Do you believe that all people are afforded the same opportunity for success with the proper work ethic?

SGT Darryl Allen — Thu, 04 Jun 2015 20:21:56 -0400

Came across an interesting little cartoon that sheds an interesting light on a hotbed topic all over social media. What do you think of the concept of privilege? Do you think that people who are handed life on a silver platter are less deserving of their accomplishments than a person that starts off on the right side of this panel and ends up on the left?

Do you think that everyone that starts their life on the right side of the panel COULD make it to the left side with the right work ethic or are some people doomed to be on the right side forever?

http://thewireless.co.nz/articles/the-pencilsword-on-a-plate

The Pencilsword: On a plate

A short story about privilege. By Toby Morris.

Response by Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS made Jun 4 at 2015 8:30 PM

Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS — Thu, 04 Jun 2015 20:30:22 -0400

In the US, everyone is afforded a High School education. Everyone is afforded the chance at a college education. We have commissioning programs to go from enlisted to officer. I know several of our COLs are former SGTs. There is no Right/Left side.

Response by MAJ Robert (Bob) Petrarca made Jun 4 at 2015 8:44 PM

MAJ Robert (Bob) Petrarca — Thu, 04 Jun 2015 20:44:52 -0400

In some respect, who you know can still out weigh what you know. Even with a great work ethic, you can be overlooked. The infamous, "you're too valuable too us where you are" is just one of several lines I've been handed. Another is "you don't have enough experience" Worked a job for 2 years, had 2 great reviews and pay raises, was ready to take a management position and the boss at the 11th hour thought it was better to bring in someone from the outside. How do you spell BS?

Response by Cpl Jeff N. made Jun 4 at 2015 9:05 PM

Cpl Jeff N. — Thu, 04 Jun 2015 21:05:20 -0400

We have equality of opportunity not equality of outcome here. Anyone can make it from a tough start to a good life, maybe not to the very top but some do. The cartoon is the "life isn't fair" scenario. If parents are not involved with their kids early and don't encourage them to get a good education of trade then they can get sideways quickly.

Knowing people can help but it is no silver bullet. You still have to perform in most cases. This is also classic class warfare technique. Lot's of people have it hard and do well. Life isn't just about how much money you make but we put a lot of focus on it these days.

Response by MAJ Ken Landgren made Jun 4 at 2015 9:16 PM

MAJ Ken Landgren — Thu, 04 Jun 2015 21:16:11 -0400

Not always because there is chance in our lives that makes it non-linear at times.

Response by Capt Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 5 at 2015 12:20 AM

Capt Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 05 Jun 2015 00:20:20 -0400

There are definitely advantages to be from a wealthier and better educated family. I don't think there is anything wrong with that though. In the U.S. everyone is afforded an education through highschool and even if that school is subpar students can work hard and better themselves. When I'm a parent I want to be able to set my children up for success. I worked hard to be able to send them to good schools, get them tutors and to set them up with my connections. If the next guy didn't work hard, or just didn't end up as well off as me, should he get the same benefits that I get. No not in my opinion.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 5 at 2015 2:39 AM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 05 Jun 2015 02:39:33 -0400

I will say that is this foolish. I am sternly against this class warfare. I have heard so many times that I grew up with a silver spoon in my mouth or that I don't understand what it was like to be poor. I understood it better than they did. That is why I am not that way anymore. My father came to the US and didn't speak any English. He didn't let that stop him. He is pretty well off now. I didn't realize I was poor until one day we were going to school and we found our station wagon on cinder blocks. My wife thought I was joking when I took her to my old house. But I had one thing that all of them lack, Ambition. My ambition far exceeds all of those that only complain about this. Not everyone who is rich is born rich. Some work hard. They get up at 5 am to get to work so they could get to their second job by noon, so they they could go to college at night. That is what I am talking about. I joined the military because I really didn't see a way attain my goals where I was at. I stepped out of my comfort zone. To many are to cowardly to do that. They want to get money on their terms. I heard it when I was a manager. I am tired of those who think they are disenfranchised. I had a guy tell me that I got everything handed to me thanks to the military. I let him know that served my country in Iraq twice and earned what I have. He could do it too but he was too cowardly to try. Back to my point that they have no ambition. They want money and to party on the weekend but they don't want to wake up early and stay up late to better themselves. For that they will always be where they are at and complaining how it is not their fault.

Response by SGT Kevin Brown made Jun 5 at 2015 12:50 PM

SGT Kevin Brown — Fri, 05 Jun 2015 12:50:49 -0400

Even though I am Catholic, when it comes to work ethic, business, income class and "privilege" I am an Objectavist (the Ayn Rand type). I grew up poor as hell, was even homeless for some years, took a lot of licks in life and I am busting my ass off every day to make a company I started grow to the level of making me a wealthy man. With that said, I do not resent the man who is already there or was born into that lifestyle because I am not him. I see so much "entitlement" and "privilege" speak going on today that it makes me sick, if you were born poor you work for what you have or you develop something that will make it so you never have to work again. The American dream is not a white house and a white picket fence for every one, it is the innovative means of getting there and the pursuit of those things (happiness). Our country is founded on innovation, thrived under innovation and is falling apart because the lack of innovators left in this country. This may sound cruel, but I say let those bitching about privilege and wealth equality keep on bitching because at least they are out of my way and not in competition with me on achieving the American dream.

I spent years serving others as a mental health worker and social worker. I tried the all for one concept. What I learned is that unless the other party reciprocates equally (such as in the military with fighting for your buddy on your left and right), more often then not it is a losing battle. Regardless of what you believe, we are all humans, we all came into this world the same way and we will all die someday. How you react to what happens in between is on you; you can either choose to hope or demand that someone will give you the fish, learn to fish for yourself or you can go out and start your own fishing enterprise. Just saying.

Response by SSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 5 at 2015 12:59 PM

SSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 05 Jun 2015 12:59:53 -0400

It is a highly partisan thread because advantages are going to happen regardless of inspiration and cannot answer to how two people with identical backgrounds yield different results. Not all achievers do so because of their parents or because they have a car at 16.

Response by Sgt Jay Jones made Jun 5 at 2015 3:12 PM

Sgt Jay Jones — Fri, 05 Jun 2015 15:12:27 -0400

The problem is not the two families scenarios as depicted. The true issue is how are those families and children perceived by society. If the teacher believes that the family on the right is less deserving she may not put on as much effort as she would with the family on the left. I am a firm believer in the Pygmalion Effect. If some believes in you, you rise to their expectations.

We also have to remember there is no guarantee for success. How many times have you seen children from good homes and great parents turn out horrible, while some from the most deplorable conditions excel.

Basically being a parent is a crapshoot!

Response by SrA Edward Vong made Jun 5 at 2015 3:47 PM

SrA Edward Vong — Fri, 05 Jun 2015 15:47:30 -0400

I am going to have to say, that even with all the hard work, not growing up privileges may give you some limitations on how far you may go. That doesn't mean one won't be successful it will be a different journey, and the obstacles may be different, while the privileged ones have an easier time obtaining that top role.

I grew up privileged, however, I left that to choose my own interests, create my own networks, and write my own legacy. So far I am doing well, however, had I not left to pursue my own interests, I know I would be much further in my career and life than I am now. But that wasn't what I wanted.

So in conclusion, being privileged helps a lot, but one is able to obtain success without.

Response by COL Charles Williams made Jun 5 at 2015 10:53 PM

COL Charles Williams — Fri, 05 Jun 2015 22:53:17 -0400

Yes I do. Hard work and work ethic is noticed and rewarded. I also believe those of us who are less fortunate, like to make a excuses about why we can't get what we think we deserve.... Verses making it happen. Success comes to those who work for it. No officer has any advantage because of commissioning source or background. It is about what you bring to the table.

The beauty of the United States Military, at least the Army, is you are bound only by yourself.

In HS I earned and college hockey scholarship, but since I liked hockey, girls, and parties more than class, I was on academic probation after 1 year, so I joined the Army as an E-1.

I am the son of single mom, who worked several jobs to provide for us, so I was essentially on my own. I have no idea what white privilege means.

For me, The Army was a perfect fit. From the get go I was a driven.

The opportunities, in my view, we're and are unlimited. The only limitation is you. Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 5 at 2015 11:55 PM

MAJ Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 05 Jun 2015 23:55:01 -0400

I believe this with every fiber of my being. It is the story of America; it is the story of who I am. I've been judged more than once on due to nothing more than my skin color and my rank. Yes, there are those who have assumed that I was born a Commissioned Officer, born to a life of privilege and status. Ha! Nothing could be further from the truth!

I was born in the Minnesota cornfields. My Dad was an over-the-road trucker, so I spent most of my time stuck in a small town with my Mom and two sisters. We weren't poor per se, but we were far from flush; any little downturn in the economy tends to slow the big wheels of an eighteen-wheeler, and if those wheels weren't turning, things got tight in a hurry. We seldom dined out, took vacations, went to movies, or many of the activities my kids now take for granted. If something broke, we repaired it. If we couldn't repair it, we made do with out it until we could afford to replace it. I was no stranger to junk yards and pulling replacement parts from junked cars and trucks! When my Dad came home off the road, that didn't mean it was time to relax; that meant it was time to pull maintenance on his truck and get it ready for his next run. Only then could he relax!

School was hard for me at first. I had a learning disability in math, and let's just say that the 70's were still the dark ages when it came to having a learning disability. As a result, I got stuck in all the slow classes, which sucked, because they never challenged me, so I slacked off. A lot! None of my teachers ever expected anything out of me, so I lowered myself to their expectations. In hindsight, that was a stupid thing to do, but what did I know at the time? When I graduated HS, I knew I wanted an Army career; and an Army career I would have.

I was set to ship a week after graduation, but an injury in a HS baseball play-off game derailed my plans. It would take me nearly 6 months before the MEPS DRs would agree to see me again, so I enrolled in a Community College and took some classes. I astounded everyone by making the Dean's List my first Semester. Well, I astounded everyone but myself; I always knew I could do it, it was just refreshing to be in a new environment with professors who were willing to challenge and push me, unlike all of the teachers in my small school system who never did. I knew I was still going to the Army, but first I opted to get my Associate's Degree, thanks to the Pell Grant I had qualified for. Good call!

After three years of Enlisted service, I loved the Army. I decided I wanted to be an Officer. So, I went back, finished off college and earned my Commission via ROTC. While in college, I realized there was more to life than just the Army, so I opted to serve in the USAR. I have worked in legislative politics, sales, marketing, and education as well as my career as an MP and trainer in the USAR. I have deployed a few times and lead Soldiers to War. I've had great days and incredibly shitty days, but the only easy day I've ever had was yesterday. I've worked my ass off to get where I am and for what I and my family now enjoy as a result. Nobody merely handed me a God-Damned thing, except for a few ass chewings and a whole lot of second-guessing.

I could have chosen the easy route; I could have stayed back home, never going anywhere in life. I have a cousin who did that. Guess what? He's the first one to whine about how unfair life is, how the Government never helps out "guys like us." He gets really pissed if I point out that yes, the Government does help out guys like us, so long as we're willing to help it out in return!

As I type this, I'm looking around my comfortable home, at my Awards on the wall, at the many things my wife and I have been able to acquire and accumulate together, and at all of the crap my teenage kids love to leave strewn about the place, but never pick up. It's all more than I envisioned it would be! I am thankful that I was instilled with the work ethic to make it all happen!