In your opinion, what would be the best way to end the War in Afghanistan and be able to call it success all around?

2017-08-03T01:05:10-04:00

In answering this, please be realistic, have a well thought out and feasible set of options and know this is a serious question looking for serious answers.

Response by SPC Kevin Ford made Aug 3 at 2017 1:09 AM

2017-08-03T01:09:18-04:00

Just say we won and leave. I'm only half joking.

Response by PFC Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 3 at 2017 1:10 AM

2017-08-03T01:10:22-04:00

Well a plan to end the war I don't have but plan to put the management of the war in the hands of local government is feesable.

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 3 at 2017 1:11 AM

2017-08-03T01:11:18-04:00

Complicated. China(Growing power in the North). Iran (Enemy)to the West and Pakistan a Nuclear Frenemy and backstabber and supplier of Taliban and allies of Taliban destabilizing the region to the East.

England granted them independence in 1913. If we leave, China, Iran and Pakistan will keep meddling.
China now has troops to the North. The Tribal Areas of Pakistan support the insurgency in Eastern Afghanistan. Iran, though Shia, can still influence the Haraz and other Shia minorities in Afghanistan.

The exit strategy is complicated. If we leave, the corrupt central government will lose to the insurgency
and Shadow Government already there and dominating most of the countryside. What a dilemma!

Response by Maj John Bell made Aug 3 at 2017 2:12 AM

2017-08-03T02:12:12-04:00

There is no correct answer.

Problem #1 Do most Afghani's consider themselves Afghani's, or are their primary political loyalties regional, tribal, or clan?

Never should have gone to stay. It should have been locate, isolate, destroy, and depart. Repeat as often as necessary.

Response by CWO3 Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 3 at 2017 4:59 AM

2017-08-03T04:59:19-04:00

Go back a thousand years and start over? It's like the rest that have been going on that long. The opium issue is larger than most admit because of global demand. You can't go into a country that is still living in the past and take away one of their mainstay livelihoods without giving them viable alternatives - that they want. And they don't want them. The religious issues are a factor as well. A larger question is are we the ones that should be doing it? Is anyone? We're now hearing of the interest in their natural resources such as minerals, but does another country have the right to basically seize assets just because they want or feel the need to? Anybody that envisions wholesale brick and mortar capitalism for them is dreaming. For the most part they are happy with things as they are and will resist relentlessly any colonization. We can take out the Taliban and suppress the more radical factions in the east, but that is only a temporary measure because they will come back. You can't win hearts and minds that are mostly content with the current state of affairs. No suburbs in the sticks for them. No assembly plants. No strip malls or service sector. All we are doing now is trying to bomb them off a few huts at a time, so at a certain point you have to ask yourself why you're even doing it to begin with. What is the mission anyway? To expend ammo and kill bad guys it would seem, and that's an open-ended strategy without a finish line. Not every country wants to be like us, and especially when they see how our experiment is working out ethically, financially and otherwise. Best way to end it would have been to never have started it and learning a lesson from those that have failed in the past. For now, either go all in or all out, because what we have done and are doing is just a drain on our blood and treasure without any clear "mission accomplished". It's an equation with at least one too many variables and therefore is unlikely to be solved. History should have shown us this.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 3 at 2017 6:51 AM

2017-08-03T06:51:01-04:00

go back in time. Set small realistic goals and don't hold land.

Response by Cpl Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 3 at 2017 6:54 AM

2017-08-03T06:54:17-04:00

To be blunt, I don't think there's a chance that we can "end the war in Afghanistan" anytime soon. The current state of things in the middle east are a pot that's boiling, and it's been boiling for quite sometime.

My personal belief in this, is that one day, within a far but foreseeable future, we'll be able to pull out all of our troops and leave. But that wont be until long after the constant threats have vanished and we are able to leave without the chance of a catastrophic event blowing up in our faces.

Response by PO3 Donald Murphy made Aug 3 at 2017 9:23 AM

2017-08-03T09:23:53-04:00

The only way to do it would be the way we ended the wars in Germany and Japan. Brute/overwhelming firepower, and a crushing of the local spirit and economy. That included several things:

1. Overwhelming destruction of the enemy forces and the force's ability to wage war. Although not every single German/Japanese plane was destroyed, the supporting infrastructure was attacked. So even though an axis pilot was safe in his hut/bed, his plane's ability to fly daily missions was impacted. Japan? If it sailed, it was sunk.

2. Upon surrender/destruction of the enemy, the infrastructure was rebuilt to a Western (Europe)/American (PTO) standard. This was another component of force. "Marshall plan?" Um..."Marshall" was a general, right? It was a military operation. "Hey instead of being European and doing this every ten years, lets make it so that no one does this again." Hence, a forcing of peaceful culture onto the defeated enemy and their populations. This also included "de-nazification" and making the emperor "common." The destruction filtered down to even the youngest child.

3. As the holder of the big toys (atom bomb, huge-ass navy, etc), "suggest" to the local area that it all band together in a brotherly-love kind of way to nurture the defeated enemy back into being a good guy and living peacefully. Getting Japan and Germany back into a trade environment was key. Within years Germany was "earning" enough money to thrive, pay restitutions and be a constructive member of society. Most of Japan's industry was re-geared for peaceful means.

So where are we today? Its not 1945; its 2017.

1. While many may argue that the USA and its allied efforts have overwhelming superiority in weapons and tactics, we really don't. "Weapons" doesn't equal "tactics." Our enemy is not an unknown quantity. We have battle reports going back to the 1700's. Have we read them? Debatable. Rather than engage in sweeping formation battle, divide the area into towns. Form a border around the town and kill everything Taliban/ISIS within that town. Driven from the town, they hit surrounding area troops and are never truly able to escape. Once they are sufficiently killed, secure the town, so that the town cannot be re-taken. Make each town a veritable fire-base. Don't worry about cities as such as we're gonna tear them down and rebuild them...

2. Once the Taliban/ISIS/etc are driven from an area, the area is never truly "cleaned." The Taliban/ISIS/etc are neither vilified or crushed. They are merely "gone." Gone as in "away for a while/soon to return" or gone as in "never to come back again?" We never truly know. Because we choose not to know. Using the Germany/Japan lesson, tear down all mosques, daily prayer, burka's, etc. Rebuild them as American citizens. Re-write their government. Re-do their economy. Put them on the dollar. Jail/publicly execute any/all showing any allegiance/support for the defeated forces. American jeans and t-shirts for everyone. "I Love Lucy" piped through the networks. Free internet and cell phones and tons-o-commercials. A visit by the pope throws the nation into Catholicism. Weeee! Revlon/Garnier supplies hair color. Money is given to girls to "go blonde." In six years you have no muslims. Violently (with a capital V) enforce/protect liberated areas in division strength. Fire bases on the outside. No one inside the liberated area is able to see or communicate with those outside the area. Kabul goes away. Can't clean it, so eliminate it. While re-educating everyone, teachers tell of an "ancient city of Afghanistanica which is the true ancient capital of Afghanistan." This city is naturally printed in all school books and is built in record time to be populated by the first new Afghani's. Your rail and air hubs will start from here.

3. Allies are encouraged to flood the nation with tourism and money. Foreign businesses all rise up, hiring locals at decent wages. Put in solar and natural gas to give people an x percent increase in quality of living. Basically, moving A'stan from the 1600's into the 1990's. Hospitals on every street. Tons of nurses and female doctors to de-sexify the populace and tons of female teachers as well. A male teacher will be injected into the system every so many months so that people understand that not all male teachers are priests. The pope's visit will quickly restructure the nation's religion. Like Germany and Japan, no vestige of pre-war culture will exist. There will be no identity for the young Afghani. He/she will look Western and speak Western. There will be "werewolves" amongst the folk that tell tales of Afghanistan "before the enemy came" but they will be hunted down and eliminated with South American dictator zeal. Within ten years, Afghanistan's beaches and mountain resorts will be the jewel of the Middle East.

Of course, that makes too much sense.

Response by CW3 Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 3 at 2017 9:52 AM

2017-08-03T09:52:47-04:00

The British screwed the pooch when they drew the Durand line. It went right down the middle of Pashtun tribal areas. They should have either moved it to the east, and let *all* Pashtuns be in Afghanistan, or moved it to the west, and let *all* Pashtuns be in Pakistan. Plus, the northern area tribes are Turkmen, Uzbeki, or Tajik. Those areas should have been given back to the respective nations.

Response by 1stSgt Nelson Kerr made Aug 3 at 2017 10:01 AM

2017-08-03T10:01:24-04:00

Leave then lie that we won.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 3 at 2017 10:35 AM

2017-08-03T10:35:02-04:00

This can never happen until ALL Afghani people band together and rise as one to take out the bad guys. The problem with this, is that most (if not all) don't care what happens outside their village as long as the issues of the world don't come knocking on their door.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 3 at 2017 10:43 AM

2017-08-03T10:43:41-04:00

If you want to win, you're going to need to starve the beast.
Afghanistan's militant groups (and leaders... but that is a whole other issue) derive their money and resources almost entirely from narcotics trafficking and graft from international construction/ aid programs. A very distant third is shaking down the locals post-harvest for protection money.
The first two of those are eminently deniable if we set our minds to it. Simply stop or tightly control a curtailed international aid program, and through various means keep the (primarily) opium crop from getting to markets.
Having accomplished this, the ability of AQ or others to project power and execute regional or international terror acts would be diminished to the point of insignificance.
On the off chance someone from there gets fiesty and attempts another 9/11, getting combat power to the point of origin should not be difficult.

I fear that Afghanistan has become its own self-licking ice cream cone that perpetuates itself forever. To combat this and truly have an end game, we must change the paradigm of how we operate there.

Response by SSG Steven Mangus made Aug 3 at 2017 11:49 AM

2017-08-03T11:49:46-04:00

500 megatons or so. A mushroom cloud outside a window will give pause for silent reflection..war over..

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 3 at 2017 11:51 AM

2017-08-03T11:51:33-04:00

Well let's see. The Russians tried (And failed). We are now stuck in the quagmire with no feasible end in sight unless a total pull out (Vietnam). History repeats itself and some are too damn stupid to learn from previous mistakes.....

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 3 at 2017 12:23 PM

2017-08-03T12:23:13-04:00

send couple divisions in, remove Taliban, secure boarders and strengthen ANA, ANP and ABP. Then educate the public and call it quits.

Response by SFC Kelly Fuerhoff made Aug 3 at 2017 12:29 PM

2017-08-03T12:29:20-04:00

We went there to get bin Laden - he ended up in Pakistan. We got him. Mission success. Get the hell out of Afghanistan. There is no other success there. We can't change cultures overnight and if the people there don't want to change it on their own that's their fight. Not ours.

Response by LTJG Edward Bangor Jr made Aug 3 at 2017 12:33 PM

2017-08-03T12:33:15-04:00

There's no recipe for overall success in Afghanistan. If we simply pull out completely, someone like ISIS will take over and we are back to square one. Stay and we will continue to fight the small engagements we've been dealing with until the sun burns out.

Response by SSG Robert Perrotto made Aug 3 at 2017 12:56 PM

2017-08-03T12:56:36-04:00

there is no correct answer to this - The US has got to stop being in the nation building business - All our problems with the middle east began when we supported the Shah of Iran - since then it has been financing, arming, and supporting insurgencies against the influence of Russia, China and other anti american regimes only to discover that the insurgents we supported turn out to be our enemies as well. What is going on in Afghanistan is a direct result of the US arming, training, paying the taliban in their struggle against Russia 20 years earlier. We create our own enemies in the region.

Take the current crisis in Syria - why was it any of our business to get involved in what is a civil war? The US is partly to blame for the creation of ISIS - none of you may want to hear it, but the truth is, we began our involvement in Syria by funding and arming these insurgents - We have got to let them kill each other, let them sort out their problems - and make sure their problems do not come to US soil. Instead we got ISIS and a proxy war with Russia.

The only way Assad is going to be deposed is if a foreign power commits troops to depose him, Russia has made it entirely clear that they would oppose that with military force of their own should that occur. What is happening in Syria is another conflict we cannot win unless we have the will to start a war with another nuclear powered country with a military nearly on par with our own. No one wins in that scenario. So we continue to waste resources, money, and political capital on something we cannot win.

Response by SGT Tony Clifford made Aug 3 at 2017 1:18 PM

2017-08-03T13:18:43-04:00

A truly difficult question. Do we leave and allow Iraq's downfall to be repeated in Afghanistan? Do we find out the cultural boarders in Afghanistan and empower each region to be their own country? Do we just stay?

These are things to be considered. Obviously staying isn't a real option as the second we do leave anarchy will happen and the strongest warlord will come to power. Like many other middle eastern countries Afghanistan has no real national identity, but rather is very tribalistic. With this in mind maybe we find out if the different regions would be able to maintain order if they were independent republics. Maybe a system similar to the Holy Roman Empire, where each region is its own country and they were confederated together to deal with foreign threats.

Response by SFC Timothy N. Livengood made Aug 3 at 2017 2:44 PM

2017-08-03T14:44:26-04:00

It must be taken into consideration that this portion of the world has been fighting since the beginning of time...okay perhaps that is an exaggeration. I would however say it has been going on for a long time. I don't know that there is a solution. We have been successful in freeing those that needed to be, capturing terrorists and so much more. What is the measure of what we determine to be successful. I see it as being in the eye of the beholder. I say we could easily bring home our soldiers and focus on making our military the strongest and most powerful on the face of this earth. Train our soldiers, educate our soldiers and keep making our fighting force as amazing as they are.

Response by SPC Charles Isaac made Aug 3 at 2017 2:49 PM

2017-08-03T14:49:37-04:00

Set a nice achievable short term goal. Declare victory and depart

Response by CW3 Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 3 at 2017 3:19 PM

2017-08-03T15:19:08-04:00

We can't call it a win or a success because we aren't at war with the Afghans. Afghans are at war with Afghans. Only they can "win." Time to leave and let the Afghanis police themselves.

Response by CN Joseph Gray made Aug 3 at 2017 4:55 PM

2017-08-03T16:55:23-04:00

These moslems are so inbreed with marrying their cousins as muhammad did and have been Warring since 630ADwhen muhammad hijacked islam and wrote the quran. Now ALL moslem are born to Die preferably as a martyr, So the War will end with them ONLY when there's not one left!!

So.. the only way to end the War is to drop a couple of MOAB's on them and then do like that General did in one of the Philippians Campaign in the pre WWI Campaign he captured 50 insurgents and shot 49 of them and then kill pigs pouring the blood on the dead moslems in amass grave and he let the one go with the understanding that if he had to come back we will kill more and douse the bodies with pigs blood!! There was peace for over a decade until "the War to end all Wars" started!! We could bomb a city then have a plane fly over the city spray red matter that looks like blood and pamphlets in Arabic saying whatever city they run to whatever land or Nation they run to We Will level the town Insurgents Man, women, and child and cover them in swine's blood until the hostilities end and they can whine all they want to the UN or the World we don't give two shits but if one American dies a Thousand moslems or a city will die and be covered in blood until the other moslems will rise up against you for starting War with Americans!!

Then We need to round up ALL the moslems obama let in uncheck and Deport them!! Any moslems that talks about killing Jews or Americans or infidels will immediately be Deported No Questions asked!! They follow allah and the quran...The quran calls for ALL moslems to deceive the infidel until their numbers are greater then overthrow ANY Non-islamic government and install an islamic State under sharia law!! They are in every political office from alderman of wards to mayors, then State offices from State Senators and House Reps to the Federal Offices and cabinets. They ARE NOT LOYAL TO OUR CONSTITUTION!! The sharia law courts in Dearborn and Troy Michigan and they're setting them up in Minneapolis Minnesota were they already have a anti blasphemy hotline to report anyone who's made them feel unwelcome or has offended them or Islam, allah or muhammad!! A Direct violation of our Constitution!!! The U.S. Senate passed an anti blasphemy Bill S.R. 118. And the House of Representatives are Voting this week, it's already been introduced and is on the floor in an even stiffer anti blasphemy Bill H.Res.257. If America doesn't put a Quick Violent end to this War in such a manner that they will once again Fear American interaction and boot those unfaithful UnAmericans out of political power and deport them We Will be fighting them on American Streets!! You and I know that those young men are not refugees they ARE AN INVADING FORCE and STOP ANYMORE FROM ENTERING!! Then Start Deporting and Take the Military INTO the NO GO Zones in Dearborn and Troy Michigan and Deport those terrorizing the people living there forcing unConstitutional Sharia Law on them as well as Stopping Americans from Peacefully going wherever they want in those Cities and Return Freedom and the Constitution to All of the City!! If We're Not willing to get ruthless with people who still are living in 7th century mentality and live to die by furthering islam, Well Hell you mind as well buy your wife a hijab and your daughter a burka and go get here FGM (they have several clinics in Dearborn) and your son you'll have to either let him convert to Islam and spend eternity in HELL or he will be killed by them or worse sold into Slavery!!!

You can think that I'm crazy but these people have been living the exact same way for over 1,400+ years and ONLY know War, Hatred and Death!! Even in 100% moslem countries they kill each other for not being moslem enough!!!

Response by CPT Tom Monahan made Aug 3 at 2017 7:18 PM

2017-08-03T19:18:17-04:00

We need to realize that you don't start a land war in Afghanistan. We need to hand it over to the locals and say good-bye.

Response by CSM Charles Hayden made Aug 3 at 2017 11:12 PM

2017-08-03T23:12:41-04:00

Queen Victoria could not cope with the natives, Russia could not cope with the natives, America is learning.

Rudyard Kipling said it best:
“OH, East is East, and West is West, and never the twain shall meet,
Till Earth and Sky stand presently at God’s great Judgment Seat;
But there is neither East nor West, Border, nor Breed, nor Birth,
When two strong men stand face to face, tho’ they come from the ends of the earth!”

Response by Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 5 at 2017 11:06 AM

2017-08-05T11:06:27-04:00

It would take 200,000 troops and schoolteachers and about three generations to be able to exit Afghanistan with the country in a stable modern form. Japan, Korea and Germany all took a heck of a long time to rebuild after their respective wars. In Afghanistan you aren't just rebuilding but in many cases building for the first time. The roads need to be modernized, the poppy fields need to be burned, and most importantly the people need to be educated. The taliban rely on ignorance and faith. Take away one of those things and there's going to be half as many of them to kill.

Response by MAJ Ken Landgren made Apr 15 at 2021 1:33 PM

2021-04-15T13:33:27-04:00

I would leave a skeleton HQs for two reasons. One is should shit hit the fan and we decide to go back in there would be a rational plan. The other reason would be to advise the Afghan Government and Military. Let the Afghan Military do all the fighting.