Has the military taken a turn for the worst? If so...why

2016-01-30T12:52:22-05:00

Response by SSG Eddye Royal made Jan 30 at 2016 1:26 PM

2016-01-30T13:26:38-05:00

SGT McBride, this because, of the quality of the people that we are getting at this time, when we joined we cared, and did not curse the leaders out, even if we had to show others how to help each other a simple thing how to shine boots. Secondly, most of us did not steals from each other either.

Response by SPC(P) Micah Lavigne made Jan 30 at 2016 1:28 PM

2016-01-30T13:28:48-05:00

When you allow Politicians who never served and "progressive" ideals enter Military culture, it is to be expected.

Response by LTC Stephen F. made Jan 30 at 2016 1:29 PM

2016-01-30T13:29:50-05:00

I hope that the people who serve in the military have not taken a turn for the worse SGT(P) Daniel McBride. The Army has long focused on equipping people versus manning equipment. I hope that trend continues into the future for the US Army and USMC at least.

Response by SFC Michael Hasbun made Jan 30 at 2016 1:34 PM

2016-01-30T13:34:25-05:00

Our education system has gone downhill. We recruit from that population. One cannot fish in a lake and hope to catch a camel...

Response by PO1 William "Chip" Nagel made Jan 30 at 2016 1:38 PM

2016-01-30T13:38:40-05:00

All depends on your Perspective. When I came in 76 had all of those Vietnam Era Vets, A large Percentage were Weed Smoking Buggers, Alcoholism was an Accepted part of our Culture. The Navy I joined and what I was serving in say by 84 was a different can of worms altogether and I would say for the better, by the time I retired in 97 it was an even more different culture definitely more professional. The Navy I joined there was no PT once you were out of Boot Camp that was no longer a requirement. In 1980 they started the PT back again when they realized they had Sailors that were too fat to get thru an Escape Hatch. When I retired in 97 we were some PTing Fools.

Response by LTC Yinon Weiss made Jan 30 at 2016 1:44 PM

2016-01-30T13:44:35-05:00

No, I believe the military is as strong now as it ever has been, and maybe more. It's not perfect for sure, but our military is incredibly strong. It just has to be used in the right way to achieve its goals. The American service member is among the best of Americans today, and so is our military, in my opinion.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 30 at 2016 1:45 PM

2016-01-30T13:45:02-05:00

It's all politics now. NCOs are no longer allowed to be NCOs. We're expected to baby Soldiers, not toughen them. We are no longer allowed to breed Warfighters and we will pay the price in blood.

Response by MSgt Steven Holt, NRP, CCEMT-P made Jan 30 at 2016 1:57 PM

2016-01-30T13:57:56-05:00

This issue is bigger than just the military. Since "The Military" is made of a cross-section from all parts of society, it's only natural that certain issues crop up from time to time. It's just my personal belief but there is a general decline in society as a whole. It all stems from the participation trophy, everyone wins, do-what-feels-good, lack of consequences era of thought. How dare we damage Little Johny's self-esteem by giving him the failing grade he deserves! Never mind LJ spent all his time playing Xbox while Suzie busted her behind studying for hours to earn an "A". It's not fair Johny got an F. For good or ill, the military is a reflection of that ideology.

Response by Cpl D L Parker made Jan 30 at 2016 2:13 PM

2016-01-30T14:13:05-05:00

Open homosexuality and the allowance of the transgender. this can turn into a logistical nightmare if not a moral issue.

Response by SGM Mikel Dawson made Jan 30 at 2016 4:41 PM

2016-01-30T16:41:39-05:00

The military is not the place for being Politically Correct nor is it a place for social experiments. People in political positions have too much say as to how the military is operated.
I do feel we have a great military and good quality service members. There will always be the usual amount of brown nosing, yes-men and such. That just goes with the beast.
We have a great technical advantage in the military now. One thing we need to do is not forget the human factor and base knowledge. Example: as a 12B I was issued a pocket calculator to do my demo formulas and such, but when I went to take the SQT (old school), I couldn't use it because the thinking was I actually had to know how to do the math in case my calculator failed during a mission. I think we tend to depend too much on electronic tec stuff and not stressing enough gray matter exercise.

Response by TSgt John Temblador, PI, CIPA made Jan 30 at 2016 4:52 PM

2016-01-30T16:52:34-05:00

Our Military / Civilian Staff do not have a "Commander and Chief" that follows the God Given US Constitution, it's Articles or Rights, or Pursues Righteousness and Destroys Evil when it is not PC...

How can you expect our young men and people to rally behind someone who calls evil good, and good evil... and gives homage to our enemies and gives billions on dollars and nukes to terrorists and places them in our children's minds and government radical Islamic ideals....

Response by MCPO Roger Collins made Jan 30 at 2016 5:01 PM

2016-01-30T17:01:36-05:00

Not really, despite all the perturbations placed on them in recent years they all fairly much do the job better than any nation on the planet.

Response by COL Charles Williams made Jan 31 at 2016 12:04 AM

2016-01-31T00:04:30-05:00

No. SGT(P) Daniel McBride. The military ebbs and flows with what is going on, the budget... etc. The military is always changing, growing, down-sizing... But, all is OK... and the Army will keep rolling. Every generation seems to lament about how great things were back in the day, but the reality is that this is all relative. The Army was a mess when I came in 1980; recovering from Vietnam, which in my view was much, much lower than any of us have ever experienced since... After 911, we older Soldiers lamented how the young Soldiers in the ranks were weak and could handle adversity like we could/did, and they proved us very wrong... They were more than up to the task... How many of us post Vietnam era and pre-911 veterans would have joined in a time a war? Everything will be OK.

Response by Sgt Rick Orzechowski made Jan 31 at 2016 7:26 AM

2016-01-31T07:26:46-05:00

It has taken a turn for the worse... There are gangs running things and stealing the government blind, they no longer allow you to use physical exercise for screw ups!!! You cannot yell or curse at a soldier lest you hurt his/her feelings... The military has always been and should always be the best of the best. Stop with the moddly coddling and begin by whipping them into shape. New soldiers need leadership not surrogate mommies and daddies. I respected my leaders because they ruled with an iron fist rather than a hug and a sucker.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 31 at 2016 10:14 AM

2016-01-31T10:14:15-05:00

Yes the respect and discipline all across the army is much less especially coming out of basic. To may soldier have a felling of entitlement and want to question every thing. More and more the why do I have to do that sgt crap. SPC once apron a time demanded some kind of respect not any more.

Response by MSgt Darren VanDerwilt made Jan 31 at 2016 4:27 PM

2016-01-31T16:27:12-05:00

I have to say yes. Seems things are steering further into the nightmare of political correctness. Forcing the integration of women into combat roles, monitoring private text messages, threatening members who share a different opinion on weapons system procurement, and developing plans to have supervisors provide "morale" checks at a subordinates private residence, just to mention a few, are prime examples.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 1 at 2016 4:58 PM

2016-02-01T16:58:26-05:00

The moment the military started become a social experiment it went down hill

Response by LTC John Wilson made Feb 1 at 2016 5:53 PM

2016-02-01T17:53:12-05:00

There are numerous trends which detract the US military from its primary mission and we are "drawing down" while still in the middle of a world wide war. Many of these trends are linked to civil leadership...a problem the military has always faced.

The more destructive trends are internal (1) caustic "pony express" leaders who've ridden their way to the top by driving their subordinates into the ground; (2) a field of shake-n-bake NCOs who've been promoted too fast to have the same wisdom and experience good officers used to rely on; and (3) an unenviable professional culture similar to the French military before WWII which prized monolithic, lock-step compliance to top-down dogma over free thought and innovative junior leadership.

Response by LTJG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 1 at 2016 9:32 PM

2016-02-01T21:32:00-05:00

I'll just leave this here.

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Response by LTC Dallas Powell made Feb 2 at 2016 11:24 AM

2016-02-02T11:24:51-05:00

History shows that the American military can and will respond to any challenge better than any force ever fielded. Our size and budget expand and contract by necessity, depending on the current political and threat environment. However, it is incumbent on our political masters to ensure we have the right strategy, and the proper equipment and training to get the job done. Is our military perfect? No -- it never has been and never will be.

Response by SSG Glen Krinsky made Feb 2 at 2016 11:28 AM

2016-02-02T11:28:28-05:00

No longer do we train to standard. NCO's can no longer enforce discipline. The standards have become too lax, and frankly, we are raising a bunch of politically correct bleeding heart oxygen thieves. There are exceptions...but...we, as leaders, have become to concerned with a soldiers feelings than we have in whether or not they can do the job that needs to be done. War is not a pretty job, a politically correct job, or a popular job. But it is a necessary job to ensure our way of life. I do not make excuses or apologize for what the military has done or will need to do in the future, but we need to remember how to train killers, not cry babies. The rest of the world doesn't give a rats ass about our feelings, they will kill us. We need to do the same.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 2 at 2016 11:30 AM

2016-02-02T11:30:51-05:00

I believe in order for the military to stay a all volunteer force we have to change the way the military works to accompany a softer generation. I'm not saying the military is soft but people have to worry about the public eye and a lot of people don't understand the military and how it works. You get crucified if you try to bring the old in with the new, people are not used to it. I believe if you are a true leader you can work in any environment and your soldiers will follow you no matter what. You don't have to be soft to be a strong leader in this present military. Stay strong and you will be the leader your soldiers deserve.

Response by SPC James Dollins made Feb 2 at 2016 11:34 AM

2016-02-02T11:34:45-05:00

Yes!! The soldiers coming up today & from about 2005 on have no respect, and NO military bearing. Basic has gotten soft I think. I think that the Army has gotten soft in general. That's my thoughts on that subject!

Response by COL Ted Mc made Feb 2 at 2016 12:42 PM

2016-02-02T12:42:46-05:00

SGT(P) Daniel McBride - Sergeant; A stimulating question.

It also raises the question "Is the same type of military that was good enough for our fore-bearers the type of military we need today?".

John Keegan's "A History of Warfare" [Vintage; (November 1, 1994), ISBN-10: [login to see] , ISBN-13: [login to see] 828] raises interesting aspects of that question and I urge you to wade through his sometimes turgid prose.

Response by SGT Christopher Premore made Feb 2 at 2016 1:16 PM

2016-02-02T13:16:16-05:00

The military has made a lot of changes for the woarst in the last few years. Prime example would be the tattoo policy. I had a guy that would literally do heroin at the company and couldn't get rid of this guy not to mention being kicked out of rehab 3 times for popping hot. Yet I seen soldiers that never had been in trouble getting denied reenlistment because of ink they came in with. I say think junkie is more of a risk than a soldier with a sleeve seems like common sense to me.

Response by MAJ Ken Landgren made Feb 2 at 2016 5:49 PM

2016-02-02T17:49:19-05:00

There appears to be a big difference between new recruits and NCOs. The government is taking money away from the troops, many are weary of multiple deployments, NCOs and Officers are constantly look behind them with QMP.

Response by SPC Jonathan Schmidt made Feb 2 at 2016 7:18 PM

2016-02-02T19:18:27-05:00

We are raising a generation who lack the capacity to deal with failure because everyone wins a trophy and there are no losers anymore. We have kids who lack discipline because parents get told that any kind of punishment is abuse. Kids threatening their parents with a call to Child Protective Services if they don't give the kid what they want.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 2 at 2016 9:02 PM

2016-02-02T21:02:14-05:00

Turn for the worst? No. I'm sure it could get much worse than it is now which means it is not at its worst now.

Response by CSM James Winslow made Feb 3 at 2016 5:34 AM

2016-02-03T05:34:43-05:00

With all the advances in technology the military has undergone, we require a different quality of soldier. More intelligent, better educated and more adaptable to changes in situations and surroundings. Gone are the days of low tech solutions and needing a dozen Soldiers to man a particular system or put a piece of equipment into operation. Now we only need a couple, but the machinery they operate is very complex and the Soldiers need to be smart enough to trouble shoot the equipment they operate. The complexity of the missions we are being asked to undertake require soldiers and leaders who can think on their feet and adapt to rapidly changing conditions and situations, tactically, strategically and socially. The replacement of the Draftee with a Volunteer has also required a change in how we lead Soldiers. You cannot threaten volunteers with bodily harm if they do not toe the line anymore, it requires a more refined and intelligent approach to leadership. Along with these changes in the way the Military does business is the way society has changed as a whole. There are more social programs in place to care for the disadvantaged, better health care and generally more civilized expectations from everyone. Soldiers believe what they are told- leading by example, fair and impartial rewards and punishment and intelligent and informed leadership that is balanced and unprejudiced are the key motivating factors that are required to be a leader today. Soldiers today want a balanced approach to leadership, with some combination of participation in the decisions that are being made as well as directed action. Where the leaders of today have problems is in remembering that in today's "management" oriented leadership environment is that Soldiers, especially young NCOs, require coaching and mentorship before they become fully functional leaders. Just because someone passes a board and goes to school does not mean they are completely ready or able to be an effective leader. This requires their leadership to be caring and involved in the process of growth as a leader. Has the Army changed? Yes. For the better? Mostly. People in the military tend to get more bogged down in the daily social drama of their units for some reason. The unit grapevine has expanded exponentially with the advent of internet social media, and what used to be only in the purview of the chain of command is now everyone's business. The mantra of "not taking your work home with you" has gone out the window since the introduction of the mobile phone. In the Army of the pre mobile phone era, unit events and activities were more carefully planned and executed, and the "last minute" changes in direction were not as easy to execute. Now, the commander can call the staff on a moments notice, and expects them to reply and be ready for work in minimum time. The stupidest thing I ever heard out of a leaders mouth was the statement "Your free time means nothing to me". This shows a ignorance of the wants, needs and desires of those who work for you, and is a very selfish statement.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 3 at 2016 12:47 PM

2016-02-03T12:47:57-05:00

with the whine baby kiddos 'graduating' from 'school', it's no wonder that the military has gone downhill...this doesn't surprise me in the least.

Response by SPC James Dollins made Feb 3 at 2016 8:54 PM

2016-02-03T20:54:04-05:00

It started I'd say 2004/5. It was ridiculous the privates that were coming up. They had NO respect for rank structure or NCO's. I would've been killed if I acted like they did when I was coming up.

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 5 at 2016 1:47 PM

2016-02-05T13:47:06-05:00

The military is a reflection of a portion of the population and simply put the populations' beliefs and values are changing.