Need some time on the range? Police Fire 84 Shots At Man And Miss 83 Times. How can that be?

CSM Michael J. Uhlig — Sun, 06 Sep 2015 21:15:58 -0400

Situation is it is after sunset.....cars along the sides of the street.....suspect seeking cover.....he is firing at the Law Enforcement Officers.....what could have been done differently? Is there cause for alarm? Do our Law Enforcement Officers need more time on the range? Are these guys operating with expired qualifications? I can already imagine the jokes and memes heading their way! Share your best!

http://uk.complex.com/pop-culture/2015/09/nypd-officers-fire-84-shots-at-suspect-miss-83-times

Police Fire 84 Shots At Man And Miss 83 Times

The NYPD needs to start training their officers better.

Response by Sgt Kelli Mays made Sep 6 at 2015 9:19 PM

Sgt Kelli Mays — Sun, 06 Sep 2015 21:19:51 -0400

Oh my gosh...don't know why but this really cracked me up.

Response by SGM Steve Wettstein made Sep 6 at 2015 9:20 PM

SGM Steve Wettstein — Sun, 06 Sep 2015 21:20:37 -0400

You can never have enough trigger time. With that said, everyone needs more time on the range but range time still doesn't prepare you for when someone is shooting back.

Response by SPC(P) Jay Heenan made Sep 6 at 2015 9:41 PM

SPC(P) Jay Heenan — Sun, 06 Sep 2015 21:41:58 -0400

How in the actual f@ck can ANYONE fire 84 shots and miss 83 times? They should all be put on a desk until they get right! That is 83 chances of something REALLY bad happening to some innocent bystander...SMH!

Response by SSG Leo Bell made Sep 6 at 2015 9:49 PM

SSG Leo Bell — Sun, 06 Sep 2015 21:49:42 -0400

Did the officer not have on his glasses? Was he hiding and just shooting blindly? Was his sights off? Or is it he just can't shoot?

Response by CSM Carl Cunningham made Sep 6 at 2015 10:05 PM

CSM Carl Cunningham — Sun, 06 Sep 2015 22:05:14 -0400

I really do not know where to start with this one. I am sure the 84 shots comes from a multitude of officers, I am thinking six by the video. It isn't the movies so shooting someone with a pistol from a long distance is not as easy as you would think. They just needed to close in on him faster.

Response by SSgt Alex Robinson made Sep 6 at 2015 10:35 PM

SSgt Alex Robinson — Sun, 06 Sep 2015 22:35:29 -0400

CSM Michael J. Uhlig sounds like there needs to be remedial marksmanship training

Response by SSG John Erny made Sep 6 at 2015 10:38 PM

SSG John Erny — Sun, 06 Sep 2015 22:38:19 -0400

I am by no means an expert with a pistol but I do own a few. I have found that the time honored M-1911 more accurate and controllable than some of the "modern" light weight side arms. With a 1911 I can get pretty close to where I want the round every time. With my XD single stack 9MM 3.3” barreled sidearm I find myself missing the mark until I put some rounds through it.
I saw a show on the Military channel and it was 1911 VS. the 9MM Beretta military issue sidearm. Both weapons were used by retired special operations types. They went through the same course but with standard issue magazines for the weapons, 7 rounds for the 1911 and I think it was 15 for the 9MM. The 1911 got far more 1st time hits and did not run out of rounds.
I have known law enforcement officers that flat refused to give up their police issue revolvers for semi-automatic pistols because they felt the revolver to be more accurate than the semi-automatic. This has been a few years back mind you.
I have seen hunters take single shot, double barrel, pump and semi-auto shotguns bird hunting. It seems to me that the guys with the semi-autos tend to shoot a lot, miss a lot, scare off the game, and make a lot of noise. Folks with the slower shooting weapons take their time and make each shot count.
So what is my point behind this? Just because you have the rounds to expend does not mean that you need to. For those of us old enough to remember the M-16 with the full auto switch know why it was removed and replaced with the three round burst. Most people cannot fire rapidly and maintain a consistent group. Add the stress of a fire fight and a surge of adrenaline in your blood which raises your heart rate and respiration and the problem compounds itself. Someone is going to say it is “suppression fire” so I will beat them to it. So we want to have peace officers using suppression fie in our communities, I for one do not.

Response by CSM Charles Hayden made Sep 6 at 2015 10:47 PM

CSM Charles Hayden — Sun, 06 Sep 2015 22:47:31 -0400

SGM Michael J. Ulhig; That sitrep causes me to appreciate living in a metropolitan area where funding is made available for police training. Training to a widely accepted and approved standard is very expensive. Funding for 'carefully selected' and trained citizens to enforce laws of the land is also scarce.

Response by MSG Brad Sand made Sep 7 at 2015 12:47 AM

MSG Brad Sand — Mon, 07 Sep 2015 00:47:05 -0400

I think they actually under the number of rounds fired for each person hit on the modern battlefield? I think that it is easy to judge without being there. There are a lot of reasons you can fire a weapon without intending to take a life or even hit a suspect?

Response by MSgt Michelle Mondia made Sep 7 at 2015 1:02 AM

MSgt Michelle Mondia — Mon, 07 Sep 2015 01:02:41 -0400

Response by PFC Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 7 at 2015 1:43 AM

PFC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 07 Sep 2015 01:43:58 -0400

Why? You only have to look as far as Rallypoint and any discussion that involves shooting. The exchange of false information is enough to nauseate anyone who has shot more than 1,000 rounds in a career...and let's be honest, there are plenty of Rallypoint regulars who are quick to argue a shooting technique with someone who shoots more in a year than they did in a career. Bad marksmanship and bad techniques prevail due to a lack of understanding. That once or twice a year qualification range does not make an expert marksman. Hell, people freaked out that the Department of Homeland Security bought several hundred thousand rounds...

Response by PO1 William "Chip" Nagel made Sep 7 at 2015 1:51 AM

PO1 William "Chip" Nagel — Mon, 07 Sep 2015 01:51:58 -0400

Damn. I think these folks need a little more Practice!

Response by Cpl Chris Cargile made Sep 7 at 2015 1:59 AM

Cpl Chris Cargile — Mon, 07 Sep 2015 01:59:01 -0400

I was a cop for 5 1/2 years and completed a lot of optional firearms training, including FBI Firearms Instructor certification. My dad was ex-military and cop, and I grew up around guns. All that being said, not all cops are "gun guys", many of them only shoot during their 2 range visits a year. Marksmanship is a perishable skill under the best of circumstances, and I can assure you that a stressful police encounter is far from range conditions. And, it sounds like the perp had decent tactics. Shit happens.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 8 at 2015 1:24 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 08 Sep 2015 01:24:27 -0400

God gave life, God take life! HE was in control that day. I believe in miracles

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 8 at 2015 1:30 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 08 Sep 2015 01:30:54 -0400

People are human. Mistakes will be made. Oh well... Did she even pay for the food? I wanna know how the rest of the evening went for "Miss Perfect."