Can you flag for APFT fauilure during deployment?

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 26 Jan 2014 01:05:17 -0500

So there is an NCO I know that has allways had an APFT issue particularly the run. He seems to only be able to pass when he wants to see favorable action. He has been administered 5 record APFT during this deployment about 25 days apart with remedial PT in between when able (our optempo is very slow with plenty of time for PT). Now its the end of the rating period and im trying to figure out whether I can or cant flag him or if i even need to because it seems as if I will have to put needs much improvment in that block. If anyone has any advice or thoughts on the situation it's welcomed

Response by CW2 Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 26 at 2014 6:10 AM

CW2 Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 26 Jan 2014 06:10:21 -0500

I'm currently deployed and have a soldier in another platoon that has failed a PT test. From guidance from our 1sg the soldier should not be flagged due to the fact that we are deployed.after he failed he then got a profile. In my view if an NCO fails a PT test and you give him a goal on his NCOER support form for PT and doesn't meet your standard I would put Needs improvement. As an NCO, we should be leading from the front and helping soldier pass their pt test, not the other way around.

Response by CW2 Joseph Evans made Jan 26 at 2014 6:43 AM

CW2 Joseph Evans — Sun, 26 Jan 2014 06:43:05 -0500

Last I checked, adverse actions related to APFT during deployment were a NO-GO. Still, get with your 1SG and discuss how he feels this should be handled, since you will need him to support you on whatever action you decide to pursue.
My recommendation is consider an administrative reduction for failing to set an appropriate example as an NCO of the appropriate rank. Write the NCOER in such a way that the needs improvement bullets aren't necessarily tied to a "debatable" Record APFT. The reason for this isn't that the NCO was not provided adequate time to PT, but most down range locations lack an appropriate running course "free of debris and hazards" on which to conduct the two-mile run. Also, your CDR can consider a bar to re-enlistment as an option to a flag.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 26 at 2014 8:40 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 26 Jan 2014 08:40:30 -0500

I agree with Mr. Evans. Run this up to the 1SG and maybe the CSM. Just remember, YOU can't flag or bar anyone, you can only recommend, but the sooner your command team is tracking an issue like this, the better. Make sure you counsel this NCO on the possible outcomes of failing APFT's. It will be very important to have a paper trail no matter which direction this goes.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 26 at 2014 10:08 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 26 Jan 2014 22:08:50 -0500

1/58 chaptered people for separation for pt failure while deployed. It is the commander's decision, by all means the NCO can recommend for the flag so at least there is paperwork but each commander decidess the fate of their troops

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 26 at 2014 10:27 PM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 26 Jan 2014 22:27:28 -0500

There is NO regulation that prohibits flagging action while deployed. Might be a BN or Company 'policy'…but that's about it. Is your CoC aware of his pattern?

Response by SGM Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 1 at 2014 11:16 AM

SGM Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 01 Feb 2014 11:16:00 -0500

SSG Lane,

As stated below ALARACT 163/2003 states that physical fitness should be conducted while deployed if mission allows. That being said ensure that you give a Record APFT IAW FM 7-22. If the Soldier fails it then it is your obligation to initiate a flag. Whether or not the commander signs off on the flag is up to him. Do not ever feel bad about putting a needs improvement on an NCOER if that is what the Soldier rates. We write our own NCOERS by our actions, be fair and impartial. Ensure that you talk with that Soldier and let him know the courses of action you are taking it might be enough for him/her to start making necessary changes.