Off the books service; Have you heard of this?

SSgt Tim Meuret — Thu, 16 Oct 2014 19:54:38 -0400

I am out meeting a lot of veterans right now for Medicare. I ran into a guy who said he served in the Army during Vietnam but was assigned to the CIA. He says he went to the Albuquerque VARO and presented his DD-214 and they came back and said he never served and they did not return his DD-214. He says he mistakenly gave them his original. Am I being BS'd or is this yet another example of FUBAR?

Response by CW5 Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 16 at 2014 8:00 PM

CW5 Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 16 Oct 2014 20:00:55 -0400

SSgt Tim Meuret, I can believe it, because I know people who worked with other agencies in Vietnam. And I know there are (or were) other programs in existence that would not necessarily reflect military service.

On the other hand, the guy could be BS'ing you. Anything's possible.

Response by SGT Steven Montgomery made Oct 16 at 2014 8:06 PM

SGT Steven Montgomery — Thu, 16 Oct 2014 20:06:27 -0400

You can get a replacement pretty easily SSgt Meuret.

Response by MAJ Robert (Bob) Petrarca made Oct 16 at 2014 8:08 PM

MAJ Robert (Bob) Petrarca — Thu, 16 Oct 2014 20:08:05 -0400

Normally they would do the opposite and say Joe Bagadonuts served in he military to avoid any association with the 3-letter alphabet soup organizations. If he did serve as you depict he would have a valid DD-214 for his service in the Army with no reference to the CIA. Don't think anyone would take his DD-214 from him, unless they confiscated it because it was fake. Hmmm...

Response by PO1 Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 16 at 2014 8:27 PM

PO1 Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 16 Oct 2014 20:27:05 -0400

SSgt Tim Meuret I'm gonna toss out the Bull$hit flag. Not gonna buy it. As MAJ Robert (Bob) Petrarca said the alphabet units will do anything to avoid being listed. Never met anyone that actually signed up in the military and couldn't get a DD-214, though I assume it's theoretically possible but not probable. If the individual really wants his DD-214 it's possible to get it with very rare exceptions due to the records fire. Even then there are ways to get enough information to verify military service.

Response by SSG Maurice P. made Oct 16 at 2014 11:40 PM

SSG Maurice P. — Thu, 16 Oct 2014 23:40:17 -0400

SHIT there was a guy at the prison i worked at in texas he was a correctional officer like me
told me he was a army green beret and that his dd-214 was blackened out i told him to get the fuck away from me i had never heard of shit like that ..................but then again i was never in a super warrior group in the military anything is possible it being probable is another story hehehehehehe

Response by SPC David S. made Oct 17 at 2014 12:47 AM

SPC David S. — Fri, 17 Oct 2014 00:47:19 -0400

As he can request another one it sounds like bunkum and balderdash

http://www.archives.gov/veterans/military-service-records/

Start Your Military Service Record (DD Form 214) Request

How to Request Military Service Records, Military Personnel Files, Veterans Records, Discharge Papers, Separation Documents, DD214, or Prove Military Service

Response by SGT Suraj Dave made Oct 17 at 2014 1:06 AM

SGT Suraj Dave — Fri, 17 Oct 2014 01:06:13 -0400

Before you even read what else I have to say, if you know his name you can request his info through freedom of information act. If there is nothing there, he never served.

Yeah.. only copy? Seriously? I was given an original and 3 copies on my ETS date. Everyone in my family had an electronic/scanned copy of my dd-214. I also have it on USB in my wallet, and one in the back of my car.

Seriously, I don't think anyone who is dumb enough to hand out their last DD-214 was able to get into the U.S. Army since the civil war. I know back then you just needed your 2 front teeth to rip packets of gunpowder, and the ability to count up to 5 to shoot in formation... but nowdays we have an actual test... no one of that low intelligence gets in....

He is a story teller, he is making up fairy tales. If he doesn't have a DD-214 he would have tons and tons of other paperwork... from training cert's down to some awards of SGLI paperwork or something....

Response by Lt Col Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 17 at 2014 1:43 AM

Lt Col Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 17 Oct 2014 01:43:54 -0400

SSgt Tim Meuret I am going to call the bullshit flag on this. If you really want to know you could do a FOIA request for his official record. There is webiste called Guardians of Valor that get records from people. I think the office is in St Louis MO. That's probably what the VA did because they probably flagged something from what he was claiming that did not match.

My understanding is that there is no such thing as an exclusive secret squirrel military record that devows your entire service. By now it would most likely have been de-classed by now anyway. They would have some record of his service. he most likely would not have worked directly for an agency as a person. He would have belonged to some military unit of record had some comment on a deployment to Vietnam. Those are official duty things that have a record. Obviously specific dealings with customers and operations won't be on a record. But there will be a record if he did in fact deploy at least.

Not only that, it seems that "my records are classified" are the number 1 excuses people give when faking military service, such as being a SEAL or some other "Snake Eater" type.

Being a patient at that said VA facility here in the 505, they have enough people to treat to not have any fakers de-frauding the system. He is lucky he is not being charged for attempted fraud.

Greetings From the "Bourque!"

Response by SSG Maurice P. made Oct 17 at 2014 11:56 AM

SSG Maurice P. — Fri, 17 Oct 2014 11:56:48 -0400

SSGT MEURET when a retired soldier reaches 65 and he goes to ft polk or any active duty base do they take my blue retired i.d from me and give me something else???

Response by SPC David S. made Oct 17 at 2014 4:50 PM

SPC David S. — Fri, 17 Oct 2014 16:50:30 -0400

There's nothing left from the Vietnam War that is still classified. The blackest of black operations were declassified years ago and even the CIA run stuff like SOG is open for anyone to see.

Response by LCDR Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 17 at 2014 5:40 PM

LCDR Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 17 Oct 2014 17:40:18 -0400

I'm going to say doubtful, but not impossible. There was some crossover between the agencies back then (loaner personnel, etc) so it's possible that he was in the Army, given to the CIA. It's also possible that the military's world-renowned record system failed this person, and the personnel clerk had no idea what he/she was looking at.

I'd say take with a grain of salt, but don't dismiss out-of-hand.

Response by SGT Richard H. made Oct 18 at 2014 3:06 PM

SGT Richard H. — Sat, 18 Oct 2014 15:06:26 -0400

The most likely place to hear of this would be in the movies, in a bar, or possibly on a stolen valor website.

Response by MSgt Dennis Dudley made Oct 18 at 2014 4:22 PM

MSgt Dennis Dudley — Sat, 18 Oct 2014 16:22:59 -0400

Sounds like he is blowing smoke up your tail end and telling you that you have hemroids (sp). Take a look at a site "This Ain't Hell" for a great collection of Valor thieves. This guy fits the mold.

Response by SGT Gabriel G. made Oct 23 at 2014 2:32 PM

SGT Gabriel G. — Thu, 23 Oct 2014 14:32:10 -0400

This is how I feel when I hear people say stupid shit like that.