Hollywood image v real image - Are Veterans as "broken" as they show?

2015-04-27T12:08:52-04:00

This past weekend, I was catching up on my favorite TV shows and an ad for an episode of "NCIS: Los Angeles" came on. What I saw really made me upset. The preview of the upcoming episode was that there was a Veteran who returned home from war only to pick up a rifle and target civilians in and around the city.

While I understand that TV needs to sell and all that. But what is making me upset is the number of TV shows going to this plot over and over again. All these do is set back all our efforts to show Veterans as the strong and driven future leaders that we are.

What is the point of continuously showing Veterans as these crazed, gun carrying crazy people unable to transition into the community? Why not show some of our battles but in a way that let's Veterans and the general community know that what we are going through, the battles within, are happening to others. That you aren't alone. That there are people out here willing and able to help.

The idea of us all being a crazy, gun carrying, crazy person has passed it's prime. I feel that if we come together on one united front as brothers and sisters-in-arms, we can help show people what Veterans are really made of. And hopefully, we impact Veterans directly.

TV Show, Transition,

Response by Capt Richard I P. made Apr 27 at 2015 12:11 PM

2015-04-27T12:11:03-04:00

They don't know us. That's what happens when .45 % of the population has served in combat.
http://www.rangerup.com/the45.html

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Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 27 at 2015 12:17 PM

2015-04-27T12:17:01-04:00

Veterans are honored and appreciated by a noticeable segment of the population. But everyone only knows a little bit about us, and that's perfect for story-tellers to fill in the blanks. A crazed veteran can make a convincing and compelling bogeyman.

I doubt there's much more to it than that. But, I don't even have cable.

Response by PO3 Steven Sherrill made Apr 27 at 2015 12:30 PM

2015-04-27T12:30:47-04:00

SGT Ben Keen I will start by saying that Hollywood of late has been more about regurgitation than it has been about creativity. We have had remakes, sequels, and attempts to jump on what is popular right now foisted upon us as entertainment.

Why does a "broken" veteran make such a compelling character? It is simple. This is the movie villain that the audience is going to hope gains redemption rather than just being a punching bag for the hero. A good fictional example of this is Ed Harris in The Rock. He plays a Marine General tired of seeing the memory of his troops buried. He takes action to bring attention to it. He is not an evil character, he is simply a soldier who has been pushed beyond his abillity to take it. By the end of the movie a feeling of sympathy is evoked.
A more recent example is the movie American Sniper. I will not go into the details about the film, but if you watch the end of the film, note the appearance of the veterans that Chris Kyle is helping, and the music. Note the change when the man who killed him appears on screen. Without any dialogue, you can tell that this is the guy.

Response by SGT John W Lugo made Apr 27 at 2015 1:28 PM

2015-04-27T13:28:22-04:00

I agree with your comments, another show which is currently American Odyssey in which the latest episode claims that the Government profits in the Death of overseas Military service men and women.

Response by SMSgt Donald Polaski made Apr 27 at 2015 1:29 PM

2015-04-27T13:29:16-04:00

I hear you! Let's take it a little further. First, I refuse to watch these half witted TV shows jsut for the reason you state. I really am getting tired of seeing military members being show cased as either idiots or deranged individuals. So does this have an impact? You bet it does. There seems to be a trend out there among corporations to not hire ex-military that have been in combat. It is the PTSD scare that is creating a distrust among corporate leaders. Unfortunately I doubt any of them or at least very few have really looked into PTSD to understand it. Might I point out that you do not have to serve a single day in the military to have PTSD.. Police, fire fighters, medical responders all have the potential to end up dealing with PTSD.

Lets get people smart. Again, I would not and will not watch these TV shows or movies that portray the military in a negative light..

Response by TSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 27 at 2015 1:37 PM

2015-04-27T13:37:05-04:00

While people have the right to make TV shows and movies like this, people (my family and I included) also have the right to refuse to support anything which shows the military in a bad light. We will not allow people who are anti-military to make money off of us.

While we may be hard targets in real life, our images are soft targets. It's an easy avenue of approach to earn advertising dollars. It's just one more example of the sad downfall of a once great American society.....

Response by Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS made Apr 27 at 2015 2:09 PM

2015-04-27T14:09:11-04:00

In the Movie "Thank you for Smoking" they make a comment about RAV's being the only one's who smoke in movies anymore. RAV's are Russians, Arabs, & Villains.

It's an intentional stereotype perpetuated because "heroes" don't smoke. They don't do things that are against societal norms. In the case of this movie, smoking.

For the purpose of your Show (NCIS:LA), they needed a Villain. Normal People don't go on "Gun Rampages." Cops don't go on gun rampages. They needed a gun rampage (story device). And they didn't have a Russian or an Arab... so they invented a Villain. Unfortunately, certain segments of society are "off-limits."

We can't make this DIRECTLY about "mental health." That's off limits. We can't make it a socio-economic issue. That's off-limits. But no one likes war. So, people returning from war... they're fair game.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 27 at 2015 2:20 PM

2015-04-27T14:20:07-04:00

It's not only TV shows, but also movies.

Non-Stop: "The twist, which is revealed in the trailer, is that the terrorist mastermind (a veteran) behind this stunt has figured out a way to manipulate matters so that Neeson's disgruntled marshal appears to be a hijacker holding everyone hostage. It doesn't help that he keeps waving his gun and roughing up the passengers while increasing the ever-present post-9/11 levels of paranoia."

It drives me insane. I won't watch this movie. I'm gonna have to search statistics in this matter. I mean when you have people like this: "Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano said Wednesday that she was briefed before the release of a controversial intelligence assessment and that she stands by the report, which lists returning veterans among terrorist risks to the U.S." labeling Veterans, it's easy for those to JUMP to conclusions.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 27 at 2015 2:30 PM

2015-04-27T14:30:11-04:00

This isn't new. Hollywood has been doing this for a long time now. As an impressionable young lad growing up in the '70's, I remember watching a lot of the TV shows back then depicting a Vietnam war vet (Wearing their OD green field jacket) as being a crazy, gun toting killer. It's Hollywood. If anyone believes that, they need to have a talk with a real veteran.

Response by MAJ Chris Ballard made Apr 27 at 2015 4:02 PM

2015-04-27T16:02:13-04:00

The entertainment industry relies on stereotypes. Most of the writers do not personally know veterans, so they mostly pick up what they know from other writers (who know from other writers). It's not just vets, though. Think of all the "dirty cops," the "rogue agents," the "shadowy government agencies," and the list goes on and on.

Response by MAJ Ken Landgren made Apr 27 at 2015 6:12 PM

2015-04-27T18:12:00-04:00

All the PTSD soldiers and vets I knew were fighting ghosts and demons inside them, not fighting society.

Response by SFC Mark Merino made Apr 27 at 2015 6:20 PM

2015-04-27T18:20:16-04:00

How ironic, I just watched the first season of the real Hawaii 5-0 last week. It had about 1/4 of the episodes with Vietnam vets who "snapped." I think writers fall back on the stereotype when they draw a blank for the next week's episode. I fart in their general direction.

Response by Sgt Fred Lawley made Apr 27 at 2015 8:38 PM

2015-04-27T20:38:19-04:00

I agree with you there is enough violence on TV now days. Veterans suffering from PTSD are not going out and shoot on up people and towns. I'm sure sometimes it happens but normal citizens do that too

Response by Cpl Dennis F. made Apr 27 at 2015 9:12 PM

2015-04-27T21:12:06-04:00

I watched about ten years of this BS during the 70s/80s absolutely EVERY nutcase on TV and in the movies was without exception a Viet Nam veteran. All I can say is suck it up, it's gonna happen, they hate you in Hollywood.....it'll pass.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 27 at 2015 9:53 PM

2015-04-27T21:53:41-04:00

I can't stand when people say that they don't support the troops because they don't support the government's decisions on the war. You can not support the war all you want but give some love to the service me and women who are or have fought in the various wars.

Response by MSgt Michael Null made Apr 28 at 2015 10:17 AM

2015-04-28T10:17:43-04:00

I'm transitioning to a private sector career after having served over 20 years and being a combat veteran. The distorted image of veterans portrayed by television and movies is not helping. Neither is the well intentioned buzz about PTSD, TBI and suicide--the problem is real and serious, but without proper perspective it makes us all look like ticking time bombs. There are "hire a veteran" campaigns out there, but they focus on entry level jobs rather than professional or executive level skills and experience that a longer serving veteran like me can bring to an organization.

Response by SGT William Rasmussen made Apr 28 at 2015 2:24 PM

2015-04-28T14:24:28-04:00

But heres the thing-its not us crazy vets doing the gun and violence-yes we have some issues, but its those wanna bees that run around doing most of it. So how about some stuff showinfg vets going out for good-like Team Rubicon or others, its our story-let us direct the show

Response by PO1 Lance Chennault made Apr 28 at 2015 2:36 PM

2015-04-28T14:36:21-04:00

SGT Keen,

Great post, and this just feeds into the Stigma that is PTSD, TBIs and Depression for us Veterans. You are absolutely correct in your post, all this is doing is strengthening the stigma for businesses, universities and corporate America, making it harder and harder for Veterans to get jobs, education and help.

Glad you posted this.

Lance

Response by SPC Don Stringer made Apr 28 at 2015 2:37 PM

2015-04-28T14:37:40-04:00

This is because the producers, directors and actors are all predominately Left wing Democrats, and this is how they actually see servicemen. Frothing at the mouth, crazy, homicidal white men. None of them ever served or seen combat, except for a few of the old timer actors, and Brian Williams, who parachuted into Afghanistan and took Kabul with Seal Team 6, behind him.

Response by SFC Emerson "Zeus" Hazzard made Apr 28 at 2015 3:26 PM

2015-04-28T15:26:37-04:00

There are many veterans who are a danger to themselves and others because they have not had proper counseling or taken the time to learn how to tame the killer that was created in the Calderon of combat. If I had not developed a particular set of skills to tame the particular changes that occurred in my personality I would be a very different person; a very dangerous person. Pretending that PTSD does not exist is a recipe for disaster. My personal anecdotal belief is that everyone that deploys to combat returns with some degree of PTSD. The problem is they do not recognize it until they make some catastrophic decision(s). Yes vets are broken but not always beyond repair.

Response by SSG Bruce Booker made Apr 28 at 2015 3:38 PM

2015-04-28T15:38:05-04:00

I am a Vietnam Veteran. Until recently, I tried to hide that fact because of the 'baby killer' stigma that went along with it. Along with my memories from Vietnam, I also remember walking through the San Francisco airport in uniform, trying to get home to see family after I returned from Vietnam. I got spit on, just because I happened to be a soldier in uniform. Then the 'crazy veteran' movies and TV shows took off. I was embarrassed and a little bit afraid to admit that I was a veteran, so I usually just covered it up.

I went on to have a 37-year career in law enforcement in a major metropolitan area. Over the years, I met many other veterans from wars ranging from WWII to Iraq and Afghanistan, in both personal and professional settings. Most of them are normal, ordinary people, just like most non-veterans. Did I encounter dangerous, deranged people? Yes. But it seldom had anything to do with being a veteran. Most of them were not veterans, and when they were veterans there was often something else that set them off. (If there is a consistent difference between veterans and non-veterans, it is that veterans generally learned discipline and self-control better than the average citizen.) But you wouldn't get that by watching TV and movies. We're all a bunch of dangerous, deranged nut cases wandering around just waiting to go off.

I put most 'veteran' movies and TV shows in the same category with most 'cop' movies and TV shows. There is usually a little kernel of fact and truth, wrapped in a huge ball of unrealistic fiction. They make for exciting entertainment, but have little to do with the real world.

The 'news' media doesn't help. When they run a negative story about a veteran, they usually find a way to include his/her veteran status in the story, regardless of whether or not that has anything to do with what happened. Think about the number of 'deranged veteran' stories we see on the news, and the frequency with which we see them. If you compare that to the total number of veterans, it's really an extremely small percentage. That's not to say that many veterans don't have physical and emotional baggage to deal with. I have my own baggage from Vietnam and from a career in law enforcement. It is just that most of us deal with it without going off on a violent rampage. But you wouldn't get that from watching 'yet another crazy veteran' news stories. (Sensationalism attracts audiences, and that brings in advertising dollars.)

If people apply negative stereotypes to groups of people based on their ethnicity or gender, we brand them as racists or sexists. But when they apply the same negative stereotypes to veterans, no one except other veterans seems to give a damn. I don't think a non-veteran can really fully understand what it is to be a veteran, especially a combat veteran. You can't explain it. You can only experience it. And so, much of the general public forms their opinions of veterans (and cops) based on the crap they see on TV, movie screens, and sensational 'news' stories.

So there are some things that we as veterans just have to live with. That isn't right, it's just the way it is. I hope that veterans from the current generation will get more help with that than veterans from my generation got.

Response by SGT Conrad Sutton made Apr 28 at 2015 3:42 PM

2015-04-28T15:42:11-04:00

Well I work in a VA and from that and some incidents around the local base I would say that there is a slight, slight truth to it. I've always felt the NCIS series tried to bring to light how many of our brothers and sisters are coming home broken and no one seems to care or take it seriously...until they pick up a rifle and start targeting civilians.

Response by SSG Virgil Green made Apr 28 at 2015 4:09 PM

2015-04-28T16:09:16-04:00

The fact of the matter is America has a stigma about veterans returning from war. Many believe that everyone returning has PTSD that is dangerous. In our nation people say they support our hero's yet the President had to create an incentive payment for these same companies to hire VET's. It is not all bad though as many companies do support our returning warriors and did not need the incentive payment.

Response by Maj Emmett Conrecode made Apr 28 at 2015 4:09 PM

2015-04-28T16:09:25-04:00

Ben,

Unfortunately most of the scripts out of Hollywood are driven by an agenda. Such as 30% of the population is gay, they just don't know it yet.

The one before that was every tragic death in a script, was caused by a Drunk Driver. So overused, it kind of a joke in the industry now.

The latest one is only sane people should have guns. Sounds good right, except who is defining sane?

A February 2012 memorandum of understanding between the United States Department of Veterans Affairs (VA) and the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) lays out a process pursuant to which the VA has been regularly sending to the FBI mental health information about VA patients. The mental health information transferred is intended to aid the FBI in adding individuals to the National Instant Criminal Background Check System (NICS) list of individuals restricted from owning or possessing guns.

So these scripts are part of the big push. Those that write such scripts know it increases the chance it will be produced. So more scripts have these storylines.

People keep hearing the same thing over and over it has to be true, Right? Is the Big Picture coming into view now?

The push back is to put your DVR on Skip for that show and ones like it. The Industry gets instant feedback on skipped shows on DVR. One the reasons HBO produces "Band Of Brothers" was to get back it's lost subscribers. It worked, now you see a more balanced schedule on HBO.

Frats,
Emmett

Response by SSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 28 at 2015 4:44 PM

2015-04-28T16:44:02-04:00

Hollywood and media in general are vainglorious and self-centered and the Paparazzi have used this already. Let the lawsuits begin..lol

Response by SGT Lawrence Corser made Apr 28 at 2015 4:47 PM

2015-04-28T16:47:20-04:00

Some for sure are; most are pretty regular people who you wouldnt notice if not for some of the tell tale signs of a vet (haircut, boots, go bag/ bug out bag, and crazy beards). I think in all of society they the media plays up vets as crazy, homeless, or gun toting nutjobs and it couldnt be more wrong.

Response by CPL Modesto Macia-Perez made Apr 28 at 2015 4:51 PM

2015-04-28T16:51:04-04:00

I don't believe our veterans are as broken as some T.V. and movies would lead us to believe, but we do have vets that do develop problems due to their service. I saw this particular episode of NCIS Los Angeles and I believe what the episode tried to convey was how some Vets don't get some of the help they need. I find that NCIS and their spin offs are very pro U.S. Military and shed a good light on our troops. But you are right Sgt. Keen, a lot of movies and shows don't reflect well on us.

Response by PO3 Cindy Williams made Apr 28 at 2015 6:27 PM

2015-04-28T18:27:48-04:00

Picture shown was from the original NCIS and the person pictures was on steroids. Need to watch what episodes you post from.

Response by SFC Larry Jones made Apr 28 at 2015 8:28 PM

2015-04-28T20:28:11-04:00

NCIS LA should not even be on the air. Few of their cases are related to the Navy or Marine Corps. I quit watching it 2 or 3 years ago because they couldn't be bothered to remember how many people died in the Oklahoma City bombing. I lost eight professional colleagues in that horror. One more that I know of later took his own life. The number of lives ceaselessly ended that day is 168. I am embarrassed I can't remember how many more were injured.

Response by TSgt Mario Guajardo made Apr 29 at 2015 1:16 AM

2015-04-29T01:16:33-04:00

The distressing thing is that some people think that these are accurate portrayals

Response by PV2 Glen Lewis made Apr 29 at 2015 2:20 AM

2015-04-29T02:20:55-04:00

I don't think so. Television thrives on sensationalism and there is little or none to be had with a soldier who comes home and is able to reenter civilian life without drastic mental and/or physical issues.

Response by PO1 Aaron Baltosser made Apr 29 at 2015 6:42 AM

2015-04-29T06:42:17-04:00

The point of showing Veterans as gun crazy folks, unable to fold back into civilian life is just part of the liberal media, of which Hollywood is included trying to push a left wing agenda. The won't show anything, report anything, or write a movie that actually reflects the truth of being in service or out. The last solid piece of work I know out of Hollywood was Saving Private Ryan. They produce so much fluff because there are so few of them with any experience in military life. A very good teacher I had once told me in regard to writing, only ever write about something you have experience with. If they followed that, how many stories would come out about drinking, drugs, casual sex, and dodging taxes? Quite truthful, but not very riveting.

Response by SSG Derek Varchulik made Apr 29 at 2015 10:02 AM

2015-04-29T10:02:29-04:00

well with 22 committing suicide a day something is broken

Response by SGT Conrad Sutton made Apr 29 at 2015 2:24 PM

2015-04-29T14:24:15-04:00

i Want to clarify my statement from earlier in regards to this subject. I was by no means justifying the glorification of "broken Vets" by Hollywierd. However, since, NCIS is a show that is centered around investigating crimes related to the military, a vet with PTSD that snaps would natrually fall into the storylines. But, what this show has done is without being preachy, pointed out statistics of veteran suicides, shown what the affects of PTSD can do to a persons everyday life (one of the main characters of Los Angeles suffers from it from being tortured but he isn't military), and how life can be for our loved ones when we were/are not home. But, just as it has been said to Christians, Blacks(I am btw), and any one else that doesn't like how the industry portrays them, maybe it's time the services started making their own movies. We know that we are not purely the heros in the white hats, but we also know that we are not these distrubed monsters either. If we want to see the real life we lead/led, perhaps it's time we started telling the stories and not allowing other to politicize it regardless of their agenda.

Response by MAJ Robert (Bob) Petrarca made Apr 29 at 2015 3:01 PM

2015-04-29T15:01:24-04:00

I would think that there are vets who are more broken than the pseudo-stereotypes depicted on TV and the movies. I think one of my favorite portrayals is Leroy Jethro Gibbs from NCIS. Yes he has his over the top moments but the guy is a fighter who perseveres despite his personal demons. How he hasn't gone to the dark side yet, perplexes me. I think his "Alpha Male" persona that he hides behind is a bit over the top and almost super-human and I don't think you'd find many that could do what he does for as long as he's done it.

I think true veteran "survivors" do break down and are emotionally vulnerable and I doubt any of them are going to go "Rambo" anytime soon, despite what we see on film.

Response by MSgt Gerard Smieja made May 5 at 2015 5:02 PM

2015-05-05T17:02:21-04:00

I actually watched this episode and it was not just some returning vet picking up a weapon and shooting people. The Veteran was in a VA hospital for PTSD and someone from his old unit was involved with some group that disliked Muslims. He was giving the vet some drug to make him more susceptible to suggestions and brain washing and convinced him to leave the hospital and join them. He was eventually stopped and returned to the hospital and his family.

So the show did not portray returning veterans as gun carrying crazies, but as people that need help and that there are people out there that really do want to help them.