Finishing tattoos the same as getting a new one?

2014-03-31T10:04:27-04:00

Last week, my BDE CSM hosted an NCOPD discussing the AR 670-1 updates. When we talked about the tattoo policy, and that no new tattoos can be acquired below the shorts and below the short sleeve of the summer IPFU, I asked if that included those die-hard ink getters who have an elaborate design that takes more than one sitting to complete. If the design is already there, and they go back to have it detailed, or colored in, does that count as a new tattoo, or still the same tattoo that is being completed. Once the CO takes a picture of it, documents it and uploads it, is anything after that considered new?

Response by SFC William Swartz Jr made Mar 31 at 2014 10:24 AM

2014-03-31T10:24:37-04:00

That is a great question and without a clarification from higher leaves you in a grey area; I would assume, but you know what that gets you, lol, that since the outline is already there, and you are only getting the details filled-in, then you should be ok, but then I am retired so, take that with a grain of salt lol!

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 31 at 2014 11:16 AM

2014-03-31T11:16:32-04:00

Tattoos are not outlawed, just having more than four the size of your hand (still awaiting guidance on whether that means on each appendage or total.) I wouldn't add detail that increases the surface area of the tattoo if it's pushing the size limits but color does not change the size. You will still need the photos updated if you change the tattoos, though.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 31 at 2014 11:33 AM

2014-03-31T11:33:10-04:00

Personally, I would say that if you have a preexisting tattoo and touch it up or have it filled in then that shouldn't count as a new tattoo. Now, what my personal opinion is and what the Army says are probably not the same thing. To be safe, I would say that if you want the tattoo filled in, you go get it done ASAP, PRIOR to the regulation being officially published. I have a feeling that once your CO does the memo and uploads a photo of the tattoo to your OMPF, then it very well could be considered a new tattoo if you get everything filled in. Its either that or you take the risk of UCMJ for violating the policy.

Response by SGT Ben Keen made Mar 31 at 2014 1:02 PM

2014-03-31T13:02:19-04:00

I think it comes down to how you define "finishing up". I'm currently working on a tattoo of 3 Soldiers in Silhouette (below is a picture of one of them). The 3 figures wrap around my leg. Now, the work on this tattoo started in January, prior to the release of the new AR. I have 4 hours already into it with 2 more hours to go. The "finishing up" I have left isn't expanding the overall size of the tattoo (runs from my new to my ankle); it is just adding a background behind the figures and tightening up the bottom area where the figures are standing. And of course as a Veteran, it is easy for me to say all this because the new AR doesn't apply to me but I would say that if a service member is "finishing up" a tattoo that results in the addition to it's overall size, pushing it beyond the whole "no bigger than your hand" thing than yes, they are violating the AR and should be considered "new work". However, if the Service member has a tattoo and is "finishing it up" but just having the outline colored in, than the service member's tattoo should fall under the grandfathering rules.

Response by CSM Michael Poll made Mar 31 at 2014 3:32 PM

2014-03-31T15:32:07-04:00

My understanding of the reg is that once it is documented any addition will be considered a new tattoo. This subjet is touchy for me as well as I want to touch up mine as well,

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 31 at 2014 8:11 PM

2014-03-31T20:11:03-04:00

Well, I rushed out and endured 6 1/2 hours in the chair to finish mine......Good news for some of us on here; we still got 30 days. Effective Date: 30 April 2014

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 5 at 2014 6:42 PM

2014-04-05T18:42:34-04:00

I have read the new published AR 670-1. All I can see is that below the knee, below the elbow and above the t-shirt neck line are now prohibited(but grandfathered). Can someone please point me in the direction of the "hand rule"? Does the "hand rule" apply to above the elbow, above the knee and below the neck line?

If I want to get a half sleeve is that still authorized as long as it does not go below my elbow? Im looking, but I cant find clear guidance. Thanks

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 17 at 2014 7:36 PM

2014-04-17T19:36:54-04:00

As a DI and having given this update review to several local units, it all comes down to the quantity and the size (not larger than the hand) not the number of colors or adding to the design. If the tatoo has been started and is outlined, the 'professional' thing to do would be to not leave it half finished. Coloring and details within the same tatoo which does not increase the overall size will not be an issue.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 29 at 2014 7:08 AM

2014-04-29T07:08:50-04:00

Well it could be viewed both ways. I would view it like this (playing devils advocate) Oh I see you have a new tattoo inside the lines of that other tattoo you had?! New ink is just that. new ink! Get them filled in or touched up once you leave the military to avoid putting yourself in a bad situation. Like I used to tell my company when I was a 1SG, If you have to ask if it is ok, or you have any doubt that it is OK then it's probably not OK.

Response by SSgt Gregory Guina made Apr 29 at 2014 2:24 PM

2014-04-29T14:24:08-04:00

When the Marine Corps went through this a few years ago I knew a guy that was in the process of having his entire arms sleeved out in tribal. The outlines were there but they were not filled in yet. When he took pictures to have them documented he took a black sharpie and he and his buddies filled in the design. This way he had a picture with the "finished" look. He then proceeded to have the rest of his work filled in.

Response by PO3 Private RallyPoint Member made May 3 at 2014 10:15 PM

2014-05-03T22:15:33-04:00

I know this has been said before (and yes, my comment is going to be slightly off topic, so hold your horses ye down-voters), but this whole tattoo policy is completely absurd. I "get" trying to appear more professional in appearance, but let's be honest, this is just a bit extreme. Tattoos are associated with military, and this sounds like some goon in an office (probably the same one who decided to be an idiot about ethic hair styles) had too much time on his hands, and nothing better to do.

Response by SFC Vernon McNabb made May 3 at 2014 11:40 PM

2014-05-03T23:40:22-04:00

http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/kentucky-guardsman-sues-tattoo-rules-23552865

Well, if this guy gets his wishes, everybody with tattoos can get paid for them...your thoughts?

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