Has someone ever walked on to your property unannounced?

1LT Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 28 Mar 2023 13:43:47 -0400

My house is on less than a .25 acre, but still a fairly big lot for the nieghborhood. I happened to peak out the window and saw someone carrying a ladder into my completely fenced in backyard. They had to open my gate to get in there.

Naturally, I go out to confront them. Turns out to be a gentleman with AT&T installing internet for my neighbor. In so many words, he claims the pole is AT&T's property and he didn't have to knock on my door. No issue, just would have appreciated the knock on the door. I understand his job and many other jobs demand that people go through other people's backyards and that can't be easy or fun to do. The conversation was tense, so I asked if he needed help and he declined.

But, I wish he understood the situation a little better. I placed my 1911 in my waist before I went out. I just moved to this house a couple months ago and the city crime maps all show this neighborhood as having a high rate of property crimes, the surrounding neighbhorhoods as well. The violent crimes also occur on this side of town, and a friend of mine in local law enforcement mentioned a murder case that just popped up a couple weeks ago a few blocks down from me. I would have shot this man if he posed any threat to my children, who were just a few feet away inside my house, and I would have been completely within Kentucky's stand-your-ground laws as I understand them.

Maybe he did understand this but after so long on the job didn't care. Maybe he's had so many bad interactions he doesn't bother anymore. Who knows? Doesn't change the fact that he made himself a potential threat by opening my gate and walking into my backyard unanounced. Feels like a knock on the door should be company policy, for everyone's safety.

Response by SPC Robert Coventry made Mar 28 at 2023 2:16 PM

SPC Robert Coventry — Tue, 28 Mar 2023 14:16:05 -0400

Thanks for the share

Response by SPC Robert Coventry made Mar 28 at 2023 2:18 PM

SPC Robert Coventry — Tue, 28 Mar 2023 14:18:17 -0400

I would ask that if they come on my property they ask permission, maybe your neighbor could have told you they were adding/changing service and AT&T was heading out. Talk to neighbor and see if you can watch out for each other.

Response by SPC Robert Coventry made Mar 28 at 2023 2:22 PM

SPC Robert Coventry — Tue, 28 Mar 2023 14:22:24 -0400

They don't have to ask to work within an easement and you have to provide reasonable access to the easement, if you don't they can remove any obstacle in the easement to gain access, as in remove the section of fence over the easement. This would be a last resort if the home owner refused access after being asked a few times.

Response by SSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 28 at 2023 2:25 PM

SSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 28 Mar 2023 14:25:06 -0400

I’ve carried pistols and rifles as a condition of and in the execution of my military and law enforcement careers for the majority of my adult life, I know all about use of force protocols and engaging and neutralizing a threat, and I never leave the house unarmed.

In that same situation, I would have done the same thing. Regardless of any other factors and until he proves otherwise, he is an unannounced and unknown entity on my property. Whatever action he resorts to now dictates my response.

Response by COL Randall C. made Mar 28 at 2023 2:37 PM

COL Randall C. — Tue, 28 Mar 2023 14:37:06 -0400

It will depend on the wording of the easement agreement (pull our your deed ... there will usually be a clause in there ... if not, consult state law for an overarching one), but the key with utility companies and easements is usually "reasonable access"

What a utility can and can’t do depends a lot on the concept of “reasonableness.” The utility owns their equipment and has a reasonable right to access it, but you still own the land. This means that while the utility has a right to access its equipment, how it goes about that access is determined by the circumstances. That’s why utility workers don’t simply barge into your house to read the meters, but request access, and you can almost always schedule your meter readings with the utility if you want to.

On the other hand, if a problem threatens the safety of your community, utilities will act first and request permission later. In other words, accessing the property without permission in an emergency is reasonable.

Now, COULD and SHOULD are different things. While he might be allowed to gain access without permission (i.e., COULD), that doesn't mean he SHOULD do it without consulting you. If it was a meter read, that is one thing .. but someone walking into your yard with a ladder over one shoulder without knocking on your door? Recipe for (his) disaster.

Response by CPT Lawrence Cable made Mar 28 at 2023 2:49 PM

CPT Lawrence Cable — Tue, 28 Mar 2023 14:49:09 -0400

I live on about 10 acres outside o any municipal boundaries, I often answer my door armed.

I had one incident were a couple of guys in a beat up Pick Up truck showed up at the house early in the evening. The guy that was at the door claimed that this was the address he had for some sales item, then started to get a bit belligerent when I told him he had the wrong place. And my dog didn't like him, so that added to my caution. The 45 I had in small of my back came out to where he could see it I repeated what I told him earlier and informed him it was time to leave. He left.
The guy that really made me nervous was the one that stayed in the truck. If he had made any sudden moves that I would have interpreted as hostile, I would have emptied about half that magazine on his doors. If he was just reaching for a smoke, I would have to apologize.

To this day I am still convinced that these guys were looking for a place where no one was home or that they could strong arm rob if the family was home.

Response by Maj John Bell made Mar 28 at 2023 3:07 PM

Maj John Bell — Tue, 28 Mar 2023 15:07:50 -0400

I keep livestock (horses and goats) and poultry on a 160-acre farm. I do have a utility easement that runs through my paddock. Before I put the fields in livestock, I talked to the power company. There is a vehicle entrapment area at either end of the field. The power company has keys to their locks, and I have keys to my locks, both on the same chain. They make sure that both gates to the entrapment area are never open at the same time. In turn, if they give me a call that they need to work on the lines, I put the animals elsewhere. They have the number plus its posted on the gate. In 20+ years I've never had a problem.

I live in an area where summer tourists are everywhere. Despite the fact that I have "no trespassing" signs posted every 16 ft. I've found unknown and uninvited people in my paddocks, feeding the horses and goats, in my orchards picking fruit, in my fields picking vegetables and berries. I've found unknown and uninvited people in my duck run and chicken runs letting their young kids chase the birds. In every case they have to cross two fence lines to get to where they got. I wish I could say it was kids, but it wasn't. I also have some wooded acres on my farm, and I have to chase people who try to harvest firewood out all the time and during mushroom season the "shroomers" feel entitled to roam my woods and harvest my mushrooms. They aren't.

I've got 4 livestock guardian dogs. They've never bitten a human being. But when they are hauling ass out to tell you, "you don't belong here" you'd think they eat live humans for breakfast lunch and dinner. They are trained to get in a low crouch and growl once they get within 15-20 ft and then they herd your ass right back over the fence.

Response by MSG Thomas Currie made Mar 28 at 2023 5:08 PM

MSG Thomas Currie — Tue, 28 Mar 2023 17:08:41 -0400

Unusual that there would be a utility pole in your BACK yard (unless the feed is coming from the street behind you). As others have pointed out, there should be an easement that is part of your deed (although it may be documented separately) your county clerk's office should be able to help you find it.

Occasionally you may find that there isn't any easement and that a utility has installed equipment with nothing more than verbal approval by the previous owner (or even a previous tenant!).

You can complain to AT&T but the reality is that you will only be talking to some "Customer Service" person, quite probably at a Call Center. The person you get to talk to will be an entry-level employee, paid barely over minimum wage, with absolutely no authority to do anything, but they will let you know that they are "very sorry for any inconvenience" and will repeat that apology as many times as you are willing to stay on the line listening to it.