PT tests and cheating. Is this the work of the new kinder military or RDCs trying to make quotas?

2014-11-15T19:58:58-05:00

According to NavyTimes, there is a PT cheating scandal going on at Great Lakes, IL. When I went through basic the RDCs did not help us cheat on the PFA. Is this the work of the new kinder military or RDCs trying to make quotas?

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 15 at 2014 8:02 PM

2014-11-15T20:02:24-05:00

I wonder how some Soldiers go through basic and AIT (Army) and come to the unit and cannot pass height and weight or pass a PT test. I always suspected that they do not care about some going to the Reserves as soon as they graduate they become the unit's responsibility. We have no real contact with the basic and AIT unlike active component. So this does not surprise me as I, unfortunately, figured it happened as there is no logical explanation otherwise.

Response by PO2 Alex Latuhihin made Feb 5 at 2015 7:03 AM

2015-02-05T07:03:30-05:00

Could be both

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 5 at 2015 7:16 AM

2015-02-05T07:16:05-05:00

As an AIT Instructor at Fort Eustis in Virginia, I have seen Soldier get passed on a PT Test because the AIT Platoon Sergeants not want to have to deal with them anymore because they were a pain in the butt, smartass, etc. Some of the AIT Instructors would administer the APFT and a Soldier would fail and miraculously pass a "retest" given by the AIT PSG a week later. Some were kind of hard to believe considering how bad some failed. Some were close so we didn't question, but other were causing us to scratch our heads.

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 5 at 2015 9:20 AM

2015-02-05T09:20:11-05:00

About 5 years ago I took the APFT while I was sick. NCO asked if I wanted to come back the following week, but I figured I might as well do it while I was there. Can't prove it, but I think the NCO did me a favor because no way that was a 15:30 2-mile. I definitely was within passing time, but I think he helped me out a bit. I have no bad feelings about saying I appreciate the hook up.

Response by TSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 11 at 2016 1:35 PM

2016-12-11T13:35:30-05:00

So there are many reasons, but I think one large thing, bigger picture wise, we need to consider is that not many PFA's pay attention to actual science. I failed a PT test in 2013. It was on posture. Now yes, I am Air Force, but I have taken part in Army rucks and Marine combatives (my tech school and first duty assignment plus deployment were all mixed service) and did well. Oh sure, the rucks kicked my ass and more than a few times I walked away from combatives a pint short of blood maybe, but the point is I was combat able and physically fit. Excuse? Nope, the test is a test and if I fail, I must be held accountable and disciplined in accordance with applicable policy. But let's face it; they're not good ways to gauge fitness. Do I have another way to do it? No, I'm not a physician, I won't pretend to know solutions, but I can see a problem. Now, hearsay at best, I have been told by FAC personnel that it's mainly there for insurance reasons, not fitness reasons. Fail a PT test, TRICARE has an excuse not to take care of you after you get out. Actually a very good business model, since if you don't test actual fitness, but other factors such as posture and arbitrarily timed numbers, you can stand to keep your margins nice and wide.
What I want is a private board convened with exceptionally qualified civilian physicians from all over the world to determine what fitness actually is, without letting them know the U.S. military are the ones who will be handling the results. Then, port those results over to a panel of combat veterans from as many wars as possible to give their opinions on how these results should be incorporated into a test or real-world assessment. Then we set our policy.
Will it work? No idea. But hey, at least I'm trying.