If a soldier fails to show in proper PT GEAR, can you make them do prt in duty uniform?

SFC Kenneth Hunnell — Mon, 28 Mar 2016 17:58:17 -0400

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 28 at 2016 6:16 PM

1SG Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 28 Mar 2016 18:16:28 -0400

Damn right I can.
And give them a U for not being in the proper uniform.
And counsel them for failing to have a clue.

Some things are inexcusable. This is one of them.
The true litmus is whether or not everyone else is in the correct uniform. Like my drill sergeant said way back when: "If everyone else is doing one thing, and you are doing something else, you might be wrong".

Response by MAJ Ken Landgren made Mar 28 at 2016 7:33 PM

MAJ Ken Landgren — Mon, 28 Mar 2016 19:33:21 -0400

We are allowed to hurt their feeling? I am shocked!

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 28 at 2016 7:47 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 28 Mar 2016 19:47:49 -0400

The Commander has the power to give the soldier a U for unsatisfactory participation.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 28 at 2016 9:03 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 28 Mar 2016 21:03:38 -0400

I have done it. He showed up in the right uniform after that.

Response by CAPT Kevin B. made Mar 28 at 2016 9:26 PM

CAPT Kevin B. — Mon, 28 Mar 2016 21:26:01 -0400

Love the responses which for the most part I'm on board with. I would keep in mind that if you do make him do the drill, make sure you keep an eye on him so if he's really pulling up lame because of improper footwear etc., you don't create a significant medical problem. Then you become the subject of COC discussion. You're still responsible for the safety of the event.

Response by SSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 28 at 2016 10:11 PM

SSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 28 Mar 2016 22:11:16 -0400

According to FM 7-22, PRT is designed to be able to be done in ACUs.

Response by CSM Darieus ZaGara made Mar 29 at 2016 5:59 AM

CSM Darieus ZaGara — Tue, 29 Mar 2016 05:59:23 -0400

There are many components to fitness, some of which are specifically designed to build strength and stamina required for tactical duties. Of course they can and should direct PT unless they have a note from the doctor.

Response by 1SG Harold Piet made Mar 29 at 2016 6:48 AM

1SG Harold Piet — Tue, 29 Mar 2016 06:48:54 -0400

When I joined it was done in fatigues, with boots. Now as to what action to take with the soldier that showed up in the wrong uniform. Counseling? Art 15? depends n the reason and the soldier. Counseling no doubt. In 1975 in the winter we swapped our outer fatigue shirt for a Unit sweatshirt in most units and in summer we swapped our T shit, for a Unit T shirt.

Response by SSG Robert Webster made Mar 29 at 2016 8:14 AM

SSG Robert Webster — Tue, 29 Mar 2016 08:14:26 -0400

My first question would be - What is the duty uniform?
My next question would be - What is the proper PT gear?

There is a problem with your statement - PT "gear" can be almost anything. Maybe what should be stressed to the soldier is that they should show up in the "proscribed uniform and equipment" for a particular event.

Response by PFC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 29 at 2016 8:33 AM

PFC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 29 Mar 2016 08:33:29 -0400

I'd personally rather do PT in the duty uniform a lot of the time.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 29 at 2016 8:56 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 29 Mar 2016 08:56:42 -0400

The answer of "yes" is correct. If you look in FM 7-22, in the first sections of every type of exercise it list the uniforms that are permitted to conduct that exercise whether it's cd1 or a trail run. When in doubt, look at the FM!

Response by LTC Andrew Addison made Mar 29 at 2016 9:42 AM

LTC Andrew Addison — Tue, 29 Mar 2016 09:42:34 -0400

If PT is Combatives this would be the proper uniform anyway along with running shoes of course.

Response by SSG Ed Mikus made Mar 29 at 2016 11:07 AM

SSG Ed Mikus — Tue, 29 Mar 2016 11:07:32 -0400

I have made them

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 29 at 2016 11:46 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 29 Mar 2016 11:46:26 -0400

When I was in basic our duty uniform was our pt uniform, including our boots. If it was warm enough we got to take our tops off.

Response by LTC John Wilson made Mar 29 at 2016 2:11 PM

LTC John Wilson — Tue, 29 Mar 2016 14:11:37 -0400

In the Past or old Army, yes you could make him do pt in duty uniform provided it was not Dress greens and work uniform like fatigues. If he need an escort back to get his PT gear,, we would provide it and he would perform all the PT that he missed after he got back. He would also be written up for failure to comply with policy and procedures or a direct order "if given." But, we are not in the Old Army and he may call his mom or dad or even the President to get you off his back. Do what you think complies with regulations and you have satisfied your responsibility.

Response by SPC Kathleen Harris made Mar 29 at 2016 4:51 PM

SPC Kathleen Harris — Tue, 29 Mar 2016 16:51:22 -0400

Yes...Yes...Yes. Even if he is in his Class A's. Unless he showed up last night he knew what was expected of him. He maybe bucking for a Sec 8. He can't possibly be that much of an idiot. I had trouble keeping up the physical part of basic training and then again at my duty station. I pushed forward, on a run I may have been the last person on a run and back aways, but eventually I got there, with a bunch of peed off people cause they had to wait on me for formation.

Response by SGT Dave Tracy made Mar 29 at 2016 5:07 PM

SGT Dave Tracy — Tue, 29 Mar 2016 17:07:08 -0400

It didn't happen often outside of combative PT, but I did PT in my ACUs before...and no, it wasn't because I forgot my shorts and T-shirt.
Unless I'm off the mark, I think most of us have done PT in our duty uniform (ACUs, BDUs, etc) at least occasionally. No reason not to have Mr. Forgetful miss out.

Response by SPC Dean J. Thompson made Mar 29 at 2016 6:01 PM

SPC Dean J. Thompson — Tue, 29 Mar 2016 18:01:51 -0400

You bet they can, combat boots and all.

Response by LTC Michael Parker made Mar 29 at 2016 6:23 PM

LTC Michael Parker — Tue, 29 Mar 2016 18:23:52 -0400

In basic/AIT, airborne and air assault school, all my PT was done in the duty uniform to include combat boots.

Response by SFC Mikael Boyd made Mar 29 at 2016 7:30 PM

SFC Mikael Boyd — Tue, 29 Mar 2016 19:30:03 -0400

Yes you can acu pants and t shirt and boots or tennis shoes are considered alternate pt uniform

Response by SPC William Richardson made Mar 29 at 2016 7:57 PM

SPC William Richardson — Tue, 29 Mar 2016 19:57:12 -0400

what is proper PT gear ? when I was in it was boots and fatigues.

Response by SGT Tim Fridley made Mar 29 at 2016 9:45 PM

SGT Tim Fridley — Tue, 29 Mar 2016 21:45:55 -0400

Back when first joined your duty uniform was your pt uniform just before they came out with the banana suit LOL that being said does this happen alot? Also is there a reason this soldier does this EG: profile ect ?

Response by 1LT Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 30 at 2016 12:26 AM

1LT Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 30 Mar 2016 00:26:42 -0400

Yes. AR 350-1 actually mentions conducting PRT in boots.
AR 350-1 Appendix G, G-9 i. (3)
(3) The preferred footwear for running is the running shoe. However, some physical training in well-fitted and broken-in boots, to include limited running and rapid foot marching, may be appropriate. Activities conducted in combat boots should progressively increase in duration allowing Soldiers to adapt to performing in boots. Training in boots will prepare Soldiers for running or forced-marches over rough terrain. Commanders must consider the experi- ence of their Soldiers and their unit missions when deciding on the footwear for PRT.

Response by SPC Steven Depuy made Mar 30 at 2016 7:03 AM

SPC Steven Depuy — Wed, 30 Mar 2016 07:03:36 -0400

Gee, in my day, PT uniform was take off your fatigue shirt, your now in PT uniform. You mean you can't make them take PT anymore unless they have sneakers and shorts on???

Response by SPC Chris Ashman made Mar 30 at 2016 7:27 AM

SPC Chris Ashman — Wed, 30 Mar 2016 07:27:39 -0400

Shaking my head in disbelief to this question YES!! We would PT in BDUs as a unit for company parties at Ft. Bragg.

Response by MSG Robert Mills made Mar 30 at 2016 8:51 AM

MSG Robert Mills — Wed, 30 Mar 2016 08:51:34 -0400

Your platoon, your uniform standards, you sure can, my first question is why and where is his squad leader>?

Response by MSG Robert Mills made Mar 30 at 2016 9:04 AM

MSG Robert Mills — Wed, 30 Mar 2016 09:04:06 -0400

SCUFF SCUFF SCUFF or give em a hug and send them back to change lol

Response by SFC David Davenport made Mar 30 at 2016 9:23 AM

SFC David Davenport — Wed, 30 Mar 2016 09:23:00 -0400

Yes. Look up the relevant parts of FM for Physical Fitness for clarity and ideas if you have doubts. Some forms of PT even lend themselves to the duty uniform (log PT and foot marches come to mind). As with anything else take a few minutes to research the relevant regulations/policies to back up and support your actions.

Response by SFC Larry Smith made Mar 30 at 2016 11:14 AM

SFC Larry Smith — Wed, 30 Mar 2016 11:14:57 -0400

Sure can, PRT' are usually on the Training schedule. But I have had one with Morning formation.

Response by CW4 Raymond Younger made Mar 30 at 2016 12:26 PM

CW4 Raymond Younger — Wed, 30 Mar 2016 12:26:46 -0400

Sure. Master Fitness Program gave all sorts of options. If you don't want to mess up the soldier's fatigues there are mild forms for a good workout. However, is the idea to coerce the soldier to work out or is this punitive corrective action? Isolating the soldier from the team event or formation is another action taken demonstrating the individual has failed in some way to conform, support the team, follow directions, &c. Depends on your point, your tolerance, and justification. Part of the issue is that the soldier for what ever reason has taken a chunk of your time to either correct a transgression or modify work. This detracts from the mission, other soldiers, and certainly your objectives for either the day or longer. As a comment mentioned before, there are all sorts of modified PT uniforms. Nothing says you must wear tennis shoes or sweat suit. Train as you fight! ATW!

Response by 1SG Patrick Sims made Mar 30 at 2016 12:59 PM

1SG Patrick Sims — Wed, 30 Mar 2016 12:59:30 -0400

I would suggest you first find out why he isn't in a proper uniform. Having someone do PT without the proper footwear isn't a very good idea. Remember, as a First Sergeant your job is to take care of the soldiers.---That having been said--If he's being a wise guy and expects prefectural treatment, deal with him later. He may be looking for a reason to injure himself. ---Think it through-- before you make a decision.

Response by SFC Ernest Thurston made Mar 31 at 2016 12:54 AM

SFC Ernest Thurston — Thu, 31 Mar 2016 00:54:47 -0400

Of course you can. The only excuse would be if the person has a profile, but even then if the prescribed uniform is the PT uniform, and they don't have the sense to show up in the proper uniform make them do PT in whatever they are wearing. I would also bring it to everyone's attention that the proper uniform is the PT uniform. This way you don't start setting a pattern of troops showing up in the wrong uniform. I'd be tempted to make this soldier the guidon bearer during the run to get the message across. For the first about ten years I was in the PT uniform was fatigues, t shirt and combat boots. Sometimes we threw on a flack vest. Some people would argue that you can't run in combat boots. My answer to that is- What are you going to do in combat? Are you going to stop and put your running shoes on? If that's the case I guess you will die with running shoes on,

Response by SFC Ernest Thurston made Mar 31 at 2016 1:12 AM

SFC Ernest Thurston — Thu, 31 Mar 2016 01:12:21 -0400

I already commented on the actual question, but as I read the other comments I noticed that almost everyone promoted SFC Kenneth Hunnell to 1SG. Congratulations! We can now give promotions on this site :-)

Response by COL John Hudson made Mar 31 at 2016 8:47 AM

COL John Hudson — Thu, 31 Mar 2016 08:47:02 -0400

From the IG Desk: Short answer, "No." Responsibility for the correct uniform for any and all activities is the Commander. Having said that, I am aware of exceptions (I'll leave it at that...'wink.')

Response by MAJ Todd Lamb made Apr 2 at 2016 1:39 PM

MAJ Todd Lamb — Sat, 02 Apr 2016 13:39:11 -0400

If a soldier shows up in an unauthorized uniform, they are failure to report. As offensive as it may seen (I used to sleep in my PTs) they need retraining. Your sense of right and wrong is exactly why you were chosen to be the SFC, don't let your sense of outrage take over. Believe me, I know.