lots of briefings