Do you believe the military should do away with the "protected class"?

2017-01-04T03:28:56-05:00

So do you believe the militaries "protected class" policy is detrimental to the services? Especially now that there is such a push to put women in combat.

Response by Capt Seid Waddell made Jan 4 at 2017 3:41 AM

2017-01-04T03:41:05-05:00

If it means what it sounds like it means, it is detrimental to military effectiveness. I'm old school and we didn't have that concept in the military back then.

Response by 1stSgt Eugene Harless made Jan 4 at 2017 3:56 AM

2017-01-04T03:56:53-05:00

What exactly is/are this protective class you are speaking of? I remember way back when the "protective class" was supposedly the ring knockers from the service academies who were given the better assignments and had miscues covered up or overlooked so they would have a god career.
From the tone of the post I'm guessing that it's something that many old timers may feel, that gender, race, ethnicity, religion and sexual orientation may play a part in commanders being hesitant to discipline service members or pass them over for promotion due to concern over being pegged as a racist, misogynist, homophobe or Islamophobe.
Since Trump's election there has also been a great concern among these same groups of people that it's going to be "open season" on them.
I think its a huge can of worms, and I just hope it will be as should be, the most capable people getting the awards, promotion and retention.
I feel that no matter what there will be those who are prejudiced who will screw over capable people due to their own bigotry, and also a number of those who are substandard performers who will throw the SJW card when they don't get an outcome they desire.

Response by CPT Mark Gonzalez made Jan 4 at 2017 7:53 AM

2017-01-04T07:53:36-05:00

Are you talking about medical, jag or other officers with training adso's that they won't chapter? People that refer to asap only once selected for a UA? Or are you talking about people that fall into a special categories like being transgender, where they are given a pass for political reasons? Define protected please.

Response by Col Joseph Lenertz made Jan 4 at 2017 8:28 AM

2017-01-04T08:28:51-05:00

I am unaware of a protected class.

Response by PO2 Robert Aitchison made Jan 4 at 2017 8:57 AM

2017-01-04T08:57:22-05:00

Absolutely not, too many people are still prejudiced (knowingly or unknowingly). As long as people are imperfect we will need rules to ensure that we treat each other fairly.

Response by CPO Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 4 at 2017 8:59 AM

2017-01-04T08:59:39-05:00

Need more info, because form what i see of late anyone is on the chopping block. Officers being relived for bad Command Climate Surveys, and Senior Enlisted Leaders fired for enforcing old style discipline (Yelling at troops in public) so I would say protective class is Social Justice gone wrong.

Response by SFC George Smith made Jan 4 at 2017 9:19 AM

2017-01-04T09:19:03-05:00

I have never heard of a Protected Class...
there was Combat ... guy who got down dirty and shot...
Combat support... those who passed beans and Bullets and took the grunts into harms way...
Combat service support... those who fixed the Grunts and what the Grunts Broke and the machines the Combat support got AFU...
The only ones I remember as protected were the Folks in the Nose Bleed sections and the ones who Prayed ... "Twinkle Twinkle little Shield, keep me off the Battle field"...

Response by LTC Tom Jones made Jan 4 at 2017 12:57 PM

2017-01-04T12:57:15-05:00

Understand that the Civil Rights Act of 1964 established "protective class" status based on:
age, pregnancy, national origin, race, ethnic background, religious beliefs and sexual orientation. That is, any person or persons experiencing discrimination "in a public workplace" based on any of the foregoing has a right to legal redress. Some (few) States have expanded this set to include "gender" as well as some other classifications. A JAG Officer would be more knowledgeable as to whether our military policy in regard to gender based "protective status" has been codified. Given the direction we have been taking, not sure that it makes a difference as we are, by policy, headed in the direction of women in combat (original question)--which to my apparently outdated way of thinking is a very dumb thing.

Response by CAPT Kevin B. made Jan 4 at 2017 2:12 PM

2017-01-04T14:12:44-05:00

There have been examples of protected demographics. I wouldn't say "class". For a long time at the Nurse promotion boards, they had a profile of the number of men who must be promoted. That related to the men only Fleet Marine Force billets at the time. So we'd see better qualified women get sent home in favor of lesser performing and capable men. I'd hope that is well in the past, but would need a current MIL to weigh in. I also noted that the Chaplain boards could be very emotional because it's hard to unload some denominational baggage. We also had a period where YG-76-77 got hammered in the Civil Engineer Corps. They brought in about 80 Line-Staff transfers with Surface Warfare badges. The board was heavily tilted to promoting those. So if you were 9-10 years active in the CEC, your first look promotion opportunity to O-4 was 13%. Next year it was 17%. By then all 80 pushbuttons were done.

I sat a number of boards. There wasn't a race, gender, etc. requirement, but there were draconian processes that dealt with it. There's been a female and minority requirement for some time as members of the board. I know a great lady who was also Hispanic. She was a frequent fixture in Millington as we killed two birds with one stone. In any case, I came into doing boards during the time of transition out of draconian. It used to be a separate process was utilized prior to the board reporting out that would directly compare the minority/woman/whatever record to the lowest record in the select group. The Board would have to generate a separate report on why the answer is the answer. During my time, that requirement was pared back greatly in that the Board membership would have a discussion of the demographics so the senior member could include in their brief up that there wasn't an inappropriate bias, etc. I'm dated so don't know how it's handled now.

That old process always disturbed me as I know a few minority officers who were passed over. They'd wonder why. I just couldn't bring myself to talk to them about that process that essentially said "What is it about Hell No don't you understand!" Interesting thing is they didn't care to stay in on the reserve side because they didn't want to go that direction for a number of reasons, most of them painful. I'm proud of the work we did on our Staff Boards. At least for us, we kept it very clean. That's why it would be so painful personally at times working so hard to stick the landing on the precepts. Don't get me going on precepts. They've morphed greatly over time as well.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 4 at 2017 4:30 PM

2017-01-04T16:30:16-05:00

I'm lost. What is a "protected class?"

Response by SSG Roger Ayscue made Jan 4 at 2017 5:35 PM

2017-01-04T17:35:42-05:00

I do, without a doubt. It allows factors other than performance and ability to be used to determine promotions.
NOTHING but performance should be considered at all for performance or awards.