How should I help my lost son assess any military options as a potential pathway for what to do in life?

2018-01-31T20:22:44-05:00

Possibly age old question. Super bright 21 year old stuck. Cant figure out what to do in life. Working hard on the concept to teach him that MOST people in this world ended up in a job or career by accident, or at least not by clear planning. That you have to open doors, see where they go, then open more. That there may be no magical epiphany idea or dream job. But at least if you have a job or trade you kind of like at least you will have a path, a foundation, hopefully a little money in the bank. Try stuff, learn stuff, inch forward.

He has a few friends/acquaintances that did National Guard. One still kind of floundering the guard did him no good, but two did better with respect to career paths. One was super smart and got into business logistics I think with Toyota from it. The other did pretty good at mechanics and has some career options there.

Although its a very vague and complex question, can you share some learned experiences that might apply to this type of youth? Most likely routes for success (with hard work!). Most likely to have any kind of choice in experiences? Anything at all to start processing all the military options available and thier pros and cons?

His grandfather was Lt. Colonel and Chaplain in Vietnam. So he has some background. But he is overwhelmed with all the choices. So Im trying to help him research options. But I dont want a recruiter be his main source of info (sorry if that is off base and offensive to someone - am I perpetuating an old stereotype about recruiters?.)

All input welcome.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 31 at 2018 8:38 PM

2018-01-31T20:38:40-05:00

In order to assist this properly, what are the interests of your son? While he may not know where he wants to go, there has to be something that he is interested in.

Response by Todd W. Roat made Jan 31 at 2018 8:48 PM

2018-01-31T20:48:27-05:00

Interests is a tricky question. Esp. for this age group. They arent like we were ;^) 21 is like 18. When he first started college he kept wanting to do Neuroscience, then consider a Physician Assistant - very science oriented. Also good with machines and dad thinks he would excel at robotics. But lately we are on an Outdoor Leadership slant and outdoor pursuits. He was very good at Math and Science in high school and learns quickly when interested. He talks fondly out some people he knows that moved up the ladder in construction and oil field work. Another became a mechanic for Caterpillar. I wish the kids could interns is 20 different careers, just to see what they were.

Response by Sgt Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 31 at 2018 8:56 PM

2018-01-31T20:56:01-05:00

Todd W. Roat From the age of 15, I knew that I wanted to join the Marine Corps and make it a career. I also wanted to serve in Vietnam, because assisting the South Vietnamese people was a just cause. In Vietnam, I heard that Apollo 11 had landed on the Moon, and that we had walked on the surface. As a kid, I had followed the Space Program, and with the Moon landing, I thought that this would be a good career. My last two years were spent at MCB 29 Palms, where there was a serious drug problem. That was enough for me to decide against reenlisting, and pursue my dream of working for the Space Program. Upon discharge I found a good paying job at a chemical plant while I worked on my degree. Five and a half years later, I had my degree, and took a pay cut when I started work on the Space Shuttle Program. I started work three years before the first Space Shuttle Fight, and stayed until one month after the last Space Shuttle mission. In high school, I had no doubt that I would retire from the Marine Corps, but plans change. I have always been a planner, and having plans and goals is always good. The military is a good lifestyle but it is not for everyone. I loved being part of the brotherhood, but not everyone likes the structure and discipline that are called for when serving. I would advise your son to look at Active Duty, Reserve and National Guard options. I would not advise anyone joining just because they do not know what to do in life.

Response by SGM Erik Marquez made Jan 31 at 2018 9:10 PM

2018-01-31T21:10:59-05:00

Sir, i applaud you for helping your son find a path that will make him happy and successful..

My suggestion is, Stop.
The first step is for him to take charge of his life, be it with a goal to manage the local Walmart or be a NASA engineer after a career in the air force and the space program.
So, if I may... Suggest he come sign up here, and take the first step...when he does introduce him in this thread and let him ask, listen, question, discover for himself.
It cuts out the filter, it gives him a sense of taking charge of his life, it puts the onus on him to not sit back and let others do for you, but for you to reach out and do for yourself.
And with that said, to be frank....... Id say, the Service does not need another Solider, Airmen, Marine or Sailer that wont step up and be in charge of at least their own life, so they can learn and grow as a leader and one day be put in charge of others lives. What we do need if he is willing.. is an open mind, a drive, an interest in being better tomorrow then he is today. To be ready to fail, but never quit.

Ask him to come look us up... ask, listen, process, take nothing to heart on words alone, trust but verify.

Respectfully
Erik Marquez
Sergeant Major
Infantry, Retired

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 31 at 2018 9:59 PM

2018-01-31T21:59:17-05:00

I was in the guard and had no career path set until I was around 23-24, besides that I was jumping from job to job and just going out to bars and meeting women. Just enjoying my youth I guess you could say. But that being said, it all changed when I meet my wife. She was a hard charger who was way mature then I was. Having her in my life set me straight. Maybe that’s what your son needs, a good women. If not, then it’s going to be something that just clicks in his head. Maybe he will one day just look around and just not be satisfied with where’s he’s at. Being in the military gives you a good push and some points on a resume. But it eventually just falls on the person at the end. My advice to you sir is to just be patient.

Response by CA Delete D. made Feb 1 at 2018 12:09 AM

2018-02-01T00:09:10-05:00

Fascinating topic! I'll tell my experience and leave a few bullet points of advice; hopefully at least part of it is helpful.

MY STORY: Decided at about 8 years old that becoming Batman wasn't realistic, but realized I loved the water, whales and sharks so figured Marine Biologist was the way to go. Cut to 18 yrs old and starting a BS in Marine Science - I lasted a semester or two before I found out that I would soend most of my career doing conservation work or begging companies for grant money to conduct research. I switched to pre-med then learned just how much school, clinical rotations and residency I had ahead of me.....yeah, no, but becoming a PA is an alternative I still think about.

Anyway, cut to 24 and I enlist in the Navy after dropping out of college wanting to become a CTI (Russian). However, I am only offered the submarine SECF program (w/o knowing what SECF meant) and was under impression that I was gonna be an Electronics Technician (which sounded pretty cool, so I was fine with it). After BASIC in Illinois, I find out at A-School in rotten Groton that SECF basically means I have been put into a pool...a rate lottery, if you will....and then one day I am sat in front of a PO3 exam for Sonar Technician.....no ET! I do well at the training - even tutored here and there and made class leader - but I end up hating submarine life, Norfolk and my rate, but luck out with some additional tests beyond ASVAB I had taken and a favorable background check - lo and behold I ended up getting approved for a crossrate into CTI rating after all. I finish my tour as an E-5 Senior Linguist with great letters of rec and a NAM. Wanted to reenlist for special billet (app pkg took 2 months to prep) but got turned down, and I was pissed, so elected to just separate at my EAOS. I got a bachelors afterward and now working for the man once again. My current goal is to make it as a Financial Analyst. I'm even excited at the thought of the associated grunt work (hours of scenario modeling, jetlag, stakeholder presentations, molding a reputation for quality and performance through blood, sweat and lots of late night takeout). Plenty of obstacles, for sure, but my diverse educational and work background are getting noticed, but need to put myself out more. You will need to do the same - networking significantly imcreases chances of employment.

ADVICE: Tweak the strategy when necessary, and try new things/ideas. Take calculated risks. Take survival jobs when you need the cash and to avoid employment gaps. Utilize appropriate websites (e.g. dol.gov) to discover jobs that pay well, show growth, have work-life balance you like (hint: youtube career videos....companies make vids like that), and are available in areas you want to live. You'll at least narrow down the list of what you don't want to do.

Assess your skills and gain new ones or develop proficiency in old ones. There are plenty of sites that can teach you various hard skills (i.e. LinkedIn learning, Lynda.com; ivmf.syracuse.edu; IT and coding apps (check out Programming Hub in the playstore for a taste)) Sign up with your state's unemployment website for job postings and free local training (a few months back round my neck of the woods there were free cert classes for new welders). You could complete a CDL course if you like the open road - I completed an 8 week course in 6 weeks on my post 9/11 bill ...had license one week later and then was on my way to Iowa for orientation the following week.

Civilian wardrobe: check out major dept stores with veteran discounts and go buy some nice trousers/oxfords/polos/neckties/etc. Too many people do not dress like respectable adults and it will get noticed by people that have influence to advance you. Again, make use of google to get tips on clothes, style, bargains, sales, etc.

Think outside box. Maybe find an overseas contractor gig through http://www.dangerzonejobs.com and make some money, experience other parts of world.

While you decide what job you want to try next, make sure you download and practice constructing your resume, writing cover letters, interview questions, researching your salary range, etc. Make good use of your time!

Danger Zone Jobs – Find overseas contracting jobs faster

Response by Todd W. Roat made Feb 1 at 2018 7:31 AM

2018-02-01T07:31:20-05:00

How do the ASVAB testing work in reality. At any point in the process do you have an opportunity to control your destiny after testing? He has this opinion that you take the testing and whatever they decide you are stuck with. I thought there was some small degree of choice.

Response by CPT Lawrence Cable made Feb 1 at 2018 8:10 AM

2018-02-01T08:10:32-05:00

Let me tell you my story. First, my father was Career Air Force and I really only ever had just a passing interest in the Military through High School and College. I was laid off during the 1980 Recession, couldn't find work, so decided to join the Army for a couple of reasons. One was that I needed a job, another was to see if I was tough enough to handle it (Infantry), and the other was to perform that service to the nation that I guess my Father had ingrained in me. With my own boys, I always teased them that when they turned 18 they had five choices in life, Army, Navy, Marines, Air Force of Coast Guard, but never pushed that of course. The youngest ended up in the same situation as I had been in the 80's, unemployed and struggling to find something. He asked me what I did during the Big Recession, which was join the Army. He said he didn't want to join the Army , I pointed out that there were four other choices. He has now been in the Navy for 10 years and just tested for Chief (E7) for his first time. Set the example, give them advice if they ask, don't be disappointed if they do something different.
And yes, my Father was Air Force (joined when it was Army Air Corp), I was Army/Army National Guard/Army Reserve and my Son is Navy. No marines in the Family yet.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 1 at 2018 10:53 AM

2018-02-01T10:53:32-05:00

Todd W. Roat , bless you for being interested in your son's future, vs brooding over the choices he makes. Good for you.
For your own mental well being and his, DO NOT push him to join the military. It is a decision that he has to make, with life-altering (and potentially, life endangering) consequences. I would just as soon have zero people in my ranks that felt compelled to be there by someone else; it seldom ends well.
My children are a beautiful gift from God and I love them dearly. They are very different, yet each has their own dreams and talents. My wish for them is only that they prosper and find true happiness. Not so much to ask, right?
My kids are 12, 10 and 5, so life decisions are a ways off. What I have tried to do is help them find and refine the talents that they have, and hopefully within the scope of things they enjoy. From there, I have tried to build on that to make that talent better and apply it to something they do. Someday, maybe make that talent and thing they enjoy a career.
For example, my middle son, Robby is a superior runner. He likes to go running with me, and can keep up until I take him beyond a 5k or so. Now I think he enjoys it because it is time with dad and he gets praise for doing well, but I also know that he is good enough to parlay that into track or cross-country in a couple of years. Maybe even a scholarship if he does well enough.
Now I know he won't likely have a career as a track star. Nor has he showed any interest in team sports like football or soccer. But it might just be a Launchpad to get his education, and a hobby that keeps him fit.
Robby has told me that he wants to be a Soldier, like me. That fills me with pride, but I also see where he might have trouble in that regard. Dad casts a long shadow, and I want him to earn everything he has with hard work and merit.

I guess what I am saying is to take an inventory of what your son has and is good at, and see where he has interests that he can parlay into more.
Some think that careers are luck, and to some extent that is true. But in order to get an opportunity, he needs to be in a position to get them, and have the guts to grab them when they come.

Now the tough love part. You can't coddle him, or enable him to be a layabout who shrugs when asked what he is doing with his day. By now, he should have left the nest and made some of his own way. If not, this has a way of turning into a way of life, and will hurt his chances at landing a great career as well as a partner to share that with.
Good luck, Todd. You have a good heart.

Response by Cpl Ted Moore made Feb 1 at 2018 3:12 PM

2018-02-01T15:12:39-05:00

One way to help him is to stop helping him. Once all the responsibility is on his shoulders, he will stop taking wrong turns and settle into work that he can live with day-to-day. If you keep mothering him, supporting him, and providing a safety net, he will always meander with no consequences. It is hard to let your kid go off into the world. You want the best for them. You want to help them become happy and productive citizens. However, taking off the training wheels is the best approach. That is not only the Marine Corps way, it is the way of many successful and well-adjusted adults.
You don't know how aggravating it is to put up with young Marines who are "lost ones" who got tricked into joining the Corps in order to help them grow up. That's not what America's military is supposed to do. It is not a day care for grown children. It is a serious workplace with a serious mission. Folks who join the U.S. military to help them figure their life out are unmotivated, unproductive, and unhappy. He has shown an interest in sophisticated and cerebral subjects. Has he ever said, "I think I belong in the Air Force, gathering signals intelligence." Has he ever shown and interest in America's Force In Readiness pursuing the Global War on Terrorism? Nice in theory, but the Marine Corps lives it 24/7/365. Don't kick the can down the road to the military's doorstep.

Response by SPC David Willis made Feb 1 at 2018 3:50 PM

2018-02-01T15:50:11-05:00

Military has gotta be 100% his choice. If he's only 80 or 90% invested it wont go well. I read that he liked mechanical, machines and robotics if that's the case there are countless jobs in all branches he could be interested in. He could work on drones or helicopters, he could become an engineer and build defenses or barracks there are many many things he could do in the military. Ill also say that just because he is unsure of what he wants to do isn't cause for concern just yet, hell Im 29 and I still have no clue what I want to do when I "grow up". Military time did me very well though and even though I have a job not a career its a very good job that the military helped me get through the lessons I learned.

Response by SGT DeMario McIlwain made Feb 1 at 2018 6:49 PM

2018-02-01T18:49:39-05:00

Todd,
Although I'm a army vet, my 21 yr old son was not that interested in the army. We had a few conversations about self starting as he was entering the "real world" and he himself realized the military could launch him into independence a lot faster than that 30hr a week job. He's now in the navy and enjoying his life of adventure.
I do believe as parents we lay out the law of the land and present them with options as they find the right fit on.

Response by Sgt Tee Organ made Feb 2 at 2018 8:26 AM

2018-02-02T08:26:30-05:00

Ha I got that problem now and Im 49. I fall into things by chance but generally there's a follow up convo along the lines of something I've done, or can do that someone else needs done. If Im good at drywall, and happen to be talking about it and someone walks by and needs a dry wall job done... That starts the ball rolling. The way to make that work though is exposure, networking, outgoing nature. At 21 he can come and go freely, he needs to get out and network. VFW's a great spot for some exposure, take him in there. Go to church? get him in with the men's groups there. Does he go out? I do karaoke, meet tons of people there, talk about everything, next thing ya know I got a side job doing some work for a couple hundred. Two weeks later I get a call from that guy asking if I can go see one of his frends places and do some work there. Word of mouth.... Look youll get him out of the house, and hell learn some things maybe find his calling that way. My buddy has a very successful start up that he got rolling by doing that, and it's something he's good at and enjoys, even sent himself to school to refine his skills.

Response by SPC Erich Guenther made Feb 2 at 2018 1:47 PM

2018-02-02T13:47:29-05:00

My advice is he doesn't necessarily have to go Military to explore career fields. There are plenty of hourly jobs and internships on the civilian side that do similar. Check out the hourly job of Night Auditor in a local hotel. That opens the fields of Hotel Accounting as well as Hotel Management. Check out an hourly job at a UPS or Fed Ex distribution center........that opens up a lot of potential opportunities. Check out a job on a local Railroad.......more opportunities there. All of this is non-military.