Posted on Dec 2, 2013
LTC Instructor
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Obviously, the system has to be a balance between fairness to the service-member and effectiveness of the force, but is that balance properly struck currently? 

How much discretion should the chain of command be allowed to exercise?

How do you manage it in your own unit? How would you manage it differently?
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Responses: 3
SFC James Baber
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No it is isn't, as I think it is geared towards helping with the downsizing element currently in place.


It is also political in the way some of the ratings and documentation is done for future possible claims against the government.

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LTC Instructor
LTC (Join to see)
11 y
Thanks for the response SFC Baber! I would add that, in my experience, the system works very slowly. It can work fast, but under the current structure MEB/PEB is not the weapon-of-choice for downsizing.

Your comment about future claims is spot on. Could you elaborate on the political aspect? As with any system of its kind, it will have some level of frivolous claims, but it isn't as though Service comes without the physical and mental tolls on the SMs.
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SFC James Baber
SFC James Baber
11 y

Sir,

While I was injured from some combat related injuries during the 90s, I was attached to BAMC BDE and worked in the PAO office dealing with congressional's and other "claims" towards the hospital and other entities within GPRMC. Lets just say I saw plenty of paperwork that reflected the disparaging differences in rank and positions for injured SMs within the system. It may have changed or been caught up over the years, but I still saw many of the same deep differences of documentation for injured Soldiers from OIF and OEF, when I began my retirement physical process a few years back, quite a bit of paperwork has disappeared from my medical records within a year of my retirement. I had copies and originals when I went to my physical and subsequent VA part II and was asked where I had gotten the paperwork I had, and told them I was smart enough to have copies long ago to include some original documents and supplied my maintained records with copies, the personnel involved were slightly tongue tied when I also provided certified copies of missing documents as well.


During many deployments over the years, my medical records were lost 4 times, and had to be reconstructed from scratch, I had smartly made copies numerous times over the years and maintained originals of injuries and LOD investigations for the rebuilding processes, so I have seen and felt the 1st hand political issues.


And the MEB/PEB is being utilized for the downsizing process, I live near an installation and have a great deal of contacts within the medical facility there and have on numerous occasions had discussions on this topic and have been informed directly from the personnel that are part of the process that any type of profile is being looked at for processing now even P2s, and even personnel that came in with medical waivers are being looked at as well, so it may not be a weapon of choice, but it is being used as a weapon of usage.

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SPC Michael Martinez
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Edited 9 y ago
The answer to these questions lies in the answer of the following question: "What is the cost to repair a Soldier that will need to be repaired again compared to Building a new Soldier to replace that old Soldier?" The old Soldiers should be retained as long as the benefits outweigh the cost. In the end, we are numbers.
I say this with much trepidation.
When a Soldier can no longer do his duties effectively in Uniform, if the call of duty continues to resound, civil service should be considered. Either through Training or Maintenance of our Fighting Force.
An interesting point, all Soldiers are trained in elements of argument; therefore, qualified to be civil leaders (Politics).
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LTC Instructor
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SPC Michael Martinez, I appreciate your comment and I hope we can discuss.

With a Service-member who has become injured (permanent profile) we know what we are getting. When "Building a new Soldier," we are taking a risk in an uncertain asset. There are transaction costs on both sides there, but I cannot answer the question in the coldly numeric way that you do. I think it must be a matter of discretion, with an array of factors: what MOS; how much TIS; what other skills; ability to transfer to a new MOS; responsibilities of the grade? Remember, sometimes senior Soldiers get injured too, and their costs can be massive; training a new Private is cheap compared to the cost of caring for an old Soldier who continues in the Service. We are numbers (everyone is replaceable), but we are also more. A leader who values quantity over quality may be better termed a manager.

I'm also dubious of the proposition that all Soldiers are trained in argument. In what way? A quick perusal of RallyPoint shows many instances of fallacious or faulty reasoning. In fact, I think the average military experience teaches one to be confrontational and stubborn which are the antitheses of reason.

I do think we are better cut out for civil service than are pure civilians. Not because we are better Citizens or arguers, but because of experience in and dedication to public service. None of that means anything without a willingness to learn about the political landscape (legal, historical, bureaucratic, etc.).
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SFC First Sergeant
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I think if properly utilized the profiling system could work well as it is laid out currently. One improvement would be no BS Follow up and assessments.  I have been fortunate to work with my Doc to improve on my profile with less limiting restrictions in order for me to conduct self evaluations.  Essentially a gentlemens agreement that I provide accurate and honest feedback.. I think the larger problem with profiles is it is too easy to ride them and not honestly work on strengthening, recovering or improving event to the point of stabilization in some cases.
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