How do you deal with corporate recruiters who have limited knowledge of the military?

COL Jonas Vogelhut — Wed, 27 Aug 2014 14:48:38 -0400

Had an interesting 40 minute phone interview today. It was clear from the start that I was talking to a recruiter. Nice person, but little knowledge of me, my resume, or my career. Could have frustrated me. She started the conversation on the attack…..lots of people applied for this job, the phone interviews will down select to in person interviews, etc. She asked salary up front….asking me if I would take 10% less that I am making now. Rather than say yes or no, I just stated that we can leave salary to the final negotiations. She made it clear that I would have to turn in my terminal leave to start immediately …. that I could not be on terminal leave when hired. Yuk. Some of the interview questions were not realistic for me to answer….I would have had to have been in industry to have the experiences. Nevertheless, I tried to relate my experiences to the job. I used the job announcement in my answers, which might help. She typed while I talked.

So my question for discussion – how do you deal with recruiters who have limited/no knowledge of the military, for a military related (defense contractor) job? (Assuming the real people you will work for will have a thorough knowledge of the department of defense?)

Response by SPC Marleen Madding made Aug 27 at 2014 9:07 PM

SPC Marleen Madding — Wed, 27 Aug 2014 21:07:27 -0400

My thoughts are - Do you want to work for a Company that has a "Clearing House" of Resumes/Applications that they are sorting through to select the "right" candidate for the position. First Impressions Still Matter - not only for the Interviewee - but for the Company Representative too! (Unless you've done your research with this company - and the grass is greener - once you get let into the Gate)
One would Believe that they would have a VETERAN on their Recruiting Staff if they are Marketing to Veterans for Jobs (Unless they use a Staffing Firm).
- M

Response by CW3 Dylan E. Raymond, PHR made Aug 28 at 2014 10:38 PM

CW3 Dylan E. Raymond, PHR — Thu, 28 Aug 2014 22:38:05 -0400

This definitely sound like a gatekeeper person with little to no experience. If they called you then you have the minimum qualifications or they saw something on the resume that piqued there interest. Remember the goal of the interview process is to get to the offer stage. Companies use the telephone screen to narrow down the short list. Your ultimate goal is to keep selling for the face-to-face interview that is where you are going to get your best opportunity for the offer.

A couple of things be prepared to answer the salary question because it will come up. When I am asked salary I would respond with what do you have budgeted for the position. You have to know what your range is and be willing to walk away from the table if you feel you are being insulted with a low offer. Don't be desperate be confident and sell your skills.

Lastly do not focus on what you lack industry wise and focus on your strengths and hard transferrable skills. For example a mechanic is a mechanic is a mechanic no matter what industry you are going in so talk about the strengths of being a mechanic. Also do not start negotiating salary until an offer is extended I see too many feel lose leverage early on in the process.

Hope this helps a bit

Dylan

Response by 1SG Patrick G. made Aug 30 at 2014 10:07 PM

1SG Patrick G. — Sat, 30 Aug 2014 22:07:16 -0400

Sir, I've been retired for 10 yrs now (22 yrs of active duty service), most of it as a defense contractor. When you're discussing issues with vets and retirees, you'll be able to converse with no loss of translation, however, my experience with folks outside of DOD is that you'll have to speak in a totally "cloroxed" language you haven't used in well over 20 yrs. Initially, all the acronym soup we've cultivated will intrigue them, but they quickly tire of it, especially senior leadership that is easily frustrated and already suspect of a disciplined, motivated, and high-performing, established professional. To answer you question directly, I've had to transpose a significant amount of my experiences and qualifications into civilian equivalent examples so those filtering screeners can compare apples-to-apples. I'd also suggest to be prepared to defend dollar amounts of Hand Receipt equipment you've been responsible for, number of direct reports and total soldiers you led. It absolutely stuns and amazes most civilian employers and screeners that a young PFC or Senior Airman is responsible for readiness and availability of a million dollar MRAP or $30M AH-64D Longbow helicopter, and more. Brigade and Wing level Senior Noncomm's and senior Field Grade guys really get strange looks and questions. My best advice, sir, is to do your best to unwrap all the acronyms off of stuff and qualify / quantify your experiences with dollar amounts, number of folks supervised or totally responsible for in your organization. Be prepared to get pretty granular with claims of exceeding Operational Readiness rates and what measures you employed to achieve those rates, improving the efficiencies of "things" and what measures you took to do that, developing plans that streamlined operational / production output, etc. They may not directly address ISO, or Six Sigma, or Lean or Kaizen type elements, but they'll want to know details how you made "it" better. Remember, the "gatekeeper" filter lady was, most likely, tasked by a senior executive, and that executive's day is almost always made easier by the many items the gatekeeper filter lady juggles to make the exec's life easier...and ensuring she has job security. I'd be as thorough as possible answering the irritating questions and I'd wrap some Ph.D. level diplomacy around most of it. My last company, an aerospace company, manufacturing MALE UAS systems and high-end EO/IR sensors, had a retired 4-star CEO and myself that were retired military....out of 120 employees! There were a handful of vets with DD 214s. Every last dollar of contracted work we had was DOD or FMS/FMF work, but almost nobody in our organization understood a single element of the Acquisition Lifecycle Management Process. It made being a proactive Program Manager of two Program of Record solutions very difficult. Enjoy your retirement and these next chapters!

Response by CPT Kit Lancaster made Sep 1 at 2014 10:54 AM

CPT Kit Lancaster — Mon, 01 Sep 2014 10:54:03 -0400

Good Morning Sir. First, I would second everything 1SG Patrick below. With a few exceptions the corporate world is looking for specialized workers. Unless they know how cultivate and build talent (which few companies can do like the military) they are looking to plug in your skills into a preset cog.

I recommend learning as much about the respected position and industry the recruiters are looking to position you and your skills. Also, asked a few pointed questions of the recruiter. Who are your top clients? What specific positions do see opportunities for placement in the next 3-6 months?

Next relate your experience to the expected or needed value propositions of the position and industry. (Learn of and speak to their pain and how you can make it go away) You will most likely have way more experience, stories, missions and goals to reference than the average candidate. Just make sure to only share your top two or three examples.

Just curious what recruiting service are you using? Do you feel they have your best interest in mind and access to the best opportunities? Are you working with more than one recruiter?

Response by CW3 Bill Golden made Sep 1 at 2014 2:20 PM

CW3 Bill Golden — Mon, 01 Sep 2014 14:20:19 -0400

Senior professionals (E8/9 and O4+) should always take their time in finding their next position. Taking 2-3 months after official retirement will probably yield the best results for stable employment (>1.5-2 years) and maximized income.

It helps if a recruiter understands your background, but only if your background is highly relevant to the job opportunity that they are discussing. Otherwise it really is your responsibility to relate and to translate your skills and experience to the job opportunity.

Am always available to help translate what a recruiter says that they are looking for and how to define your skills.

Bill Golden
USADefenseIndustryJobs.com / IntelligenceCareers.com

Response by COL Roxanne Arndt made Sep 10 at 2014 12:26 PM

COL Roxanne Arndt — Wed, 10 Sep 2014 12:26:26 -0400

I'm not sure I would want to work for that company based on the initial impression!

Response by LTC Paul Labrador made Sep 10 at 2014 12:28 PM

LTC Paul Labrador — Wed, 10 Sep 2014 12:28:10 -0400

Sir, was she really interested in hiring you....?

Response by SSG Laureano Pabon made Sep 10 at 2014 1:33 PM

SSG Laureano Pabon — Wed, 10 Sep 2014 13:33:30 -0400

I thought I add this link here just FYI :

http://www.ttiofusa.com/Blogs.php?articleid=199

TTI of USA - Blogs

TTI of USA - Human Capital Recruiting Solutions

Response by COL Jean (John) F. B. made Sep 10 at 2014 1:52 PM

COL Jean (John) F. B. — Wed, 10 Sep 2014 13:52:15 -0400

I agree with someone else's take on this that the person you were talking to was acting as a "clearing house" to get the list of applicants down to a manageable number to call back and/or schedule face-to-face interviews with. In that type situation, it is best just to answer the questions to the best of your ability and try to make the cut. Would be helpful to prep for such an interview by studying the company, their jargon/terminology, mission focus, etc. What the recruiter lacks in military knowledge or specific knowledge of you can be mitigated by you knowing as much or more about the company she is representing and what they do than she does.

Changing gears -- I noticed your comment about possibly not being able to take terminal leave. Except in situations where you may have excess leave that you cannot "sell back" to the Army upon retirement, I don't understand why anybody takes terminal leave. It is certainly not beneficial from a financial standpoint. For example, let's say you have 60 days of leave when you retire. If you take terminal leave, the Army continues to pay your normal pay and benefits. If you sell back the leave, you get paid 60 days base pay and the period you would have been on terminal leave (60 days), you also get paid your retirement pay (for example 75% of your base pay after 30); in effect getting 175% of your base pay (100% paid out plus 75% retirement), rather than 100%, for that 60 days. Just makes no sense to me.

Response by Capt Brandon Charters made Sep 10 at 2014 11:27 PM

Capt Brandon Charters — Wed, 10 Sep 2014 23:27:09 -0400

COL Jonas Vogelhut - Was this an initial phone screen or formal phone interview #1? It seems really strange for that salary question to come up so soon. Looks like you handled it very well though. I've had experiences like this. Recruiters without a military familiarization typically like our work ethic, motivation, and leadership, but don't understand much of our technical or operational experience. This requires a significant amount of translation before the call to prep your answers in a way they can grasp. Acronyms are out the door for these calls and you will need to really lay out your work as if you are talking to a close civilian friend or family member that's interested in your job. You know he/she can't fully grasp all of it, but give it your best shot and ask if what you said makes sense or if you need to clarify a statement regarding your past jobs. Remain positive and honest no matter what (like you have) and know your audience as much as you can before the call. LinkedIn is a great tool for gathering intel on a recruiter before hand so you can better relate experiences. Hope this helps!

Response by COL Jonas Vogelhut made Sep 12 at 2014 4:47 PM

COL Jonas Vogelhut — Fri, 12 Sep 2014 16:47:33 -0400

Well, the interview was not as successful as I hoped. Of course, they did not have the courtesy to inform me....just an update on their website. I know it is their loss....but it is frustrating nevertheless.

In the meanwhile, I attended the Corporate Gray job fair in Springfield, VA yesterday. About 50 stations, maybe 10 of interest (I like the local police and teachers, but don't want to become one.) Of the ten booths, one actually cared! Hooah! Of course, it was a retired Marine Officer. Most of the others paid lip service, asked if I submitted my resume on their website, and said that they were recruiting for one specialty only (cyber security), but other recruiters might look at my online submission if they had needs.

Next job fair is Fort Meade on the 17th. See you there!

Response by SPC Robert Bobo made May 9 at 2020 4:10 PM

SPC Robert Bobo — Sat, 09 May 2020 16:10:56 -0400

I had numerous corporate recruiters on the ground in local market , the ones focused on military were all former military, in fact I encouraged my team to seek out former military recruiters for recruiting , unfortunately over the past couple years many large organizations have transitioned to centralized computer based recruiting and "software" is making decisions purely on boxes checked based on qualifications and job discription set up in program. A good local market manager or HR specialist should be spot checking the applicants disqualified by computer program. My top performers over my 41 years never LOOKED THE BEST ON PAPER , I think these computer programs aren't identifing the best people, that takes a live person who knows the position being filled