How do you as a member of the Armed Forces of America follow a Commander in Chief that has consistently lied?

2016-10-30T13:40:50-04:00

If elected President (Hillary Clinton), how do the members of our Armed Forces follow the leadership of a Commander in Chief that has lied to the American People.

How did you feel when the former Commander in Chief (Bill Clinton) lied to the American Public after committing Adultery in the White House? By the way if it were any of you in uniform it would be punishable under Articel 134 of the UCMJ!

No matter who is the President (Commander in Chief) shouldn't they be held to a higher standard then those who serve at the pleassure of the President or Commander in Chief?

There are many other Commander-in-Chiefs that have lied to the American People as well. Will we ever get an honest Commander-in-Chief to serve this country?

Forget about the election and comment on the facts please.

Response by SSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 30 at 2016 1:42 PM

2016-10-30T13:42:39-04:00

It is embarrassing.. COL Mikel J. Burroughs

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 30 at 2016 1:44 PM

2016-10-30T13:44:21-04:00

It's just as bad as lying to get into war

Response by SFC George Smith made Oct 30 at 2016 1:46 PM

2016-10-30T13:46:20-04:00

used to be had a clause in the oath ...the Phrase " legal ...ethical ... and Moral orders... of the Commanders Over Me..."
it was inserted after the "My Lai incident"Interest in Vietnam... and the prosecution Of Lt William Calley
I noticed the Last time i was given the oath in 1996 it was shortened back to Just "Legal orders" but then Bill Clinton was in Office... and that would have been a conflict of Intrest...

Response by SFC Joseph Weber made Oct 30 at 2016 1:49 PM

2016-10-30T13:49:02-04:00

I think it's a sad that this is the best we can do. Either way we are getting a liar. I wish it had been Bush vs Biden. That would have been a good match and a decent campaign season.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 30 at 2016 1:54 PM

2016-10-30T13:54:08-04:00

COL Mikel J. Burroughs, I feel the same way I did when Westmoreland and Johnson lied to the American people to keep a war going for profit, and splitting our Nation into.

Response by CPT Jack Durish made Oct 30 at 2016 1:54 PM

2016-10-30T13:54:27-04:00

One of the disadvantages of studying law and never practicing it is that you understand it but haven't lost your respect for it (as many practicing attorneys become so focused on the business of law that they forget about ethics). Thus, I know the word "fiduciary"

fi·du·ci·ar·y
fəˈdo͞oSHēˌerē,-SHərē/Submit
adjectiveLAW
1.
involving trust, especially with regard to the relationship between a trustee and a beneficiary.
"the company has a fiduciary duty to shareholders"
noun
1.
a trustee.

...and when a person violates a fiduciary relationship, the law rightfully demands greater punishment than might otherwise be expected.

Sadly, We the People don't hold our elected officials to those standards and one consequence is that our children are commanded by such people as the Clintons

Response by COL Mikel J. Burroughs made Oct 30 at 2016 1:57 PM

2016-10-30T13:57:50-04:00

Here is a great video that shows lie after lie - unbelievable. This really puts what a great Commander-in-Chief we could have after this November 8, 2016. This is my personal opinion and may not be the opinion of others! I'm sure this is a bias video and will be received as such, but it does bring to light a number of lies. There are many other Commander-in-Chiefs that have lied to the American People as well. Will we ever get an honest Commander-in-Chief to serve this country? You be the judge in the end!

https://youtu.be/-dY77j6uBHI

Hillary Clinton lying for 13 minutes straight.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=82BqNNa9BfI&index=3&list=PLDdmlbMdhsamMQxvjng5povtUAtvH3YtK CLICK HERE FOR OUR NEW VIDEO SERIES: DONALD TRUMP IS THE BEST Hil...

Response by 1LT Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 30 at 2016 1:59 PM

2016-10-30T13:59:06-04:00

I don't know a politician who has never lied, republicans or democrats. No doubt these two candidates this cycle are probably worst than previous ones.

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 30 at 2016 2:01 PM

2016-10-30T14:01:49-04:00

We have no choice but to follow her leadership, for the short time she is able to lead, and maybe she will resign like Nixon had to when he knew Congress would have no issues impeaching him due to (note the parallels HRC..some apply to her and some to RMN) 1. Lying on documentation. 2. Lying to Gold Star Family members 3. Lying in correspondence 4. Obstruction of justice ( breaking laptops/blackberrys having professional computer erasing of her personal hard drive same as missing time on Nixon whitehouse tapes) 5. Deep throat is now FBI with the never- ending 'Weiner' story from her closest aide who had copies of other e-mails that were also erased and Wikileaks/FSB.

Response by SSG Michael Hartsfield made Oct 30 at 2016 2:03 PM

2016-10-30T14:03:07-04:00

Just like you can't chose who your leaders will be in military, you can't chose what orders you'll follow from the CinC solely based on your opinion of them and, just like you can't ignore the orders of a leader you don't like, the same goes for the President. The way you feel about them is irrelevant. You are still bound by your Oath of Enlistment to "follow the orders of the President of the United States and the Officers appointed over you." It doesn't have a clause that states "unless you feel that person lacks moral fiber or you feel they suck." COL Mikel J. Burroughs

Response by LTC Stephen F. made Oct 30 at 2016 2:30 PM

2016-10-30T14:30:31-04:00

Service members are obligated by oath to follow the lawful orders of those appointed over them. It doesn't matter what the character of the POTUS is. The obligation is primarily to uphold and defend the constitution of the United States COL Mikel J. Burroughs
If Hillary is elected it will be further proof that God is judging this nation and collectively we have been found wanting. Far too many place their trust in government to fulfill their needs.
God is patient to a point with each of us.
Hillary's conscience has been seared for a long time which is why she can nonchalantly talk about partial-birth induced-abortion as though it were a harmless procedure. Driving surgical scissors into the soft skull of an emerging baby and the sucking out the brains so the limp body drops out.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 30 at 2016 2:41 PM

2016-10-30T14:41:42-04:00

I just hope whoever gets elected does the right job for the best interests for the people of this country. A politician is a politician and all for the best interests of their career. Honestly we need more President s who are Veterans like Theodore Roosevelt, JFK and Eisenhower (who saw the corperations and their need for power).

Response by LTC Stephen C. made Oct 30 at 2016 2:42 PM

2016-10-30T14:42:19-04:00

All I can say is that I'm glad I'm retired & that HRC will not be my CinC, if elected, COL Mikel J. Burroughs.

Response by SSG Chris Castillo made Oct 30 at 2016 3:07 PM

2016-10-30T15:07:12-04:00

SM's don't play politics we follow the commander in chief's orders because that is our duty

Response by Sgt Wayne Wood made Oct 30 at 2016 3:16 PM

2016-10-30T15:16:51-04:00

Been doing it since at least FDR

Response by LCDR Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 30 at 2016 3:44 PM

2016-10-30T15:44:44-04:00

Thankfully I retired long before this election cycle. IF I were on active duty now, I would have to decide whether to retired or leave the service. I could never serve under such a "President".

Response by Cpl George Crab made Oct 30 at 2016 3:46 PM

2016-10-30T15:46:25-04:00

As little as possible.

Response by MSgt Michael Bischoff made Oct 30 at 2016 3:58 PM

2016-10-30T15:58:32-04:00

Somehow it duplicated!!

Response by SSgt Terry P. made Oct 30 at 2016 4:02 PM

2016-10-30T16:02:44-04:00

COL Mikel J. Burroughs I expect it would be so demoralizing to some,they would quit the service.

Response by MSgt Michael Bischoff made Oct 30 at 2016 4:15 PM

2016-10-30T16:15:58-04:00

You must also remember the President has never or ever should be governed by the UCMJ, if that was the case it would be similar to martial law. Everyone under military laws!!

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 30 at 2016 4:18 PM

2016-10-30T16:18:07-04:00

Exactly, how to follow a total liar like Donald Trump? Hold your nose, and push back on ANYTHING that looks illegal.

Response by PVT Mark Brown made Oct 30 at 2016 4:40 PM

2016-10-30T16:40:03-04:00

Our CinC is our commander and the UCMJ requires our obedience to CinC's orders. It is not the duty of any single member or group of members to decide to not follow an order is called Treason. As a populace we must rely on the power of the vote to make corrections. That is just the bottom line, that is how our constitution was originally written. I am afraid of what we will have to look forward to under Hillary Clinton, she is no dove, she will have us in full blown war before she has seen 12 months in office. Donald Trump is crazy and has the propensity to drive off the abyss into war but if it came down to making a choice my gut feeling is that The Donald would be less likely to take that plunge. So, who am I going to vote for..........?

Response by PVT Mark Brown made Oct 30 at 2016 4:46 PM

2016-10-30T16:46:06-04:00

Just a further note: Yes we can and must expect our CinC to be held to a MUCH higher standard but just try to enforce that. Form the top down, E-1 through 0-11 each rank holds the next lower rank to a higher standard while expecting too much from those above them with greater rank. Anyone agree with that?

Response by SGT Damaso V Santana made Oct 30 at 2016 4:51 PM

2016-10-30T16:51:12-04:00

Defend the Constitution against all enemies, Foreign and Domestic.

And yes Damn right they should be held even to a higher standard.

Response by PO1 James Campbell made Oct 30 at 2016 5:36 PM

2016-10-30T17:36:03-04:00

Before all this technological mumbo jumbo, we had to go on faith and real journalism to even accuse our CiC of falsehoods. We'll never truly know about the past. They have done what they thought was best for the country. It just seems like that's not the case anymore. Maybe, I'm just old school.

Response by SSG Warren Swan made Oct 30 at 2016 5:50 PM

2016-10-30T17:50:55-04:00

Real easy. I'm a SSG, who takes orders from those above me, who in the NCO support can be SFC - CSM. Simple. I also take orders from those in the Officer ranks from O1-O10. Really simple. I didn't add WO1-CW5 being good luck finding one to get an order from. I promised this country that I would follow the orders of those appointed above me, and if I was given the ability to pick and choose who I followed and who I blew off, I would not be a Soldier. That is not what we do. Any Soldier that can honestly say he picked and chose what orders to follow from a person appointed above them is a dead faced liar. You don't have to like it, you only have two options DO IT or loose rank and GTFO. See how not doing what your are told works as a civilian. This was said if Trump was elected. If Trump was elected President, I would do whatever the hell he says as long as it doesn't violate the constitution (and if I know that JAG would've long knew that and informed the GO's not to have us do that), the law of war, and the Geneva Convention. Mopping the Sahara Desert is NOT an unlawful order. Dumb as hell yes, but legit. Buffing the Sahara is also stupid, but I'd have to check with the Mafia on the amount of Johnstons paste wax I'd need to get a good shine.

I don't care who the President is. I do care who is to my left and right, my forward and rear wearing green.

Response by Capt Seid Waddell made Oct 30 at 2016 5:54 PM

2016-10-30T17:54:03-04:00

You have to respect the office even if you don't respect the office holder.

Response by 1SG Al Brown made Oct 30 at 2016 6:15 PM

2016-10-30T18:15:01-04:00

They all lie. Some not purposely, some only when their mouth is open. I served for many. I was proud to serve the honest CINC, no matter how painful the truth was or where I was sent. I was ashamed to serve the dishonest CINC, but shame has no meaning in a bureaucracy.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 30 at 2016 7:09 PM

2016-10-30T19:09:45-04:00

If either are elected it will be an unfortunate event. The presidential race is little more than a circus...but that aside.

I swore an oath, and have a duty to perform regardless. I'll do my job lawfully, and morally...that's all.

Response by SGM Steve Wettstein made Oct 30 at 2016 7:18 PM

2016-10-30T19:18:31-04:00

COL Mikel J. Burroughs I am definitely not for Clinton, but some of these responses from both sides, sound like some people need to be wearing some tin foil hats.

Response by MSgt Mark Bucher made Oct 30 at 2016 7:59 PM

2016-10-30T19:59:12-04:00

I'm so sick of all the election ranting and raving that goes on in here. Don't really want to talk about politics or religion in an open forum

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 30 at 2016 8:23 PM

2016-10-30T20:23:00-04:00

Beg for May 31, 2020 to hurry up so I can retire.

Response by LTC Tom Jones made Oct 30 at 2016 8:24 PM

2016-10-30T20:24:28-04:00

Interesting conversation yesterday with a close relative of a top echelon member of the FBI during Whitewater. Have every confidence the guy was telling it like it is (was) when he said the FBI held back rather than kick off a Constitutional crisis by indicting a sitting FLOTUS. Evidence against HRC was compelling/damning.

Response by COL Jon Thompson made Oct 30 at 2016 8:26 PM

2016-10-30T20:26:43-04:00

It's about the greater good of serving the Nation, not the President. We take an oath to support and defend the Constitution. As long as the President is duly elected by the people IAW the Constitution, we are obligated to obey his/her lawful orders. The military has always done that and will continue to do that regardless of whom is elected.

Response by SGM Steve Wettstein made Oct 30 at 2016 8:39 PM

2016-10-30T20:39:53-04:00

If I was still in this is how I would do it.

"I, Stephen John Wettstein, do solemnly swear that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. So help me God."

If they are unfit to do the job of POTUS, it is the job of Congress to handle it. Not the Military.

Response by CW3 Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 30 at 2016 10:41 PM

2016-10-30T22:41:51-04:00

Same as always...

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 30 at 2016 11:29 PM

2016-10-30T23:29:26-04:00

personal feelings get shoved into the back of the closet while professionalism struts around the room in proper fashion.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 30 at 2016 11:29 PM

2016-10-30T23:29:43-04:00

personal feelings get shoved into the back of the closet while professionalism struts around the room in proper fashion as it should be.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 31 at 2016 3:27 AM

2016-10-31T03:27:14-04:00

U.S. Code Title 18, Section 2017

(a) Whoever willfully and unlawfully conceals, removes, mutilates, obliterates, or destroys, or attempts to do so, or, with intent to do so takes and carries away any record, proceeding, map, book, paper, document, or other thing, filed or deposited with any clerk or officer of any court of the United States, or in any public office, or with any judicial or public officer of the United States, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than three years, or both.

(b) Whoever, having the custody of any such record, proceeding, map, book, document, paper, or other thing, willfully and unlawfully conceals, removes, mutilates, obliterates, falsifies, or destroys the same, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than three years, or both; and shall forfeit his office and be disqualified from holding any office under the United States. As used in this subsection, the term ?office? does not include the office held by any person as a retired officer of the Armed Forces of the United States.

There is no argument, she is NOT eligible to run and her presidency would be illegal.

Response by SGT David A. 'Cowboy' Groth made Oct 31 at 2016 6:51 AM

2016-10-31T06:51:09-04:00

Honestly, I'm glad that I went IRR when I did. If Killary gets the presidency, God save our troops.

Response by CPO Bill Canada made Oct 31 at 2016 10:33 AM

2016-10-31T10:33:48-04:00

They should be held to much higher standard. I am thankful that I am retired and do not have to follow anyone, especially a half assed commander in chief that is supposed to be setting the example/standard.

Response by SPC Kevin Ford made Oct 31 at 2016 10:38 AM

2016-10-31T10:38:09-04:00

Both candidates have lied as indicated by Politifact so we are going to get someone we know who lies as POTUS, full stop (BTW, the one that does it most consistently is not Hillary):

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/lists/people/comparing-hillary-clinton-donald-trump-truth-o-met/

Of course this is nothing new for the country and the military. The standards we hold elected officials to is expressed through the electoral process. If we reward lying and push them through, then we are going to get people who lie, as that apparently isn't what we are valuing in an election.

When it comes to non elected and non appointed government employees (including service members) we ironically hold them to a higher standard.

Is it fair? Nope. Do people with money and position get treated differently from those without? Yup. Has it always been that way? Yup. If you want to look at to how that happened I believe we need to ask ourselves how those two ended up being the most likely candidates to win the election in the first place and a lot of that blame falls squarely on us as citizens.

PolitiFact | Comparing Hillary Clinton, Donald Trump on the Truth-O-Meter

PolitiFact.com is a project of the Tampa Bay Times to help you find the truth in Washington and the Obama presidency.

Response by LTC Joe Likar made Oct 31 at 2016 10:56 AM

2016-10-31T10:56:02-04:00

Unfortunately, we took an oath to obey the orders of those appointed over us. We need not be in agreement with that person but they are the choice of the American people. I feel that the higher you go the more ethical and professional you must become. Some of the Presidents we have had may have lied to accomplish their perceived mission. On of our greatest, Abraham Lincoln, lied when he stated the Civil War was about slavery in order to incite Northerners and reach enlistment goals. So many of our POTUSs have lied but the severity of the lie is in the minds of the public.

Response by Sgt William Straub Jr. made Oct 31 at 2016 10:57 AM

2016-10-31T10:57:03-04:00

Retire. Finish your term of enlistment. I have a son who wanted to re-enlist in the Navy. He couldn't in good conscience re-up with Obama as CinC. So he left the Navy he loved rather than have to violated the oath he took.

Response by 1SG Dennis Jones made Oct 31 at 2016 11:08 AM

2016-10-31T11:08:01-04:00

I don't like HRC not voting for her , if I was still on active duty & she got elected I would have no choice but to follow her orders wouldn't like it but I still took the oath

Response by Cpl Justin Goolsby made Oct 31 at 2016 11:15 AM

2016-10-31T11:15:37-04:00

Honestly, it scares me. In my lifetime I've seen skeletons galore come out of politicians closets, but it wasn't until I enlisted where I've been able to sort through the gossip and the legitimate issues. I could ignore every single one of Hillary's scandals. I could ignore Bill's deviancies. What I can't ignore is her mishandling of classified information. If anything was a bigger security threat, then it would be that, and her lying about it does not make me feel safer.

Honestly, I don't know how any active service member could follow her. How would we feel if the information that got leaked got one of our brothers or sisters killed??? She could have mishandled troop positions... flight paths...

Yes, the President should be held to a higher standard because he/she is representing us on a global scale. Let's not forget our media coverage isn't exactly secret. Would foreign dignitaries trust the people we elect in office knowing the scandals that are attached to them.

Honestly, I would hope that we eventually get an honest Commander in Chief. It's a position of respect and should be treated as such. I remember every day of my enlistment, I wondered if I was going to be told I wasn't good enough and to go home. That's the level of seriousness these politicians should be taking with their jobs. Every day they should be worried about whether or not We The People are going to be asking for their heads on pikes. Not just try to placate us when it comes to Election Year.

Response by PO3 Steven Sherrill made Oct 31 at 2016 11:23 AM

2016-10-31T11:23:44-04:00

COL Mikel J. Burroughs Sadly, a lying, cheating, stealing, unqualified, unremarkable Commander in Chief is the norm, not the exception. The simple answer to your question is that while the two major party candidates are exponentially more developed assclowns, they are still similar assclowns to their predecessors, which means the military will continue to function with business as usual.

Response by LTC Jesse Edwards made Oct 31 at 2016 11:30 AM

2016-10-31T11:30:57-04:00

This is both simple and complicated.
On the simple side, members of the Armed Forces swear to follow the lawful orders of the Commander-in-Chief and senior officers without regard to politics.
On the complex side, the majority of people in the military come to accept and embrace the military ethos of integrity and fairness. When the leader cannot lead by example, the moral authority of the institution decays. How much decay? One wouldn't know until the institution is put under stress.

Response by PFC David Lane made Oct 31 at 2016 11:33 AM

2016-10-31T11:33:48-04:00

I notice everyone on here talking about the oath. Did you all forget about the part where it states to "protect against all enemies foreign and domestic". Does that not include corruption in our government? If our leaders don't abide by the laws they enforce then we can not expect the citizens to.

Response by CH (COL) Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 31 at 2016 12:10 PM

2016-10-31T12:10:42-04:00

Because you MUST unless her orders violate law. Posse Comitatus keeps us out of domestic law enforcement, so POTUS can't use us against Americans. At what point does someone become an enemy, domestic?

Response by SFC Randy Purham made Oct 31 at 2016 12:49 PM

2016-10-31T12:49:40-04:00

It would be difficult - thus leading me to subsequently retiring...

Response by SPC Makissa Lewis made Oct 31 at 2016 12:52 PM

2016-10-31T12:52:14-04:00

Which candidate the male or female one? Because, they both lied.

Response by PVT Mark Brown made Oct 31 at 2016 1:11 PM

2016-10-31T13:11:42-04:00

I have an idea that I am better off not memorializing in writing. No matter which lesser of the two evils takes up residence in the White House come January 20, 2017 we are all in for one hell of a ride. When I think of the negative possibilities of both candidate my sack shrivels and my stomach buzzes, kinda like the feeling before the first jump. I keep running these scenarios through my head and seem to see very scary solutions. Personally I think they are both crazy liars, cheats and thieves. Quite frankly, between the new draconian California (you better get ready to turn 'em in) "gun safety" and the potential of Clintons anti-gun agenda. (Wonder if she would be in favor is disarming the Secret Service - me thins not.) Several years ago when some of these new laws were starting to hit the books here in the land of Moon Beam Brown I secured a Federal Firearms License - type 3. When ammo was all but impossible to purchase (at any price) I started a side business of reloading handgun and long gun ammo for profit. If this new ammo bill becomes law in California it will become a felony for me to sell face to face with going through the process of securing an Ammunition Dealer License. By the time it all said and done I will have over a grand into license fees. For some reason that I just can not wrap my head around ammunition sales registration through a licensed dealer will reduce crime. What? Did I hear that right? Bet you sweet bippy that is the current propaganda being spewed all over us by the "liberal" left gun grabbers. What they have not taken into account is that just about anywhere one resides in California you are on and hour or two from Nevada, Arizona, Oregon or Utah where the government has not flipped out. So what do you all think will happen after this election. You know Hillary persists in claiming she is not a gun grabber - I guess that is aimed at the folks with very short memories. Does anyone recall this statement "Oct 28, 2015 - And when Obama says, as he did Tuesday in Chicago, I'm not going to “take everyone's guns away,” that means he's coming for them. " This is from Brietbart. We all know about the degree of honesty in Obamaisims, we have lived and are still living whit most of them. I know this is not a political form and I will, therefore, STFU now. Comments PLEASE!

Response by SrA Chris "Shadow" McGee made Oct 31 at 2016 1:40 PM

2016-10-31T13:40:17-04:00

Unfortunately, the oath we all took says we will obey. We may not like it and in this scenario can hardly trust the decisions, but as honorable men and women we will obey. Up until enough people above us realize the actions are incorrect, preferably before we lose too many lives, and the CIC is relieved of her duties. I'm not saying she WILL make bad choices, but as a confirmed liar I know every decision she makes will need to be taken into consideration before being acted upon. As much as I miss being on active duty, I am glad that I will not be serving under either possible CIC after this election. Between a liar and a hothead with not tact or diplomacy, I see hard times ahead for our troops.

Response by Anita Nowocin made Oct 31 at 2016 1:57 PM

2016-10-31T13:57:25-04:00

Unfortunately, both candidates are liars. It's who do you trust and believe the most. All presidents stretch the truth as they often tell people what they want to hear. Do you want to go to war? Who will keep America safe? Who will really do something to make positive changes in the VA system? I often agree to disagree.

Response by SPC Jill Drushal, RN, MA made Oct 31 at 2016 1:59 PM

2016-10-31T13:59:08-04:00

Of course, politicians lie. That is the nature of the political game. Everyone has an agenda. This includes news agencies. They cherry-pick their facts to further their agendas. One of the best examples of this is the differences between how the Chicago Sun Times and the Chicago Tribune will report the same story. The agenda of the Sun Times parallels that of the Democratic Party. That of the Tribune closely follows the GOP.

George Washington set a precedent at the end of the American Revolution when he resigned his command to the President of the Continental Congress. From that day forward, the military would always be controlled by a civilian Commander-in-Chief. When the Continental Congress dissolved in favor of the Federal government that it created, the President also became Commander-in-Chief of the Armed Forces. However, the day-to-day command and control of the military falls to the Joint Chiefs of Staff, the civilian secretaries for each branch and the Secretary of Defense. The CinC only gets involved if there is going to be a declaration of war or a major deployment. Even at that, the President doesn’t actually declare war. From the time he decides to go to war, he has 72 hours to get a formal declaration of war from Congress.

As for following the orders of a CinC who lies, the answer is simple. It is not about the person; it is about the office itself. It doesn't matter who holds the office. Service members follow that individual’s orders. Signing an enlistment contract or accepting a commission to serve in the US military obligates one to follow the orders of the NCOs and officers appointed over that service member. We don’t get to pick and choose. If an order is lawful, it must be followed. Agreement with it is irrelevant. The only recourse for disagreement with a Commander-in-Chief is the individual’s right to vote.

Response by SPC Dee Bartlett made Oct 31 at 2016 5:13 PM

2016-10-31T17:13:26-04:00

I'm still stuck on the premise that we actually think politicians are capable of "truthing." The higher the political rank, the deeper the lies.

Response by LTC Stephen F. made Oct 31 at 2016 5:38 PM

2016-10-31T17:38:52-04:00

LTC Stephen C. - Thanks my friend for providing the US Constitutional article which clearly states "the President of the United States is commander in chief of the United States Armed Forces." As retired former service-members the commander-in-chief has no significant relationship to us beyond what any other citizen has.
It doesn't matter who occupies the White House now or next January. If HRC or Trump becomes POTUS the service members are obligated to recognize the POTUS as their CINC but discharged veterans and retirees to do.
Recently too many people have bowed the knee instead of paying homage to the symbols of this nation such as the national Anthem or the US Flag. That is their choice in the land of the free. Many of us risked our lives to defend people whose views we vehemently disagreed with.

Response by MSG Don Burt made Oct 31 at 2016 6:28 PM

2016-10-31T18:28:59-04:00

Right or wrong, if she is elected, I would have to obey my superiors until the point where it goes
against a good conscience, good thought and then a second opinion would arise. But, it's up to those who really know the difference between right and wrong and decide on Nov 8 so we won't have to worry about serving a liar, hypocrite etc. etc.

Response by Sgt Joseph Baker made Oct 31 at 2016 9:01 PM

2016-10-31T21:01:22-04:00

Well, for those of us that have been paying attention to what politicians say vs what they do finds no surprises in this video. HRC has just taken it to an entirely different level. People that have paid attention and care will vote against her. Those who haven't paid attention, or have paid attention but don't care will vote for her. They attack Trump for vulgar speech which truth be known nearly all men have engaged in and most of the women as well. Trump is accused of unwanted advances and touching, which are improper, but WJC has been accused of forcible rape for decades and it didn't bother the Dems one bit. Neither did they care that HRC said all rape victims should be believed but then slut-shamed WJCs accusers. She claims to have worked for decades to protect children, but works the hardest at making sure they get murdered in the doctor's office in our country to our shame. Everything she does or says is a contradiction. As shown in this video, even many of the mainstream media have brought it up but they ultlimately let her off the hook. Here is what members of our Armed Forces can expect from HRC as CIC, she will break all the rules but throw you in jail if you do. She will create disasters and will throw you under the bus.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 31 at 2016 9:10 PM

2016-10-31T21:10:45-04:00

Yes it is hard to image trusting a Presidential candidate that lies with every word. Thats why I can not vote for TRUMP.

Response by 1SG Cameron M. Wesson made Oct 31 at 2016 10:45 PM

2016-10-31T22:45:51-04:00

Team.

I find the questions in the dilemma above very easy to answer.

and

First one... how can I serve a "Commander in Chief that has consistently lied"? Easy... My honor is my own. I take it and give it away on my own accord. I swore an oath when I enlisted and when I became a Dept of Army employee... that is my oath to the country... and to the constitution and to the offices. The CinC will have to answer for their misdeeds in the history books... and the life hereafter.

Second one... "Should the CinC be held to a higher standard"? Easy. Yes they should be held to a higher standard.... break... they are not subject to the UCMJ. That being said, I have known many leaders in uniform to lie... I have myself on occasion. That didn't make them any less admirable... nor did they fail to take care of their charges. Sun Tzu also tells us that "The Commander stands for the virtues of wisdom, sincerely, benevolence, courage and strictness" don't see "not lying" in there... as there is wisdom to providing an untruth on occasions.

Third questions....Will we ever get a honest CinC... Easy. Absolutely not.... and this country would eat them alive.

Peace out

Response by PO3 Rod Arnold made Nov 1 at 2016 1:04 AM

2016-11-01T01:04:52-04:00

Remember the oath we all took, enemies both foreign and Domestic!!!

Response by MSgt Michael Bischoff made Nov 1 at 2016 7:00 AM

2016-11-01T07:00:19-04:00

http://www.alternet.org/culture/7-biggest-liars-presidential-history
Here you go, but we followed!!
I will not quit if Trump becomes president, scared but not quit. Quitting would be like giving up.
I worked through some of these lies, but we are Americans a we shall persevere..

The 7 Biggest Liars in Presidential History

Lies are sometimes necessary evils when presidents want to get something accomplished.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 1 at 2016 11:23 AM

2016-11-01T11:23:50-04:00

You don't

Response by Lt Col Scott Shuttleworth made Nov 1 at 2016 3:54 PM

2016-11-01T15:54:09-04:00

How do you as a member of the Armed Forces of America follow a Commander in Chief that has consistently lied? The answer for me is simple. I took an oath. I don't like following a liar because it is directly against our core values but while we are in uniform we don't have that luxury. I followed that oath as long as I was in uniform...even with a cigar smoking dress staining president was in office. I had Airmen to protect and lead and if I wasn't there to filter they may have gotten run over. I had to ensure the big picture of Americas safety, my families safety and security, was protected and sometimes that means swallowing crow with tabasco to get it down. If someone got to the point where they couldn't then they can separate. We follow the orders of the office not the individual. The presidency is much bigger than one individual. If we really break it down we are following the orders of congress and all those liars as well as they are the ones that authorize and fund military spending and action. The individual should be held to a higher standard but unfortunately they aren't and no, I don't believe we will ever get a fully honest CINC. Politicians will kiss a baby and when the parents turn their back they will steal their lollipop.

Response by PVT William Bresch made Nov 1 at 2016 6:03 PM

2016-11-01T18:03:05-04:00

How do you as a member of the Armed Forces of America follow a Commander in Chief that has consistently lied?

hmm, thats a tough one, ok I guess it falls in line with,

I'm with the government and I'm here to help you.

Welcome to the United States Government in Action, al lday, everyday ...

like the CIA say's,

it's not how you tell the story it's, HOW YOU TELL , THE STORY !!! LOL

Response by PVT William Bresch made Nov 1 at 2016 6:03 PM

2016-11-01T18:03:46-04:00

How do you as a member of the Armed Forces of America follow a Commander in Chief that has consistently lied?

WELCOME TO AMERICA !!!

Response by Capt Walter Miller made Nov 10 at 2016 8:58 AM

2016-11-10T08:58:34-05:00

I am SO GLAD that Hillary Clinton is now locked out of having access to the levers of power. We dodged a huge bullet.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 17 at 2016 12:12 PM

2016-11-17T12:12:48-05:00

Calling someone a lying politician is redundant. It is in the nature of politicians to tell people whatever they want to hear, the more successful the politicians the more skilled they are at lying. The closest in recent memory this nation has come to an honest politician at the national level was probably President Carter.

I don't believe honesty ranks among the top five traits Americans expect from a President. A President does have to be likeable, they have to appear strong, they have to be articulate, they have to have enough charisma to sway fence sitters and Americans need to believe the President is committed to their best interests.

Response by SP5 Dennis Loberger made Jun 9 at 2018 6:07 AM

2018-06-09T06:07:36-04:00

If still in the military, my response visibility is to follow orders as long as they are legal. Looking at the picture is interesting since it could just as easily be of our current President. His personal battle with the truth is at a level with hers.Politicians' allegiance to the truth is minimal. While we may never have a President with a level of honesty we would like to see we certainly can do better than her own r the m an we elected