In what ways did your personal values change after you left the military? Specifically, how did your priorities change to reflect values?

2016-11-01T16:02:38-04:00

After I left the military, the values they had given me didn't necessarily align with my personal values. Selfless sacrifice, for example, wasn't quite as important as finding personal meaning and prioritizing my family. What ways have your values changed since you left?

Response by MSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 1 at 2016 4:38 PM

2016-11-01T16:38:20-04:00

The Air Force core values are Integrity First, Service before Self, and Excellence in all we do. Being an aircraft mechanic, you must always have integrity. And doing excellent work prevents mishaps. In my civilian job, I don't really put my civilian job first because we are not at war and we don't provide my brothers on the ground with supplies or close air support:) I put my family first by refusing overtime, night shift or weekends. That has caused me to be passed over for management promotions, but I am happy with my job and pay. Plus, management can be a pain in the arse and I don't need or want the extra stress for a few extra bucks. But I do give 100% to my Guard unit whether it is a weekend drill, TDY or deployment.

Response by Lt Col Jim Coe made Nov 1 at 2016 4:53 PM

2016-11-01T16:53:34-04:00

In the military, I was a rule keeper and rule maker. Being a pilot, you come to believe that your training and the procedures developed over decades of flying are keeping you alive. You work hard to comply with those procedures. If you find yourself in a new experience, you tend to look for the procedures, regulations, and rules that apply hoping they will help ensure your success. As a staff officer I was asked to develop processes, procedures, and rules for the way business was done. So I became a rule maker. I called on my background in flight safety, using lessons learned, to help make rules that I believed would keep service members and organizations from making mistakes that had caused problems and wasted resources in the past. Then I retired and became an employee of a private company.

Private enterprise is very different from the military. The rules aren't as important as the results. Entrepreneurship and salesmanship became much more important. These were two areas where I had little experience. I tried for 16 years to develop these abilities, but I confess I failed. I worked as a project manager, which kept me keeping and making rules and procedures for my projects. I was a successful PM. My progress in private enterprise was limited by my inability to be a good salesman.

Response by Lt Col Scott Shuttleworth made Nov 1 at 2016 4:57 PM

2016-11-01T16:57:05-04:00

I can say that my own personal values never changed. I can say with happy certainty that I never had to compromise my personal beliefs/values and they served me well while in service and guide my life now.
Priorities did change---My family is absolutely my priority now. They were then but not as much as they are now. Once I retired, it hit me like a ton of bricks that they are there for me when no one else is...and time is precious. My father passed two years after I retired and I treasure that small time with him but it put things in focus. My daughter is growing up and headed to college next year and it will be my and the wife alone again...not a bad thing but they are my focus. Working for things is crazy and I give a honest days work for an honest days wage but at the end of the day where I used to stay till the mission completes, now my mission is at home at quitting time. Things are just that things.

Response by SSgt Chuck “Gunz” Gundlach USMC Ret., MBA made Nov 1 at 2016 5:10 PM

2016-11-01T17:10:55-04:00

Over my Military Career I never really thought about my values…you are a Marine, and its all part of you; part of your heart, soul and mindset. Since retiring and becoming part of the civilian sector, I think more about them as I compare myself and other Marines and servicemen/women I know and have known to the people I work with and around. I can see a huge difference between the military side and the civilian side as far as ethics, regardless of how many mandatory classes they get. As well, those in the civilian sector lack a strength in responsibility, especially self-responsibility. They lack integrity, loyalty, self-pride, teamwork, et cetera. I have also seen many, more recent, prior service members, from all branches, but especially those outside the Marine Corps, who have lowered their standards and fit right in with the majority of the civilian population. I would say if I have lost anything, I would have to agree with PO2 William Allen Crowder, in that I have found I can't trust my fellow team members, or count on them as part of the cohesive team I had and could count on while on active duty. Too much individualism, egos and self-righteousness and not enough ethics, integrity, responsibility and selflessness.

Response by Maj John Bell made Nov 1 at 2016 8:05 PM

2016-11-01T20:05:48-04:00

_I have never felt the sense of loyalty to a commercial enterprise that I feel to the Constitution.
_I have never felt the sense of loyalty to a fellow employee who is an ass, that I definitely feel to a fellow Soldier, Sailor, Marine or Airman who may be just as big an ass.
_I have never asked my family to sacrifice for the benefit of an employer. I accepted nothing less from them to Corps and Country.

But outside of those parameters I do my best for all.

I don't know if that answers the question or not.

Response by SFC George Smith made Nov 1 at 2016 11:06 PM

2016-11-01T23:06:55-04:00

they didn't...

Response by SSG G Smith made Nov 2 at 2016 7:26 AM

2016-11-02T07:26:40-04:00

I can say my personal values have not changed. While I was in I lived by the Army values because that was the job I had and the path I took. My personal values have never been changed on active or retired status. I am me in either situation and won't compromise myself.

Response by PO1 Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 2 at 2016 8:32 AM

2016-11-02T08:32:08-04:00

My personal values reflected upon myself; that I had determination but I didn't know how to embrace it. Before the military, I had no self-discipline, I was afraid to step out of my comfort zone for fear of the inevitable. Make my choice to join the military, grounded me yet let me spread my wings.
My priorities changed when I found out I was pregnant, in the Navy. I wasn't there for myself to "lose weight" or "find ground". I was there for my family, my friends and the new appreciation motivated me to keep doing what I"m doing and never give up or in.

Response by Cpl Justin Goolsby made Nov 2 at 2016 10:13 AM

2016-11-02T10:13:35-04:00

Well for me, the mission always came first. I've skipped chow and worked long hours for so long to ensure mission readiness. Now that I work a regular job with no overtime, I can take a step back and let my Marines handle the most important tasks and advise them on things they are unsure of. I actually go take chow. I'm home more often to be with my family. Not sure if those are really values, but that's how I've changed since leaving the Corps.

Response by SSG Eric Burleson made Nov 2 at 2016 12:02 PM

2016-11-02T12:02:17-04:00

So maybe I wasn't totally clear with the question. Generally, values are unchanging or very rarely change. But separating from the military puts you in a completely different context. "Respect" is a commonly held value in the military, particularly respect for rank and self-respect. But it's manifested differently in the civilian world. So how did your values manifest differently in the civilian world? How do you express your values differently?

Response by SGT Paul Mackay made Nov 2 at 2016 10:32 PM

2016-11-02T22:32:16-04:00

look out for myself because 25th inf div didn't lookout for me when i was there.

Response by PO2 Sybil "TT" I. made Nov 3 at 2016 3:05 AM

2016-11-03T03:05:45-04:00

Mine never changed. I have the same values before I went in, during, and after. Priorities have changed, but not my values.

Response by CPT Wendy Ormond made Nov 8 at 2016 7:02 AM

2016-11-08T07:02:18-05:00

I don't feel I changed my values, but transferred them. I did my best to fulfill my given duties as a soldier, and do the same as a nurse. I don't have a spouse or children, I will add. I fulfill my duties as a nurse to the best of my abilities instead of just putting in my time, as I have seen a few of my fellow coworkers and even a few of my fellow soldiers have seemed to do, in the past. I still have loyalty to my country and live to be a good citizen. Duty, Honor, Country and I add Family also, as I have a large close extended family. Selfless Service works as a nurse as well as a soldier, and also as a citizen, and again, if you have a family, your service would go to them before volunteering in the community, for instance.

Response by CPO Bill Penrod made Nov 8 at 2016 8:04 AM

2016-11-08T08:04:07-05:00

It was pretty close to love at first sight. I met my Filipina girl friend Late November 1969 three days later my ship, USS Sanctuary went back to Vietnam. Over the next six months we were together less than twenty days we did write weekly letters. I took my R & R to Manila for one last fling with my girl friend. We stayed at the Pines Hotel in Baguio when I ask "Marry me" She laughed I said again "Marry me" this time brought tears. Two days later we were married. Our love is still growing after 46 years. My wife strengthen my Christian values which remain steadfast to this day.

Response by CPL Daniel Schwinge made Nov 8 at 2016 8:34 AM

2016-11-08T08:34:24-05:00

I lost a job because of my values. I honestly expected people to be on time, do their job, and take responsibility for their actions. Doesn't work that way in civilian life. Especially in the VA.

Response by SP5 Bob Rudolph made Nov 8 at 2016 8:35 AM

2016-11-08T08:35:20-05:00

My personal values changed when I went into the Army. Drafted out of college during the Vietnam era, raised in post WWII suburbia, I had general respect for my country but other than that my values were framed by my parents and teachers. My Army experience so broadened my viewpoints, my experience with the world and my respect and love of country and countrymen that it served me very well for the rest of my business life. I'm not sure if my college degrees or my mere 2 years in the Army were more telling on my life priorities. Maybe they are tied.

Response by SFC Louis Willhauck, MSM, JSCM, and ARCOM made Nov 8 at 2016 9:49 AM

2016-11-08T09:49:00-05:00

It's hard to say... I doubt that MY values ever "changed" so much as they have "evolved" in some respects. But mostly I seem to think that it is my environment that is really continuing to change as time goes on. And in many ways I feel as though I am "fighting the system" more these days as well. I am just a "traditionalist" drifting into a more ruined world. Then again, perhaps I am just seeing things clearer (or am I going blind, I am not entirely sure which it is) as time goes on. Civilian life and work was a real shocker to me. I think I held true to myself, but it didn't make things any easier at all (profit motive vs. service motive conflicts and all that).

Mostly all I can say is I managed to "survive" to retire fully at 52; now I do what I want, when I want (as long as the money is there) and I generally don't give a diddly what anyone else thinks about it.

Response by LCpl James Robertson made Nov 8 at 2016 10:05 AM

2016-11-08T10:05:03-05:00

My personal values increased by a strong work ethnics to excel in any work task that I were assigned. Next my eyes were open to the truths of the real world system. Being truthful have no place on this earth, that society today would rather hear a lie then the truth, to expose the truth you are taking your life into your own hand. People and Governments hate being told the truth upon. I don't have a Top Secret Clearance to where I must lie about everything when it comes to wrongdoings, by the Government or anyone else. One thing I will do is tell the truth if you ask me, if you don't want to know don't ask if you can't handle the truth. The Righteousness of God I will be until the day I die.

Response by 1LT Stephen Lawrence made Nov 8 at 2016 11:29 AM

2016-11-08T11:29:19-05:00

The military gave me values that have stayed with me my whole life. Be prepared, be honest, get the job done, protect your buddies, be humble and be willing to do for others. I must say I became more liberal politically but that did not change any of the above. I always tell others, don't tell me what you are going to do, show me.

Response by CPT Dennis Stevenson made Nov 8 at 2016 11:41 AM

2016-11-08T11:41:52-05:00

I went from skeptic to cynic. I also changed values in the sense that "the American Way" of materialism and Christianity changed to the Buddhist idea of that we're all connected and that of an agnostic. IMO, we lost Viet Nam because we never read "The Art of War" or any of the classics of guerrila warfare. We believed that all those fancy weapons would win it for us, but really, what are weapons without soldiers?
As an advisor in Viet Nam in 1968, I witnessed some games being played for promotion of senior officers with no regards to human life American or Vietnamese. Too many civilians making too much money. Too many American and Vietnamese killed for something that would have been avoided had we worked with them. After all, they had been faithful allies and had a true beef with the French.

Response by SGM Bill Johnson made Nov 8 at 2016 11:58 AM

2016-11-08T11:58:43-05:00

I entered the Army with a set of values, which I stuck to every day. The Army experience helped confirm that most of my values would allow me to succeed. It also showed me that some things the Army values are unimportant to me. And I learned that I could navigate the lane in between the two quite well without hurting others or myself. The Army did not "give me" a set of values. In fact a few things that I value go against what the Army asked of me. And mostly I am talking about those values that the Army pays lip service to, such as "fairness", which the Army is anything but. I hold the same values today as I did at 17 when I swore an oath of enlistment. That said, I did adopt the "Army Ethics" when I enlisted and I upheld those requirements every day that I wore the uniform. That is not necessarily the case today.

Response by SPC Jamie Smith made Nov 8 at 2016 12:21 PM

2016-11-08T12:21:11-05:00

When I was drafted, I was definitely on the path to prison or worse. I already had a record. No felonies, but several misdemeanors. My police record kept me from getting drafted until I was 21. (I think the army kept lowering their standards) I found out during basic @ leonardwood, & AIT @ Polk that I could do anything that I really put my mind to. After a 13+ month tour with the 1st cav in Vietnam (11c mos) , my values were definitely changed. I was able to land a good job, and learn a trade that would make me a good living, & now a decent retirement pension. I guess you could say that the military values I picked up while I was in pretty much saved my life.

Response by SPC Charles Slininger made Nov 8 at 2016 12:21 PM

2016-11-08T12:21:17-05:00

I wouldn't say that it changed my personal values as it enhanced certain ones. Many of the newly enlisted are young "kids" who had a lot of growing up to do outside of what they were raised in. Myself included in that ilk. Selfless Service, Loyalty, Honor and Integrity were major values that I held in very high regard and built my character. However the military taught me better ways to show respect and duty to those you work with and for. Its not just a pride thing or obligation, but how you have to hold yourself accountable for as not everyone will.

As for priorities, I think that the military opened my eyes to a bigger world than just yourself or your family. There are others to watch out for and represent. I took much more pride in the flag and the nation as a whole that I may have taken for granted before or even during my service. Its hard for me not to make observations to disrespect or lack of care for the flag, what it represents and how it should be honored. For example, how tattered flags should be "retired" or if you find caked on dust on top of a flag case at a school that was presented from a local serving unit while deployed. People often struggle with that oversight and it may be a bit overboard at times, but its something that should be respected.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 8 at 2016 12:35 PM

2016-11-08T12:35:34-05:00

My values never really changed. However, the longer I stayed in the more flexible I became in their interpretation. I saw that the values published and recited like memorized dogma were not, in many instances, carved in stone by the hand of the Almighty not subject to questioning as to their meaning. The biggest that comes to mind is at a board that I went to where I was asked what I considered to me the most important Army Value and I gave an answer that was not what the board expected and ended up giving a detailed explanation as to why and had a few of the board members rethinking their lines of thought when I finished. Life, I found over the course of my career wasn't always black or white, but had a whole bunch of colors and shades in between.

Response by TSgt James Carson made Nov 8 at 2016 2:00 PM

2016-11-08T14:00:22-05:00

I became a stronger conservative and wanted a stronger, better country. My values never really changed too much. I saw there is allot of work to do and we all much do our part, be it in our local neighborhoods or states or federal levels. We must demand better from our representatives, and make sure this country is dept free and WE stop asking for give mes'. This country is slipping away from what it was founded to be.

Response by SGT Charles Cameron made Nov 8 at 2016 2:09 PM

2016-11-08T14:09:15-05:00

Here's mine:
When I enlisted, it was because of a wrong that I did, resulting in the possibility of a prison term. I did not support the militia as a whole...but I was there. I served, I was a "rebel within the ranks"...and paid for my actions. Even then, the Army was kind and didn't slap me too hard. When I left, I rejoiced. Late, grew-up, and re-enlisted 2 more times. As I grew up and matured, yes, my attitude changed. I realized that in my youth, I was the problem. With that awareness...and others...my enlisted experiences grew to be very special to me. I met new friends to call "family", got promoted, was given responsibilities. Unfortunately, as one gets older, the body gets "bigger" and I couldn't re-up a 4th time...Lol.
Value change? OH YES! As I interface with other vets at the local VA Hospital, I have come to reflect on those times of comradeships, even those long forgotten. With my training and reflections, my personal, family, and survival attitudes have been for the better, and responsibilities accepted in a very positive way. As I reflect on my past, as others have said, "I would change a few", but I can't...but I can, and do, use them as guides for the better. The service has changed. For me...not for the better, but...we'll see. Now, my values have grown up. A solid Patriot, gun owner, 2nd Amendment supporter, a family man,volunteer.
Well...that's my "soap box" for now. Lol.

Response by CPL Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 8 at 2016 9:42 PM

2016-11-08T21:42:00-05:00

I may be an odd man out here, as I was a draftee (1969) with only 2 years of service. But being in the Army changed my life for the better. While my personal values remained essentially the same, the concepts of espirit de corps, teamwork and leadership had a positive influence on me in my post Army life. As the years passed I became very grateful to have been part of such an undertaking.

Response by CW4 Richard Pappa made Nov 8 at 2016 9:48 PM

2016-11-08T21:48:03-05:00

Civilian will lie cheat steal any way the can. can not trust any of them. had a hard time trying to change back to civilian life. Must take care of oneself first and that includes family. Dog eat Dog. no one has your 6 or 12 or 3 or 9. they will surround you with deceit..

Response by SFC Bill Mace made Nov 9 at 2016 4:18 PM

2016-11-09T16:18:45-05:00

One of my mottoes when I was in was "If you cut me, I'll bleed Army blood. I am here for you 24/7." Now that I am out, "I am here for you, weekdays from 9 to 5." Sad really.

Response by PO3 Ronald Smith made Nov 15 at 2016 7:10 PM

2016-11-15T19:10:39-05:00

My moral compass was shot. When Saigon fell my faith in America was destroyed. I hated our Govt. In 1980 I went forward in a little church in Iowa but it didn't help what I later learned to be PTS. When Regan invaded Granada my views on Govt. changed. My moral compass started to come back. But my love for my brothers and sisters in uniform never changed.

Response by SGT Patrick Wells made Apr 22 at 2017 8:52 PM

2017-04-22T20:52:38-04:00

My Values haven't changed The Army reinforced and strengthened them. What did change was me personally. I was timid and extremely shy. I was afraid to make a decision for fear of making a mistake. The Army taught me very early on (starting in Boot camp) to overcome those fears.