Have you ever disobeyed an order?

2019-02-25T14:43:37-05:00

Not trying to get any one in any trouble - just find it interesting that in the German military one can at times disobey an order - and in fact are required to do so if if an order denies human dignity to the armed forces member or the order’s target. Have you ever disobeyed an order or bent an ROE? Please feel free to use a "friend's" experience.

https://www.history.com/news/why-german-soldiers-dont-have-to-obey-orders

Why German Soldiers Don’t Have to Obey Orders

The country's military is disobedient by design.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 25 at 2019 2:46 PM

2019-02-25T14:46:53-05:00

I have not followed through with some orders when they have been immoral, unethical, or illegal.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 25 at 2019 3:10 PM

2019-02-25T15:10:01-05:00

If an order given is illegal you are not to follow it by law. Article 90 of the UCMJ outlines the crime of willful disobedience by a military member a superior commissioned officer. Article 91 covers willful disobedience of a superior Noncommissioned or Warrant Officer. Article 92 conveys what constitutes the crime of disobedience of any lawful order (the disobedience does not have to be "willful" under this article).

These articles require the obedience of LAWFUL orders. Not only should an unlawful order not be obeyed, obeying such an order can result in criminal prosecution. Military courts have long held that military members are accountable for their actions even while following orders.

Also I see you a lot haha MSG Private RallyPoint Member

Response by CSM Darieus ZaGara made Feb 25 at 2019 3:22 PM

2019-02-25T15:22:23-05:00

I disobeyed what I deemed to be an unlawful order, only after trying to convince the individual that it was unwise and why. Unfortunately for him it was unlawful and he was reprimanded for it later. He did learn a lesson because he made General, and he is a good man. Just because he was wrong in his thinking did not mean he made a bad choice on purpose. Thank you for your service.

Response by 1LT William Clardy made Feb 25 at 2019 4:03 PM

2019-02-25T16:03:22-05:00

One of the most insightful "professional development" classes I ever had started off with our squadron sergeant major telling the troop NCOs that the first question they should answer every morning is "Who will I disobey today?"
As the sergeant major explained, the reality was that the every-day combination of training and operational requirements meant we would never have enough time to meet every requirement coming from on high, so our most important decision would be prioritizing -- and deciding which order or regulation would be getting set aside, at least for that day.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 25 at 2019 4:06 PM

2019-02-25T16:06:01-05:00

Not falling for it! LOL

Response by PO1 John Johnson made Feb 25 at 2019 4:43 PM

2019-02-25T16:43:24-05:00

Not by any conscience decision on my part, although I never received an unlawful or illegal order either.

Response by Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS made Feb 25 at 2019 5:51 PM

2019-02-25T17:51:57-05:00

A better question is "What order did I comply to the letter, and inform them in front of their senior its completion"

Response by SMSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 25 at 2019 7:13 PM

2019-02-25T19:13:52-05:00

I did during my career and it was in a situation where my duties and responsibilities required me to ignore that senior officers order for the benefit of her safety and the safety of those I was escorting that day while they were on a shopping and morale trip in a muslim country. She had created a scene with some of the local shopkeepers and shop owners and was quite abusive verbally towards them during the process of haggling. By the time we had got to a forth shop she had drawn a lot of negative type attention and a crowd of them was forming and it was becoming clear they were not happy. I told my group that the shopping trip was over and we were leaving. I quickly expressed my apologies for her behavior and grabbed her by the arm and hustled them out of the shopping center and into our vehicle all the while taking her by the arm while she was ordering me to stop and that she was not going anywhere. I was of course carrying concealed but who wants or needs an international incident over a shopping trip? The commander after being briefed had a nice talk with her once we got back to the post about how she should behave in the future when out and about off post and she was restricted to the post for a time even and that was the end of it.

Response by SPC Jessica Flowers made Feb 27 at 2019 4:21 PM

2019-02-27T16:21:53-05:00

I do not know if I would call it an order, I was questioned by a Colonel and I refused to answer his question. I was a designated driver one weekend and when i went to pick up a battle buddy I also picked up a NCO and 2 Officers. The Colonel wanted to know their names and while I did not know their names (the officers, they were visiting the base) I told him that I was not going to refuse to drive a soldier home that was drunk because of their rank. Alaska had (probably still does) a huge drinking problem. I did not think I did anything wrong and told the Colonel that. He was surprised, as I am sure not many e4s tell him no, but he did accept my answer with my reasoning