Does it drive anyone else nuts when a junior enlisted soldier says something that is incorrect as to why they don't want to get promoted.

WO1(P) Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 06 Apr 2014 11:12:32 -0400

It happens all the time when someone wants to justify an action they just quote someone that is clearly wrong, but they run with it. Ex: when someone says that 500 promotion points is too difficult to get for E-5 so they wait for them "to come down". This drives me insane, because there is always some justification that makes no sense. No awards, no deployments, no military education to name a few. I hate hearing this excuse.

Response by LTC Jason Strickland made Apr 6 at 2014 11:32 AM

LTC Jason Strickland — Sun, 06 Apr 2014 11:32:30 -0400

Jacob - you're right on track! I always tell my kids: "you gotta earn it!" This applies to the troops you're talking about as well...

Response by SGM Matthew Quick made Apr 6 at 2014 11:55 AM

SGM Matthew Quick — Sun, 06 Apr 2014 11:55:52 -0400

Are you just venting or recommending a course of action for others to validate?

Response by MAJ Bryan Zeski made Apr 6 at 2014 2:43 PM

MAJ Bryan Zeski — Sun, 06 Apr 2014 14:43:06 -0400

I think it shows that the system, in this case, is working as designed.  If a Soldier wants to earn that promotion - they will go get those points.  If they are half-assed Soldiers who want the promotion handed to them without additional work, then they can wait until the Army is ready to promote half-assed efforts (by lowing the points).<div><br></div><div>I don't see it as an "excuse."  That Soldier is telling you, in no uncertain terms, that they are not ready for the responsibility and work required at the next pay-grade.</div>

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 6 at 2014 3:45 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 06 Apr 2014 15:45:39 -0400

It drives me nuts as well especially when there are things that they can do to get more points like college courses etc. You should refer to them as junior enlisted and not lower enlisted. They are junior to you and not lower

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 6 at 2014 4:53 PM

MSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 06 Apr 2014 16:53:55 -0400

Can you change change the Post and Rename it with "Junior Enlisted Soldier". "Lower Enlisted Soldier" is an incorrect term. 

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 8 at 2014 3:00 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 08 Apr 2014 03:00:29 -0400

I think some Soldiers are just nervous about going to the promotion board, or don't understand how the whole process works. If you take the time and interest in them to show them what they have to do and how they can excel they will do it. Those kind of Soldiers just need that push. They may complain about it but will thank you in the end. Then you have the "shammer" types that just want to ride that SPC rank as long as possible, there's no room in the Army for those people. I don't think a Soldier should be made to go to the promotion board just because they have enough time in service. If they don't want to go then it clearly shows they are not ready to become NCOs and lead other Soldiers and they should not be allowed to be recommended to the Promotion Board. The promotion board is a privilege which has to be earned not a right, and its up to us to recommend our Soldiers when they are ready, because we are the ones that will stand in front of that SGM and tell them that our Soldier is ready to become an NCO.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 8 at 2014 8:32 AM

1SG Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 08 Apr 2014 08:32:53 -0400

Wouldn't drive me nuts at all, just shows that they are not ready to take that step in their career. That is provided that you as the leader have counseled them properly and that they fully understand the promotion system.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 8 at 2014 10:43 AM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 08 Apr 2014 10:43:46 -0400

I think that any reason someone doesn't want to get promoted is incorrect. I've heard it all. Common responses are:

"My platoon Sergeant/NCO didn't like me"

"I failed my pt test bc the grader would count xx push-ups... He had it out for me"

"Points are maxed"
- they aren't maxed, just high and require some actual effort

I look at promotion boards as something of a problem. They're necessary but put the Soldier in a position to fully depend on someone else's perception. A Soldier is at the mercy of an NCO for a recommendation. Many if these NCOs are poor leaders to begin with. How can we rely on their recommendation anyway. Many commands don't properly counsel, and Soldiers do get swept under the rug. But for the most part, Soldiers with a p status that don't pick up point are just being lazy. Almost every Soldier I know who falls in this category hasn't maxed their correspondence courses, had a mediocre pt score, or hasn't taken a single college course. These are huge discriminators in the points breakdown. Deployments count for very little in the long run. And unless the cutoff is above 700, they likely are not the reason the Soldier is not getting promoted.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 8 at 2014 10:53 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 08 Apr 2014 10:53:32 -0400

RCP; here they come.

Response by SFC William Swartz Jr made Apr 8 at 2014 10:55 AM

SFC William Swartz Jr — Tue, 08 Apr 2014 10:55:38 -0400

Never bothered me in the least, either you want the rank because you deserve it, so you take the "bull by the horns" or you do not and you piss and moan and make excuses. I always laugh at the "points are too high" comment, I made SSG with 913 points on the old 1000 point scale, if you want it you will go after it and earn it!!

" TREAT 'EM ROUGH!!"

Response by SSG (ret) William Martin made Apr 8 at 2014 1:55 PM

SSG (ret) William Martin — Tue, 08 Apr 2014 13:55:59 -0400

I have heard soldiers say they were "scuffed up" because a few soldiers in the squad were late and if mass punishment is something that happens in the Army, they don't want to be an NCO. I tell them that is the reason to be an NCO; become an NCO only scuff up the ones who are constantly late and not the whole squad.

Response by CW2 Jonathan Kantor made Apr 8 at 2014 2:23 PM

CW2 Jonathan Kantor — Tue, 08 Apr 2014 14:23:12 -0400

Here's something that has always pissed me off: An E-4 who doesn't want to get promoted to E-5 because they are planning on getting out anyways. When someone says that to me, I just see them as lazy and without ambition. It's one of my biggest pet peeves.